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View Poll Results: Best Downtown in Texas
Houston 54 19.35%
Dallas 82 29.39%
Fort Worth 36 12.90%
Austin 48 17.20%
San Antonio 52 18.64%
Galveston 0 0%
El Paso 2 0.72%
Other (Please Specify) 5 1.79%
Voters: 279. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-26-2014, 10:10 AM
 
Location: The Bayou City
3,220 posts, read 3,578,105 times
Reputation: 1449

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TXEX06 View Post
In downtown SA along the new Riverwalk expansion. I consider that area downtown, lot of infill going on and downtowns footprint is expanding.
I was only addressing your point about downtown SA being for tourists, that is not the case with all the residential development. A lot of controversy around the streetcar, but there is no doubt in my mind that it will be built. And it will go right by my loft.

Downtown SA is far from a ghost town during the day also.

I would hope Houston would finally get on top of things and start focusing on residential development downtown. Both Houston and SA severely lagged in that department. And of course Houston will outpace SA on downtown residential development based on population and money. For better or worst SA handles downtown development much differently then other Texas cities. The HDRC has squashed many modern high rises planned for SA.
nice! thanks for the info. i dont hear much about the smaller projects on these forums.
thats cool you live in a loft in downtown SA. i lived in a loft in downtown Waco (a little different.. lol!) for a couple years while at Baylor. its a really neat experience living in downtown and being able to walk places, coming from growing up in the suburbs.
i agree. downtown SA is right up there with Houstons daytime vibrancy. it is just able to carry that over into the night time scene very effectively through all the tourism, which Houston hasnt been able to do.
i completely agree.. i think SA handles downtown development for the better. they certainly have been very successful at it, and im sure it will continue to carry over. i just think some of the other cities are doing more to improve their downtowns ATM, like Austin, Ft Worth, and Houston (though one could say those downtowns have more work to do than San Antonio).
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Old 05-26-2014, 11:28 AM
 
Location: Dallas,TX
287 posts, read 301,076 times
Reputation: 296
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasTallest View Post
you havent mentioned Dallas, but a number of other people have mentioned that "connectivity" downtown Dallas apparently has, so i mentioned the fact that Houston has light rail lines sprouting in 4 different directions now from downtown, but i guess connectivity isnt as important of an issue to you. fair enough.

please dont over exaggerate what? some dude sincerely thought Dallas had the best downtown (not to mention, claimed it had "historic charm"... LOL). i dont see you ragging on him to stop over exaggerating things. are we not all allowed to form our own opinions? i should of mentioned i had San Antonio tied with Houston currently, but obviously San Antonio falls off in my rankings as it gets passed by Ft Worth and Dallas (tourist wise, yes San Antonio will always be a mecca, but like i said before, downtowns are much more than just attracting tourism). you would have Houston tied with Dallas? downtown Dallas doesnt even have any professional sports stadiums (Houston has two), a proper theater district (Houstons is second only to NYC), much in terms of parks (Houston has Discovery Green, Market Square, and Buffalo Bayou Park, on top of the numerous pocket parks around downtown), or have many serious developments going up around the CBD.

you are right, but again, i pointed out Houston has the largest daytime population of all the Texas downtowns, and again, when it benefits Houston, all of those people downtown suddenly dont matter anymore. yes, on the week days after 5pm downtown is fairly dead (for now.. until they triple the downtown population). but on the weekends and during work hours downtown Houston is just as active as any Texas downtown (not saying much, heh)
Sorry, I don't pay attention/reply to everybody.

And how does having stadiums equate to having a better downtown? They are only used about 50 days a year. And what about Dallas' Art District? And what about Belo Gardens, Main Street park, and Klyde Warren? And don't forget a Downtown Dallas has numerous residential units also under construction/planned.

And what significance does daytime population have if they are inside working? The only thing that should matter is how many of those people are still there after working hours.
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Old 05-26-2014, 12:00 PM
 
568 posts, read 714,908 times
Reputation: 546
Quote:
Originally Posted by JKAddict View Post
Sorry, I don't pay attention/reply to everybody.

And how does having stadiums equate to having a better downtown? They are only used about 50 days a year. And what about Dallas' Art District? And what about Belo Gardens, Main Street park, and Klyde Warren? And don't forget a Downtown Dallas has numerous residential units also under construction/planned.

And what significance does daytime population have if they are inside working? The only thing that should matter is how many of those people are still there after working hours.
About 50 days? It's 41 days just for basketball and then you have about 80 for baseball. Not to mention the other various events they host.
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Old 05-26-2014, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Dallas,TX
287 posts, read 301,076 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xsatyr View Post
About 50 days? It's 41 days just for basketball and then you have about 80 for baseball. Not to mention the other various events they host.
True. That number was only for a stadium.
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Old 05-26-2014, 12:20 PM
 
Location: The Bayou City
3,220 posts, read 3,578,105 times
Reputation: 1449
Quote:
Originally Posted by JKAddict View Post
Sorry, I don't pay attention/reply to everybody.

And how does having stadiums equate to having a better downtown? They are only used about 50 days a year. And what about Dallas' Art District? And what about Belo Gardens, Main Street park, and Klyde Warren? And don't forget a Downtown Dallas has numerous residential units also under construction/planned.

