Is New Tampa the only area in Tampa with good schools? (Sarasota: daycare, unemployed)

[SarasotaBound1]

Originally Posted by sinatras

Here are the top colleges in the USA, the Ivies, where the best and the brightest kids with the best grades, scores and educational backgrounds enroll.

2015 Ivy League Admissions Statistics | The Ivy Coach

If you look at where most of their freshmen come from (geographic diversity) during most years, Florida is never mentioned, but states like NJ, NY, Mass. are.

Which means that these states, and not Florida, are doing the best job at preparing kids for the best schools, which have the highest standards. Which is why Florida is not regarded as an educational stalwart.

If NY or NJ schools are sending the most kids to Princeton, that's all we need to know right there. This is not rocket science; people routinely move to and buy houses in the best school districts in the country, places like Belmont Mass, Montgomery county MD, etc. When was the last time you heard anyone say they were moving to Florida "for the schools"? If I told any of my Chicago friends that they'd laugh their butts off.

I don't see Florida mentioned anywhere on that web page, but I could have missed it.

What does this mean other than more people from those states chose to apply and were accepted there? Attending an Ivy is not some sort of bench mark to decide who is smart or not... Some smart people chose Ivy's others (MUCH MORE) do NOT.

Remember there is a limited amount of Ivy's and many many other excellent universities around the country. I am not stating that Florida is better than the other states, I'm saying that Florida is taking steps that other states are not taking to improve their performance.

It won't be too long before Florida overtakes the other states in terms of education as a whole. Norther states are marred in unions and the population will back them irrespective of how much damage they inflict.

[sinatras]

I am not saying the kids in Florida are not smart.


Read this slowly: I am saying that our best colleges in this country, which have the highest educational standards, have determined that the kids with the best grades, test scores, educational backgrounds do not come from Florida most of the time.

This is not about smart/not smart, unions, this is about which states are doing the best job of preparing our kids for our best colleges, preparing them to meet or exceed our highest educational benchmarks/standards? Not Florida.


Plenty of kids from Florida would rather go to Princeton or Dartmouth than Emory or UF or Duke, but they don't make the cut. I sit in on interviews for the upcoming Harvard freshman class, and most of the kids from Tampa bay are nowhere near the level of a kid from Bethesda, MD. Sad but true.

[DUNNDFRNT]

Originally Posted by sinatras

Here are the top colleges in the USA, the Ivies, where the best and the brightest kids with the best grades, scores and educational backgrounds enroll.

2015 Ivy League Admissions Statistics | The Ivy Coach

If you look at where most of their freshmen come from (geographic diversity) during most years, Florida is never mentioned (despite the alleged improvements of the last few years), but states like NJ, NY, Mass. are.

Which means that these states, and not Florida, are doing the best job at preparing kids for the best schools, which have the highest standards. Which is why Florida is not regarded as an educational stalwart.

If NY or NJ schools are sending the most kids to Princeton, thats all we need to know right there. This is not rocket science; people routinely move to and buy houses in the best school districts in the country, places like Belmont, Mass., Montgomery County, MD, etc. When was the last time you heard anyone say they were moving to Florida "for the schools"? If I told any of my Illinois friends that they'd laugh their butts off. Lets not kid ourselves.

I don't see Florida mentioned anywhere on that web page, but I could have missed it.

That website mentions the top 5 states per school for all you know Florida could be the 6th, out of 50 states that would be on the top 12%. It stands to reason the northeast would lead the admissions of Ivy League schools, that area has the highest concentration of Ivy League graduates hence legacy prospects which can account to up to 30% of new students, also more wealth, more people can actually afford an Ivy League education. How many of those students actually come from private schools as opposed to public schools. Some people rather do their graduate work at an Ivy league school and don't bother applying for undergraduate admissions. At any rate no one stated that the Florida education system is better than NY/NJ rather that in Tampa there are some high performing public schools that could hold their own against other schools in the nation.

[sinatras]

Like I said, some of the kids I have interviewed for Harvard, some from those "high performing schools" in Tampa bay, can't hold a candle to a kid from Bethesda. Or Lexington, Mass. Or Lake Forest, Ill. And by the way, many of the Ivy kids come from California ( top 5 state). High performing Asian kids coming from there. So it's not just the northeast like Dunn says.

[SarasotaBound1]

Originally Posted by sinatras

I am not saying the kids in Florida are not smart.


Read this slowly: I am saying that our best colleges in this country, which have the highest educational standards, have determined that the kids with the best grades, test scores, educational backgrounds do not come from Florida most of the time.

Plenty of kids from Florida would rather go to Dartmouth than UF, but they don't make the cut. I sit in on interviews for the upcoming Harvard freshman class, and most of the kids from Tampa bay are nowhere near the level of a kid from Bethesda, MD. Sad but true.

