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I seriously started contemplating this after watching her win the 5th Wimbleton title of her career. No, she doesnt have the most slams, and she's not likely to come near Margaret Court's mark of 24 especially now that she's on the wrong side of 30, though I do believe she'll end up in the ballpark of 16-18 slams. But how does she compare to the Navratilova's, Graf's, Evert's in women's tennis? I don't think Serena will match those women in term of career slams and overall titles, but I'm speaking mainly from an ability standpoint.
From a pure "ability" standpoint she has to be the greatest ever, but ability that is not utilized properly turns into a "what if" question. Over her decade or so in the game, it's been obvious that tennis does not consume Serena, she had no real desire to be the best ever. And that has to count against her. To me, she falls into the same category as Shaq in basketball; on paper should have been the most dominant ever, but he didnt dedicate himself thus he is in the conversation, but will never be the best ever. This applies to Serena perfectly. If she had the drive and focus of Tiger Woods (before his uh, "problems"), there is no doubt in my mind that she would have wiped the floor with just about everybody, including her sister. But alas, she just didnt want it...a great shame...
From a pure "ability" standpoint she has to be the greatest ever, but ability that is not utilized properly turns into a "what if" question. Over her decade or so in the game, it's been obvious that tennis does not consume Serena, she had no real desire to be the best ever. And that has to count against her. To me, she falls into the same category as Shaq in basketball; on paper should have been the most dominant ever, but he didnt dedicate himself thus he is in the conversation, but will never be the best ever. This applies to Serena perfectly. If she had the drive and focus of Tiger Woods (before his uh, "problems"), there is no doubt in my mind that she would have wiped the floor with just about everybody, including her sister. But alas, she just didnt want it...a great shame...
We must be watching two different Serenas because the one I see on TV wants it very badly and fights so hard at every match to win and not just win but to win BIG. Every point to her seems life or death. That's the way I take her over the top emotions during the game. Watching her tear apart Maria at the Olympics was simply amazing.
We must be watching two different Serenas because the one I see on TV wants it very badly and fights so hard at every match to win and not just win but to win BIG. Every point to her seems life or death. That's the way I take her over the top emotions during the game. Watching her tear apart Maria at the Olympics was simply amazing.
Yep we must have been watching different people. Serena was never 100% dedicated to the sport...I remember her talking about retiring several times over the years, wanting to work more on her fashion line...she wanted to do things outside tennis...she also battled fitness issues, injuries (probably due to the fitness issues)...remember MJ? Constantly working on his game? Tiger redesigning his swing several times over the years to get better? Kobe adding different moves each summer? THAT'S the dedication of a champion. Serena wasnt focused like that. Again, I'll take a focused locked in Serena over just about anybody...too bad that Serena only showed up some of the time, not all the time.
Her little "in your face" victory dance and primal screaming at the olympics was the most obnoxious display of arrogance ever.
She is a disgrace to tennis, and America.
Bump for Serena winning her 15th major last night. Azarenka was one game from the win at 5-3....did Serena show the heart of a champion or did Azarenka buckle under the pressure? A bit of both?
Well, she's undoubtedly one of the five greatest players of all time in the women's game...no matter what people say about her heart, committment, dedication, crip walking, etc. There's no way to objectively measure "dedication," but there is a very easy way to objectively measure Grand Slam victories, Olympic gold medals, Career Grand Slams, weeks at No. 1, career titles, etc.
Serena may very well be within the Top 3 of all time. Steffi Graf has more Majors in singles, but very few tennis players in their right mind would really say that Steffi could compete on Serena's level. Margaret Court has the most Majors in the women's game ever, so that's one more person you could potentially rank ahead of Serena (even though I don't think so, but that's a whole different thread in and of itself). Billie Jean King is obviously another. The only player I would rank ahead of Serena is Martina Navratilova. She brought a different type of athleticism and intensity to the game. And she was still winning doubles titles well into her 40s and 50s!
In my mind, it's Martina, Serena, BJK, Court, Graf, and then everyone else.
Bump for Serena winning her 15th major last night. Azarenka was one game from the win at 5-3....did Serena show the heart of a champion or did Azarenka buckle under the pressure? A bit of both?
Definitely both... Serena was 2 points away from losing. She showed why she is one of the greatest players ever and that the moment was just too big for Azarenka. Bless her heart... She was so close. But couldn't take it. You have to be able to beat a champion and she could not do it.
Serena's mental game does not get enough credit. Once she started peeling back on her shots, Azarenka began to make mistakes. The pressure was too much for Azarenka and Serena knew it. She let Azarenka make the errors.l That's the genius in Serena's game that gets overlooked. Even Azarenka mentioned how mentally tough Serena is...
Well, she's undoubtedly one of the five greatest players of all time in the women's game...no matter what people say about her heart, committment, dedication, crip walking, etc. There's no way to objectively measure "dedication," but there is a very easy way to objectively measure Grand Slam victories, Olympic gold medals, Career Grand Slams, weeks at No. 1, career titles, etc.
Serena may very well be within the Top 3 of all time. Steffi Graf has more Majors in singles, but very few tennis players in their right mind would really say that Steffi could compete on Serena's level. Margaret Court has the most Majors in the women's game ever, so that's one more person you could potentially rank ahead of Serena (even though I don't think so, but that's a whole different thread in and of itself). Billie Jean King is obviously another. The only player I would rank ahead of Serena is Martina Navratilova. She brought a different type of athleticism and intensity to the game. And she was still winning doubles titles well into her 40s and 50s!
In my mind, it's Martina, Serena, BJK, Court, Graf, and then everyone else.
I'd generally agree with that. People will always bring up the era thing, along with her attitude, her dedication, and so on and so worth. Her results lead me to believe that she is indeed 'somewhere' in the top 5. I was a little young when Martina was in her prime, to be able to objectively measure her. Though I do recall Martina in their early 30's still playing in Wimbledon finals, but I missed her in her 20's. I can only say that Serena is the best I've seen in my lifetime, from a standpoint of being able to understand and appreciate the nuances what's I'm seeing. Justine-Henin may have very well been the player of the 2000's or at least established a Federer-Nadal level rivalry with Serena, but she ended her career early. She definitely warrants a mention in this topic.
I also feel that Monica Seles was on her way to joining that 'Tier-1' group before the unfortunate stabbing incident.
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