TSHTF scenario has hit the mainstream (light, natural, mountain, emergency)

[Mac_Muz]

Originally Posted by stepka

Also, trying to decide if anyone would let me in if I didn't already have an escape plan. A plumpie, a little lazy, and a distractible brain are the faults. OTOH, can stay calm in emergency, have researched and used herbs for healing for years and even have the knowledge to distill essential oils. Can cook from scratch-scratch, meaning I can even make basic things like crackers and cheese and bread. Have milked cows and goats, though not on any kind of regular schedule. Know how to ferment vegetables to preserve them and add vitamin content and can prepare chicken from live to the pot. Can do basic knitting and sewing--can stitch a strong seam by hand-- and have lived in tents and sleeping on the ground for months at a time. Have done some gardening though not very good at it. Have a nice sized library of books about self-sufficiency. I'm thinking the handiest one will be The One Straw Revolution. How about the rest of you? AFter I write this it doesn't look like much though I could be forgetting stuff.

If it matters any i would let you in too. Nice list of skill set IMO. My wife can also do much of that..

Another most often missed part of the topic is females tend to need a female companion at times not that men don't, but females tend to be more social historically speaking and this is a part of the why females will work and face one another to chat if they can, as they can when they can.

Men tend to not require this same attitude and are more content side by side at a some distance, perhaps working as a group as hunters still drive game this way.

As so called modern as man would try to claim these days he has become, I always find that very debatable

Which brings to mind the fussissykated will just die. When you get to that mind set nothing is good enough..

I saw that mind set coming from poor people with out a bucket or a window to throw the bucket out of right after katrina.

One not need be filthy stinking rich to feel 'entitled'.

On a survivable event, those with a work aversion, that refuse to pull their pants up and put their best work boots on are gonna die.

I am sorry to say my crystal ball took a dove off the table and while before it was just cracked now it's busted and so i can't tell anyone what or when any of this will come to pass......

All I can tell is the simple facts are it's just a matter of time. So sometime between this instant and a couple billion years we are totally screwed...

[monkeywrenching]

something else that people have to take into account for is the time of year. if TSHTF in the beginning of winter, then almost 90% of the USA will be up the creek without a paddle.
most people are not prepared for living in the winter without basic services and really have no foodstuffs put back.
those that do will tend to hoard what they have and not feed strangers, even if they have excess.

give winter a few weeks to set in in the north and nobody is going to get much at all from those that live in rural areas.

if it happens any other time people will have to make do with what they can, do it in the summer and hopefully get some food out of a garden that people can survive on. I hope people have some heirloom seeds. thats non genmod for those that dont know different.

[BuiltforSin]

Originally Posted by stepka

I think I've always thought that TS would HTF in my lifetime but most people have been clueless up until recently and I got into a most interesting conversation with some co-workers today about what we would all do in an emergency. I found out to my surprise that several have family farms that they can retreat to (if anyone will let them in with so many mouths to feed) and several have skills that could keep them working in a lawless world. Anyone else having these conversations with formerly head-in-the-sand types? Or maybe they've been thinking this all along as well but didn't talk about it for fear of appearing to be nutjobs. Like we are.

The only particular skill I have that could come in handy is I'm an EMT, and I do have some knowledge in Wilderness EMT skills. I do not own a firearm at the moment, but I will be purchasing one soon.

Now that that's out of the way here is how I theorize about how I would survive if SHTF.
- The first thing I would do is break up with my gf. This would be really hard to do and accept, but in terms of survival and what I have planned it would have to be done. I'm sure she would want to be with her family as well.
- I'm keeping the dog!
- Next I would try to gather my immediate family [mom,dad,etc.] to one location bringing all supplies they had [weapons,food,water,supplies,etc.]
- At this point a week or so will have gone by, and I would use this week to figure out whether we're going to stay and rough it out, or realize everything is in shambles and the best thing to do is to flee for greener pastures.
- If we stay, then it's self explanatory what we would do in order to survive. I'd try to be self sustaining, but more than likely we would have to venture out, and scavenge for other resources and supplies.
- If we leave, then the best idea I can think of now is to try to flee for the Mex/US border.

More than likely borders will be seized and blocked so #1 is the most realistic plan of action in this case. It's crazy to think of, but it's good to be prepared. I hope I don't see the day, but I feel like mentally I'm prepared for it.

[=^..^=]

Originally Posted by countryboy73

I believe God will help those in need- usually after we have done all we can do for ourselves.

Not to turn this into a religious thread, but don't count on it. God doesn't help the starving during droughts in Africa (where millions die/have died) and other places,... or those starving and freezing to death due to wars. Manna from heaven never appears. It's better to set all those beliefs aside and plan to take care of yourself and your needs should the SHTF.

