Need Real Estate Advise (San Francisco, Oakland: middle-class, for sale, sublet)

[Jolly BG]

Hey guys,

So I am one of many who is considering a transplant from LA. I've been to SF many times, at least 4 times a year. Plus my brother attended the Academy of Arts. I also have a handful of friends living up there. I am looking to move but do not want to rent. I want to buy a house. I'm willing to invest up to 400k for now. After reading the last 24 pages of this forum, I gathered that Rockridge, Claremont, Berkeley, Temescal are good places to live. I prefer the suburbs full of trees (haha), as well a places that has cold weather. I am really sick of hot weather. I hear Walnut Creek is a good location as well, but weather is too mild for me. Ideally, my preferred location would be somewhere somewhat quiet, but close to nightlife; towards the hills where its more woodsy, but weather has to be in the 80s at highest (except for those freak heat waves); I would like to have a backyard and would like to have at least 1000 sq foot of house. What do you guys suggest? Since I'm young (nearing mid 20s) I would also consider condos or townhouses if the location is right. Thanks in advance.

Edit: A couple of things I've forgot to mention.. I am considering going back to school for MBA at Berkeley. By woodsy, I don't mean forest just lots of trees. I would prefer 2+ bedrooms as this will also be a investment property.

[artemis78]

Temescal is a great place to live, but it is *not* suburban---it is quite urban in nature. Much of Rockridge is, as well (except for Upper Rockridge). And while Oakland/Berkeley gets cooler weather than some parts of the Bay Area, it's by no means cold---wintertime lows are typically 40ish, with the occasional freeze. Coming from LA, that may meet your cold requirements though!

Claremont, Upper Rockridge, the Berkeley hills, etc. all meet your requirements---but even in this down market, $400K will not buy you a 1000sf single-family home with a yard there. Not even close.

I'd suggest seriously considering condos, especially given your age. People who buy houses in those neighborhoods of Oakland are often buying for the schools, and they're willing to pay a tremendous amount (try $1M+ for a place in good shape!) But they're typically not competing in the condo market. You can buy condos in Upper Rockridge for mid-high 300s, for instance. There are several large condo developments in the hills, and then lots of individual units or fourplexes that have been converted. See if there are condos or townhomes available in Montclair, which sounds like it could also be right up your alley. There are also be units along the Piedmont/Oakland border, some of which might be woodsy enough for you while still being close to night life. You could also consider areas like the El Cerrito Hills, which don't have the same school pressure on home prices but have a similar feel. A little further from nightlife, but might be a tradeoff for the trees.

Good luck!

[Jolly BG]

thanks artemis.

Condos and townhouses are probably the way to go. When I save enough I'll probably get into the SFRs. Plus, typically the communities (condos) have community pools for summer time. 40s is low enough, despite wanting to live in a city with all FOUR SEASONS, including snow! What are the zip codes of the cities you are recommending?

[Jolly BG]

I've decided to hold out on owning my ideal fixer upper in Berkeley since all the single family homes I've seen (online) that I liked were around the 700-800k range. I am willing to compromise location, but not the weather. I'd still prefer suburb and proximity to downtown SF. What are some new neighborhoods that I should take a look at? Maybe north/west Oakland? Peninsula? Alameda? Any suggestions? I would prefer a moderate to low crime area. I have been exposed to crime, so nothing can phase me (especially when your next door neighbor gangster has a shoot out withe the police in front of your house and the bullet goes through your room!).

[hsw]

Would rent (esp in this economy/credit environment) one of the many new condos in SF's SoMa...

Not clear buying real est is one's best investment or cheapest approach to shelter for a young single....

SF has some of most temperate weather in region; greatest concentration of young professionals (many who work in SV choose to live in SF, despite the 40-60mi each-way drive).....Peninsula suburbs nr PaloAlto are prob great for affluent families but suck for singles....

EastBay is SF's quite mockable bridge and tunnel region: Oak and suburbs along 80/880 corridor are SF region's most prominent crime/poverty corridor; Berkeley is one of world's socialist and hygiene-free zones; and 680 corridor is SF's version of LA's SFV: aspirational middle-class w/SFV-like heat, smog and awful, slow traffic to escape to anywhere relevant....