Sorry, you should read this slowly: Being an Ivy does not mean it's a better school, it does not mean it has higher standards, and it does not mean the kids that attend are the smarter, it just mean students selected an Ivy league school education and the school accepted them. The "standards" you mentioned are questionable, Bush Jr graduated from Harvard and Yale... need I say more?

I know folks that graduated from Columbia and a few other Ivy's; while I graduated from state and private schools. I don't feel an ounce less smarter than them at all. Not to say that a school like Harvard is not selective, but If I had a choice, I would not send my kids to these schools. And BTW, I grew up idolizing the Ivy league schools and even considered attending one at a point. This is re-enforced by your comments above.

I am not sure about your role in Harvard admissions, but am not sure why an interview is needed to understand a student's intellectual abilities, or how an interview will allow enough time to decide whether a student is smarter than the other. Perhaps it shows my lack of understanding for the admissions process (it's been a while ).

Perhaps you are correct and the Northern states have better school districts and perhaps their students are smarter (I went to school in the North East), but the data you've provided is not sufficient to make that assessment.

[sinatras]

It's clear from your reply that you are clueless about educational standards and the admissions processes of our most selective schools.

I would like nothing more than to meet someone in Maryland or Massachusetts who tells me they are moving to Florida for the better quality of the schools. Somehow I don't think that will happen in my lifetime.

[SarasotaBound1]

Originally Posted by sinatras

It's clear from your reply that you are clueless about educational standards and the admissions processes of our most selective schools.

I would like nothing more than to meet someone in Maryland or Massachusetts who tells me they are moving to Florida for the better quality of the schools. Somehow I don't think that will happen in my lifetime.

Given that GWB attended 2 Ivy schools, I guess that selective-ness depends on your pockets and influence..

I think I'm starting to understand now..

[DUNNDFRNT]

Originally Posted by sinatras

It's clear from your reply that you are clueless about educational standards and the admissions processes of our most selective schools.

I would like nothing more than to meet someone in Maryland or Massachusetts who tells me they are moving to Florida for the better quality of the schools. Somehow I don't think that will happen in my lifetime.

This whole thread wasn't about someone who was moving from LI to Tampa because of the schools. I don;t think anyone made that assertion.

[floridagirl777]

This is an interesting thread.

My husband and his two best friends attended school here in Florida. All three of them got into Ivy League schools … my husband and his one friend attended Emory while the other attended Vanderbilt. I really don't think Florida's schools doom students to life outside the Ivies. If the school is a halfway decent school with a solid college preparatory program, if the student is motivated and capable, and if there is strong parental support at home, then the student should be able to get into whatever college he/she wants.

By the way, my husband is the first to admit that the education he received at Emory wasn't any better than what he received while taking summer classes at USF. The main difference was the type of students. At Emory, most came from affluent families. At USF, the students came from all walks of life. In the end, his Emory diploma didn't get him anything other than in a massive amount of debt! He got into a graduate program at another college with about 200 other students who came mostly from state schools. He now says he should have gone to a state school and saved a bunch of money since his Emory education didn't help him in the end.

My point is, whether or not a student can get into an Ivy League university depends more on the student than anything else.

And really … in the end does it matter where someone attends college? Does a student need an Ivy League school to land a good job? Of course not. As long as Florida is turning out students who are college or career ready, then that's what's really important when one considers the schools here.

[SarasotaBound1]

Originally Posted by floridagirl777

This is an interesting thread.

My husband and his two best friends attended school here in Florida. All three of them got into Ivy League schools … my husband and his one friend attended Emory while the other attended Vanderbilt. I really don't think Florida's schools doom students to life outside the Ivies. If the school is a halfway decent school with a solid college preparatory program, if the student is motivated and capable, and if there is strong parental support at home, then the student should be able to get into whatever college he/she wants.

By the way, my husband is the first to admit that the education he received at Emory wasn't any better than what he received while taking summer classes at USF. The main difference was the type of students. At Emory, most came from affluent families. At USF, the students came from all walks of life. In the end, his Emory diploma didn't get him anything other than in a massive amount of debt! He got into a graduate program at another college with about 200 other students who came mostly from state schools. He now says he should have gone to a state school and saved a bunch of money since his Emory education didn't help him in the end.

My point is, whether or not a student can get into an Ivy League university depends more on the student than anything else.

And really … in the end does it matter where someone attends college? Does a student need an Ivy League school to land a good job? Of course not. As long as Florida is turning out students who are college or career ready, then that's what's really important when one considers the schools here.

Although excellent, Emory and Vanderbilt are not Ivy schools. Looking on the net, it seems there is a new term "new ivy" of which these 2 schools are part of.

With respect to your last statement about jobs, the other item to consider (which you point above) is your debt load once you do graduate. Ivy leaguers come out with huge debts, which offsets any additional income they may get.