[MTSilvertip]

Originally Posted by stepka

Also, trying to decide if anyone would let me in if I didn't already have an escape plan. A plumpie, a little lazy, and a distractible brain are the faults. OTOH, can stay calm in emergency, have researched and used herbs for healing for years and even have the knowledge to distill essential oils. Can cook from scratch-scratch, meaning I can even make basic things like crackers and cheese and bread. Have milked cows and goats, though not on any kind of regular schedule. Know how to ferment vegetables to preserve them and add vitamin content and can prepare chicken from live to the pot. Can do basic knitting and sewing--can stitch a strong seam by hand-- and have lived in tents and sleeping on the ground for months at a time. Have done some gardening though not very good at it. Have a nice sized library of books about self-sufficiency. I'm thinking the handiest one will be The One Straw Revolution. How about the rest of you? AFter I write this it doesn't look like much though I could be forgetting stuff.

Knowledge of medical plants, distilling oils, cooking and preserving skills, sewing, some animal husbandry and gardening skills, all are valuable and could get you a spot in a survivors settlement.
If you know how to knit, learning to weave and make blankets and cloth wouldn't be difficult for you. By extension, perhaps learning to spin wool or fibers into threads would be a good skill for you.

Most folks would like to be lazy, the current culture encourages it, but when you are hungry, you find motivation

I don't think you would have any problem being accepted into a group or tribe or whatever there is in a survival situation.
A medicine woman is always useful

[Mac_Muz]

Originally Posted by MTSilvertip

Knowledge of medical plants, distilling oils, cooking and preserving skills, sewing, some animal husbandry and gardening skills, all are valuable and could get you a spot in a survivors settlement.
If you know how to knit, learning to weave and make blankets and cloth wouldn't be difficult for you. By extension, perhaps learning to spin wool or fibers into threads would be a good skill for you.

Most folks would like to be lazy, the current culture encourages it, but when you are hungry, you find motivation

I don't think you would have any problem being accepted into a group or tribe or whatever there is in a survival situation.
A medicine woman is always useful

Yup that's me today.... lazy. i should be outside breaking trail, but instead here i sit playin' keyboard commando, and i just spent MONEY! Not too bad, just a 12 x 12 nylon tarp...

Tarps are what dreams are made of....

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by stepka

Also, trying to decide if anyone would let me in if I didn't already have an escape plan. A plumpie, a little lazy, and a distractible brain are the faults. OTOH, can stay calm in emergency, have researched and used herbs for healing for years and even have the knowledge to distill essential oils....

You just took the first step toward Survival. You are now 90% ahead of everyone else.

The first step is always a self-inventory of strengths and weaknesses. Everyone has some of both. The second step is to see if you can use your strengths to eliminate or reduce your weaknesses/limitations. If you cannot, then try working directly on eliminating or reducing your weaknesses/limitations. And if you cannot do that, then focus on expanding your strengths.

Originally Posted by stepka

I think I've always thought that TS would HTF in my lifetime but most people have been clueless up until recently and I got into a most interesting conversation with some co-workers today about what we would all do in an emergency. I found out to my surprise that several have family farms that they can retreat to (if anyone will let them in with so many mouths to feed) and several have skills that could keep them working in a lawless world. Anyone else having these conversations with formerly head-in-the-sand types? Or maybe they've been thinking this all along as well but didn't talk about it for fear of appearing to be nutjobs. Like we are.

Originally Posted by stepka

Yeah so, building off my last post--think of a likely lifeboat scenario. Would they let you in? Why would they? Will they be more likely to let fat or thin people in? After all, fats can live off their stores for awhile but thins would starve and run out of energy sooner. Or would they? Fats would be getting thinner and more energetic while thins would be getting thinner and less energetic. Maybe.

You're jumping ahead a bit prematurely.

The 3rd step is to calculate the local die-off.....so you can have a sense of how bad it will be.

You live in a county...in some State....and that county has a population, and it also may have acres of cropland and orchards....or nothing at all.

You can find that info right here on City-Data. The information for your county will look something like this (hopefully)....

Corn for grain: 3347 harvested acres
All wheat for grain: 660 harvested acres
Soybeans for beans: 5267 harvested acres
Vegetables: 418 harvested acres
Land in orchards: 138 acres

Let's add all that up....and we get....(survey says)....9,830 acres.

1.5 acres of land will feed 1 person a diet of 1,600 calories per day for an entire year...in theory.

Depending on your exact circumstances -- where you live, what you grow, and other factors --- you might be able to knock that down to 1.25 acres per person, or perhaps even 1 acre per person,...or you might need 1.75 acres or even 2 acres per person, but you should be just a wee bit conservative in your estimates, so you don't starve to death.