[artemis78]

You may want to think about whether proximity to downtown SF or suburban feel is more important, since you can get semi-surburban with good proximity, or you can get very suburban with poor proximity, but not very suburban with good proximity. Assuming, as you noted before, that you might wind up in grad school at Berkeley, I'd pick a place you won't necessarily have to move from, which pretty much means East Bay. There are lots of great places to choose from, and I'd recommend visiting them before making any judgments. If you go by the newspaper, Oakland is full of murderers and Berkeley is full of treesitters, but in reality both cities are much more diverse (as are cities everywhere), so it's just a matter of finding your niche.

My picks for semi-suburban feel with good proximity to both downtown SF and UC Berkeley would be: North Berkeley (94707), Berkeley Hills (94708), parts of Claremont/Elmwood (94705), and parts of Rockridge (94618). Consider whether having a BART station is important (other neighborhoods are connected by buses that take you to SOMA, but some just run during commute hours). There are many other suburbanish neighborhoods in Oakland and over the hills in Lamorinda, but none with especially good access to downtown Berkeley unless you plan to drive. The other parts of Berkeley tend to be more urban-feeling, but honestly you should come walk around. What's suburban to me may not be suburban to you, and you might find, for instance, that you like parts of Central Berkeley fine.

As a word to the wise, if you live in Silicon Valley and commute daily to Berkeley you will not have much fun. People do it, but generally not voluntarily.....

[Jolly BG]

You guys are right. I should explore the area first. Maybe I should rent short term, then condo, then house. Then again I would like my own personal space, so I might just bypass renting and go straight to the condo since I hate giving away money. Better to put it towards an investment. Again, the condos in Berkeley are too expensive for the space and rooms. I would like to be within the vicinity with UC Berkeley being the center. I don't mind going on a tangent route to downtown San Francisco on the weekends. Why are most of the real estate for sale near Ashby? Is there something wrong with that street?

[alohakat]

Ashby is a busy street that is often used as a freeway-alternative surface street. It goes from near the Claremont Hotel down to the freeway near the water. You can actually look at it --

Did you know that Google Maps now has a street view function? Any piece of real estate you are looking at in a well-populated area like Ashby Ave can be seen not only from satellite view, but click on street view too to see what it looks like from the street, then "walk yourself" down the street and around corners if you want. Don't know if my link to Ashby will work, but here goes:

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=...-8&sa=N&tab=wl

edit: I see you need to zoom in, then click on the Street View tab, put the "little guy" on the street you want to see and click and drag him around for a walk - Once you are on the center yellow line on any street (Google's yellow line, not the street's yellow line), hold down your left click and you can nearly "drive" down the street. You can see how Ashby changes as you head from West to East.

[artemis78]

Ashby runs the length of Berkeley, so lots of the city is near it, but more specifically, if you're looking at condos there are lots of condos and condo conversions on Ashby because it's a busy street, and thus less popular for families. I wouldn't live on Ashby itself (and especially I wouldn't buy on Ashby itself) but I lived a block away from it very happily for a couple of years. You may find a unit in a fourplex in areas like the Elmwood that would be a good plan---even with the down market there will always be demand for good properties in that area because of the university, which is bad news for you as a renter but good news as a potential buyer.

I think your rent-condo-house plan is a good one. Don't skip the renting stage, since at the very least you will want to sublet for a few months so you can go out to look at properties as they come on the market. It will also take a month or so to close on a place once you find one. Plus, you'll know for sure if you like the feel of a neighborhood before you invest in it, and you can check out a place at night, on weekends, etc., to see if there are any problems with neighbors or the like. For both renting and condos, try to give yourself at least a mile's berth around UCB---too close to the university and prices are pretty inflated because of the students (plus you may wind up surrounded by undergrads).


Good luck!

[sonarrat]

I'm pretty sure you could get a nice condo in a woodsy part of Oakland or Orinda on your budget, or even a starter house in Oakland's Redwood Heights (94619 ZIP above MacArthur). It would be an easy drive on Hwy 13 to Berkeley.