Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Science and Technology > Space
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 07-26-2014, 02:05 PM
 
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
11,023 posts, read 5,989,338 times
Reputation: 5703

Advertisements

Thanks, Glitch. How long does it take for a star to form from a cloud of gas from the time that cloud gets disturbed?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-26-2014, 04:05 PM
 
1,868 posts, read 3,068,800 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by 303Guy View Post
Thanks, Glitch. How long does it take for a star to form from a cloud of gas from the time that cloud gets disturbed?
That depends on the size of the star.

For a star like our sun, it takes about 10,000,000 years for the elements (mostly hydrogen and helium) in the nebula to coalesce, collapse, condense, and start the fusion process of a star.

Stars much bigger than our sun (such as a blue supergiant) can take as little as 100,000 years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2014, 07:45 PM
 
Location: Wasilla, Alaska
17,823 posts, read 23,455,656 times
Reputation: 6541
Quote:
Originally Posted by 303Guy View Post
Thanks, Glitch. How long does it take for a star to form from a cloud of gas from the time that cloud gets disturbed?
That depends on the mass, temperature, and density of the solar nebula. Our understanding of the Solar Nebular Disk Model (SNDM) only applies to low mass stars (less than ~8 M☉). Our understanding of larger mass star formation is not as good.

Some people prefer to use Jeans Mass as the critical point at which the nebula begins the process of runaway contraction. However, there is a flaw in his initial analysis which allows for a collapse that is slower than that predicted by Jeans' original analysis. This flaw is also known as "Jeans swindle." For this reason I prefer to use the Bonner-Ebert Mass. The Bonner-Ebert Mass is the largest a spherical gas cloud can be before it begins to collapse under its own gravity.

Once the gas cloud exceeds the Bonner-Ebert Mass and begins to collapse, the rate of its collapse will increase, as will its temperature and density, as the radius of gas cloud decreases. In order to create a star similar to Sol in mass takes ~100 million years.

More massive stars will form quicker, and less massive stars will take longer to form. Once the star is born (meaning it has a core temperature greater than 15 million degrees Kelvin so hydrogen fusion can begin), the solar winds will begin and clear out the remaining gas in the solar system. The formation of the planets is relatively quick after that point, taking only about 300,000 to 500,000 years.

See also:
Star Formation in Molecular Clouds - arXiv : 1101.5172v1 [PDF]
Presolar Cloud Collapse and the Formation and Early Evolution of the Solar Nebula - [PDF]
From Suns to Life: A Chronological Approach to the History of Life on Earth - ISBN 0-387-45082-7, ISBN 978-0-387-45082-7
The Structure and Evolution of Molecular Clouds: from Clumps to Cores to the IMF - arXiv : 9902246v1 [PDF]
Global collapse of molecular clouds as a formation mechanism for the most massive stars [PDF]
Bonner-Ebert Mass - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jeans Mass - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Boyle's Law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Ideal Gas Law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Nebular hypothesis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Last edited by Glitch; 07-26-2014 at 07:53 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2014, 09:26 PM
 
Location: state of enlightenment
2,403 posts, read 5,241,755 times
Reputation: 2500
How can there be different size black holes when a singularity is by definition an infinitely dense, infinitely small point?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2014, 09:33 PM
 
Location: state of enlightenment
2,403 posts, read 5,241,755 times
Reputation: 2500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitch View Post
Good question. First of all, we can only "see" optically ~8 billion light years, not using gravitational lensing. The only thing that comes close to 13.7 billion light years away was WMAP which occurs at a redshift z = 1089, or ~380,000 years after the Big Bang.

Optically, we can never see what happened before reionization.
Shouldn't we be able to see the reionization period as some kind of impenetrable fog with a powerful enough telescope?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2014, 09:33 PM
 
Location: Sarasota, FL
1,713 posts, read 2,348,358 times
Reputation: 1046
Quote:
Originally Posted by geos View Post
How can there be different size black holes when a singularity is by definition an infinitely dense, infinitely small point?
Black Holes get larger as they accumulate more material. But here's the trick. The area of the event horizon increases proportionate to the matter/energy it accumulates.

They aren't considered an "infinitely dense point" any longer. Black holes being considered an infinitely dense point is not consistent with current theory.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2014, 09:38 PM
 
Location: state of enlightenment
2,403 posts, read 5,241,755 times
Reputation: 2500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitch View Post
That depends on whose theories you are using at the time. You are right, according to Einstein gravity is an effect, caused by mass warping space/time. However, under Newtonian mechanics, to answer why an apple falls from a tree, gravity is most certainly a force.
Isn't there a graviton particle?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2014, 09:57 PM
 
Location: state of enlightenment
2,403 posts, read 5,241,755 times
Reputation: 2500
Quote:
Originally Posted by beninfl View Post
Black Holes get larger as they accumulate more material. But here's the trick. The area of the event horizon increases proportionate to the matter/energy it accumulates.

They aren't considered an "infinitely dense point" any longer. Black holes being considered an infinitely dense point is not consistent with current theory.
Is the event horizon like a spinning CD around a black hole or is it a sphere?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2014, 12:04 AM
 
1,868 posts, read 3,068,800 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by geos View Post
Isn't there a graviton particle?
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I think gravitons have fallen out of favor as the preferred hypothesis for what gravity really is.

I believe gravity is really just a distortion in space-time. Putting a large body in space "compresses" the space around it thus creating what we experience as gravity.


http://www.geek.com/wp-content/uploa...pacetime-2.jpg

Last edited by Adric; 08-06-2014 at 12:21 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2014, 12:06 AM
 
1,868 posts, read 3,068,800 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by geos View Post
Is the event horizon like a spinning CD around a black hole or is it a sphere?
It is a sphere however, faster rotating black holes can have bulges near the equatorial line. The accretion disc around the event horizon is disc shaped as it's name suggests.

Last edited by Adric; 08-06-2014 at 12:22 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Science and Technology > Space

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:58 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top