So.....9.830 acres / 1.5 acres per person equals 6,500 people...that's how many might live. This particular county has a population of 855,062 people, so that means....

855,000 - 6,500 = 848,500 people are going to die....and that's a shame, but there ain't a damn thing you can do about it, except to make sure you aren't one of the 848,500 walking dead.

But those people are alive now. That's right, but only because you are able to bring in food and medicine and clothing and other things from outside your county. If something, anything, should happen and food and medicine and clothing and other supplies cannot be transported to your county, for any reason, then those people will start dying, and they will continue to die, until either they are all dead and gone, or food, medicine, etc etc etc starts getting delivered promptly again.

That's how it works.

Next step is to figure out where this land in your county is, and your State or county offices probably have a nice web-site with nice maps. I can use Google-Earth. That would be stupid...because those maps you get from your State/county will have things on them that the idiots at Google-Earth could never dream of (and certainly wouldn't think of).

Hopefully, that land is altogether, but probably not, it doesn't matter, you need to get that land and protect it all costs, because that land is your life-line for the future...meaning if you want to survive more than 6 months, you'll need it.

I have a Victory Garden in my back-yard....then die well. That will not provide 1,600 calories per day for a year for you, much less your spouse and children. I can hunt. Wrong answer. That's not going to happen.

These friends who have family members with farms, you need to make yourself valuable in their eyes, and then you'll have a place to go.

Will you survive? That depends on how much planning you did. The more planning, the greater the chances of survival.....and, no, prepping is not planning. Planning does not involve prepping. Prepping is something you do after you have a plan.

You'll need to do a threat assessment, immediately, locally and over the near and long term (about 6 months). You'll need a defensive plan. Skill-sets....what people with what skills will you need to survive indefinitely and rebuild civilization. Division of labor. Food planning, including clearing, planting, maintaining, harvesting, processing and storing (and even security for farm laborers and workers). Safety and health, education and so on.

Once you do all that, then you can "prep" which will be really, really easy, since you now know exactly what you need, and you won't waste time or money on things that you don't need.

So, yes, ingratiate yourself to your friends/co-workers. You can talk it up, without getting stupid and silly or being a nutter. That's what I did. I was at the VA hospital one day, the topic of survival came up among a few of us sitting around waiting for our appointments. They own farms, they happen to own farms in an area I grew up, we know a lot of the same people and same families and what not, they consider me a "local boy" plus my credentials speak for themselves, and so we have a really good plan that will work.

We now have 4 farms, and I've been assured that a few others will join us when the time comes, and so we can probably save a few thousand people. No, we're not altruists, not at all. We'll feed, house and protect those people, because those people ---and their special talents -- are going to help us survive over the long term.

Which brings us back to strengths and weaknesses. I don't know everything and I can't do everything, but I can do what I do best....and leave everything else to those who know how to do that best.

You can distill essential oils, can you do that from soy beans? That would be helpful, as would knowing how to make bean curd and tofu....by hand without machinery or electricity. Some cropland or areas of the US would be limited to soy bean. Put another way, soy versus wheat/grain....do soy. Corn is always best. Can you distill oil from corn? Because that would be useful as well. So would knowing how to cook or use soybeans as food so that they are uh, you know, palatable.

Congratulating....

Mircea

[monkeywrenching]

Originally Posted by Mac_Muz

Yup that's me today.... lazy. i should be outside breaking trail, but instead here i sit playin' keyboard commando, and i just spent MONEY! Not too bad, just a 12 x 12 nylon tarp...

Tarps are what dreams are made of....

12 x 12 tarp is a good shelter, from where you can go out and do other things to live on. but shelter is the 1st thing.

[Northern Maine Land Man]

"More than likely borders will be seized and blocked"

City dwellers will die there or leave in hoards. They will come scavenging which they "feel" entitled to do. They have been told all their lives that they are entitled. Some will be traveling with bug out bags like backpackers until their goods are stolen from them.

Those who have preps could be caught away from home. They should have maps with them. Travel back roads. Stay off state highways. Know EVERY railroad bridge across streams and rivers. Many railroad bridges can be driven across with pickups. Check out your local bridges so you will know ahead of time.

[oregonwoodsmoke]

Originally Posted by stepka

That's good to know. Yeah someone would have to kick me in the butt sometimes b/c I'd always be trying to sit down and read a book.

Would you, though? Would you sneak away and read if you knew that you would starve come September if you don't get the garden planted now? Would you stop half done if you knew that winter would be mighty hungry if you didn't plant and care for a lot of garden space?

Would you put off sewing those coats if you knew the hunters could not go out without weather protection and if the hunters did not go out, there would be no meat?

I suspect that motivation is going to be a lot different when people are 100% dependent upon their own production.