How dangerous is St Louis, really? (St. Louis, Chesterfield: violent crime, neighborhood, school)

[1greatcity]

Every major US city has its good parts and its not-so-good parts. STL is no exception. But the vast majority of the area is pretty safe, day and night.
The city has simply gotten a bad rap from the useless "most dangerous cities" lists. Simply said, I could carve out a 61-square mile section of the inner core of any big American city and come up with overblown crime statistics.

[marigolds6]

So what do the numbers look like for Kenwood, Woodlawn, and Hyde Park?
I would find those much more comparable to Lafayette Square than Lincoln Park or Lakeview.

[Chicago76]

Originally Posted by marigolds6

So what do the numbers look like for Kenwood, Woodlawn, and Hyde Park?
I would find those much more comparable to Lafayette Square than Lincoln Park or Lakeview.

I think all three are more similar to LS in terms of scale, but not at all in terms of how "built out" the neighborhood is. I can't think of any units in LS that are board ups. Low rent apartment units are pretty rare in the area too, unlike the three areas mentioned. All things equal, I would expect their crime rates to be higher. Here they are though:

Hyde Park = 65. Probably a solid comparison, other than some of the board ups/lower rent pockets in the neighborhood.
Kenwood (still very transitional, probably closer to Shaw or TGE): 90
Woodlawn = IMHO nothing like LS but more like Gravois Park or areas in the northside: 309.

[marigolds6]

I lived in that general area at addresses ranging from 52nd down to 61st for 7+ years. I honestly never saw a single board up in Hyde Park and Kenwood was basically full of African-American celebrities and their security guards. Kenwood is transitional now? That's bizarre.
Woodlawn probably is way below LS at this point. It was always up and down at the time (late 1990s)

[1greatcity]

Not to be a pain, but this IS a STL forum...these Chicago discussions are getting old.

[aragx6]

As opposed to the million-page STL vs. Minneapolis thread??

[1greatcity]

Anyhoo...let's continue the discussion of how dangerous STL is or isn't.
Suburban St Louis residents believe the city is more dangerous than the suburbs. But that's a generalization. I'd be willing to bet that certain city neighborhoods are safer than some suburbs. Many city residents will tell you that the perception of crime in the city is overblown. A few select neighborhoods comprise the majority of the major crimes. Most of the city is usually quiet.

I think a lot of it is perception. Locally, everyone's mind is pretty much made up on this topic. But outsiders (unless they've visited STL) only know what the media tells them. It's quite common for the media to sensationalize crime. We presume that certain cities are more dangerous than others because some cities are always getting bad press for their crime stats.

I think STL is a true victim of this. We're often put in the company with places like Memphis, Detroit and Oakland. In fact, in 2010, those places ranked among the "25 most dangerous metro areas" in America (Moran Quitno Press). But guess what? Metro St Louis was not on that list. Yet the stigma of high crime persists due to the city's ranking. The city represents only 11% of the people of the St Louis area. Do you see how skewed the facts really are??

[EastOfWest]

I'm confused as to why there's even a question as to how dangerous St. Louis is. I admire all the folks on this thread who have repeatedly claimed time and time again that they've never felt particuarly unsafe in the city, it has sketch areas just like any other town, etc. etc. It's just that for the past 3 or 4 years St. Louis has been listed, by nearly every organization that does this kind of thing, as one of the 5 most crime-ridden cities in the country. In particular i've heard the term "murder capital" thrown about quite frequently. It's not really a matter of personal opinion-if St. Louis has more burglaries, muggings, carjackings, shootings and stabbings per capita than any other of the 200 or so large cities in America then it's dangerous. Very dangerous. Clear and simple. It's not as if the rest of the country is out to get you guys or something, facts are facts. The 10 Most Dangerous Cities in America - 24/7 Wall St. - National - The Atlantic, The Most Dangerous Cities In America, The 11 Most Dangerous Cities - US News and World Report. These articles all obtained their statistics from the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Unless you honestly believe that the director of the FBI has a personal grudge against the city of St. Louis and is using his influence to assassinate the town's reputation, I'd think you would find it hard to argue with these figures.

[kshe95girl]

Originally Posted by EastOfWest

I'm confused as to why there's even a question as to how dangerous St. Louis is. I admire all the folks on this thread who have repeatedly claimed time and time again that they've never felt particuarly unsafe in the city, it has sketch areas just like any other town, etc. etc. It's just that for the past 3 or 4 years St. Louis has been listed, by nearly every organization that does this kind of thing, as one of the 5 most crime-ridden cities in the country. In particular i've heard the term "murder capital" thrown about quite frequently. It's not really a matter of personal opinion-if St. Louis has more burglaries, muggings, carjackings, shootings and stabbings per capita than any other of the 200 or so large cities in America then it's dangerous. Very dangerous. Clear and simple. It's not as if the rest of the country is out to get you guys or something, facts are facts. The 10 Most Dangerous Cities in America - 24/7 Wall St. - National - The Atlantic, The Most Dangerous Cities In America, The 11 Most Dangerous Cities - US News and World Report. These articles all obtained their statistics from the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Unless you honestly believe that the director of the FBI has a personal grudge against the city of St. Louis and is using his influence to assassinate the town's reputation, I'd think you would find it hard to argue with these figures.

One can only suppose you have read none of the threads on this subject.
Talk about beating a dead horse.

[moorlander]

Originally Posted by EastOfWest

I'm confused as to why there's even a question as to how dangerous St. Louis is. I admire all the folks on this thread who have repeatedly claimed time and time again that they've never felt particuarly unsafe in the city, it has sketch areas just like any other town, etc. etc. It's just that for the past 3 or 4 years St. Louis has been listed, by nearly every organization that does this kind of thing, as one of the 5 most crime-ridden cities in the country. In particular i've heard the term "murder capital" thrown about quite frequently. It's not really a matter of personal opinion-if St. Louis has more burglaries, muggings, carjackings, shootings and stabbings per capita than any other of the 200 or so large cities in America then it's dangerous. Very dangerous. Clear and simple. It's not as if the rest of the country is out to get you guys or something, facts are facts. The 10 Most Dangerous Cities in America - 24/7 Wall St. - National - The Atlantic, The Most Dangerous Cities In America, The 11 Most Dangerous Cities - US News and World Report. These articles all obtained their statistics from the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Unless you honestly believe that the director of the FBI has a personal grudge against the city of St. Louis and is using his influence to assassinate the town's reputation, I'd think you would find it hard to argue with these figures.

Have you spent any time analyzing the FBI report?

These lists are compiled to sell collaterals. They're for fun. If you're confused, please read through the dozens of threads discussing this.

No one here thinks anyone is out to get St. Louis. Nor is anyone claiming that some St. Louis neighborhoods aren't dangerous.

3 Points
1.The key phrase is "per capita."
2. The FBI reports specifically state that their city crime statistics should not be used for city vs city comparisons.
3. StL has a small geographic size and did not annex streetcar suburbs to dilute "per capita" stats.

Apples to Apples crime comparisons are best either between metro area or at the neighborhood level. Nearly all of the St. Louis metro area is plenty safe for even the most paranoid citizens.

Anyone who has taken an intro to statistics class can easily understand how this data is misleading without context.