And what significance does daytime population have if they are inside working? The only thing that should matter is how many of those people are still there after working hours.
oh. only to those whose opinions dont benefit Dallas? i see how this game is played... that guys post about Dallas being #1 was a couple before one of my posts that you quoted.

stadiums bring more people, thus more vibrancy, to downtown..? what about Dallas' arbitrary "Arts District"? Belo Gardens is cool i guess.. but Main Street Park and Klyde Warren just seem like much smaller versions of Market Square Park and Discovery Green. and then there is Tranquillity Park, Sesquicentennial Park, Sam Houston Park, Sisters of Charity Park, and the numerous small pocket parks.

yes, downtown Dallas has residential units U/C, and a slightly higher residential population than downtown Houston. but the fact that office vacancy rates are near 30% is a big hit for downtown IMO. thats not a healthy district AT ALL.
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Old 05-26-2014, 12:46 PM
 
1,307 posts, read 2,066,090 times
Reputation: 2726
This poll is totally distorted by homerism. Right now May 2014, downtown Dallas and downtown Houston should be duking it out with downtown El Paso for least vibrant downtown of the big Texas cities. On a Saturday night 80% of both dtD and DtH - utterly deserted. During a weekday, because of the tunnels, minimal pedestrian life!! Dull places for tourists and insufficient amenities for residents. Fort Worth and San Antonio are great downtowns for visitors - architecturally interesting, alive etc. I wouldn't necessarily want to live in them, but they are vibrant downtowns. Downtown Austin is the only downtown in Texas that is good for both residents and visitors - compact, walkable, highest concentration of bars, clubs, restaurants in the state, great outdoor recreation on the hike and bike trail: enough everyday amenities - grocery stores etc within walking distance. Actually dtA is the ONLY truly live,work,play neighborhood in the state of Texas.

I agree downtown Dallas SHOULD be the best downtown in TX. It has a good architectural mix of old and new. It has more of its museums in the downtown. The Neiman Marcus flagship is great. Adjacent Deep Ellum is the closest thing Texas has to Soho in terms of architecture, but it can't seem to live up to the promise of its built environment. I find downtown Dallas continually underwhelming. It reminds me of a bigger version of downtown Austin in the 1990s, too many surface parking lots, pathetic pedestrian activity, one or two strips of nightlife - 6th for Austin back then, Main for Dallas now. The architecturally abysmal Uptown Dallas, where nearly every building looks like it was thrown up on the cheap in 1987, regardless of when it was actually built is much more vibrant than downtown Dallas. I think the fact that dtD sits in a multi-nodal MSA hurts it. It has some of the highest office vacancy rates of any big city downtown in the U.S. We were there this past Easter weekend and most of it felt as deserted as it did 10 years ago?? At 2pm on a Sunday afternoon, we walked from the Hotel Adolphus to the Nasher, a distance of about a mile - after crossing Elm, we did not see a single other pedestrian???

1. Austin
2. San Antonio/Fort Worth
4. Houston
5. Dallas/El Paso
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Old 05-26-2014, 12:52 PM
 
Location: Dallas,TX
287 posts, read 301,076 times
Reputation: 296
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasTallest View Post
oh. only to those whose opinions dont benefit Dallas? i see how this game is played... that guys post about Dallas being #1 was a couple before one of my posts that you quoted.

stadiums bring more people, thus more vibrancy, to downtown..? what about Dallas' arbitrary "Arts District"? Belo Gardens is cool i guess.. but Main Street Park and Klyde Warren just seem like much smaller versions of Market Square Park and Discovery Green. and then there is Tranquillity Park, Sesquicentennial Park, Sam Houston Park, Sisters of Charity Park, and the numerous small pocket parks.

yes, downtown Dallas has residential units U/C, and a slightly higher residential population than downtown Houston. but the fact that office vacancy rates are near 30% is a big hit for downtown IMO. thats not a healthy district AT ALL.
Lol what? If you look at my past posts, I've barely showed any bias to Dallas, IMO. In fact, I wasn't even defending Dallas in the first place.

And yes, stadiums can bring vibrancy, but just because a downtown doesn't have doesn't mean it's inferior. And yes, Houston does have an edge on Dallas on parks.

But still, what about West End? What about the Farmers Market?

And hey, Dallas' vacancy rates are getting better.
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Old 05-26-2014, 02:32 PM
 
Location: Dallas,Texas
5,270 posts, read 7,201,228 times
Reputation: 2039
A list of projects from the top of my head


New apartments in West End U/C

Fairfield West End Corgan

The Farmer's Market redevelopment U/C

At groundbreaking, Rawlings hails Dallas Farmers Market’s $65-million makeover one of Dallas’ ‘best ideas’ ever | Dallas Morning News

1401 Elm Place conversion U/C

Construction work is about to start at Downtown Dallas’ vacant 1401 Elm tower | Dallas Morning News


Statler-Hilton Conversion

Dallas council approves $46.5 million for redevelopment of old Statler Hilton in downtown | Dallas Morning News

Hall Arts Center U/C

There's plans for a future 30 story residential tower and mixed use building

Hall Arts Office project groundbreaking tomorrow in downtown Dallas | Dallas Morning News

Butler Brothers Building Conversion

$85M redevelopment near Dallas City Hall ?ready to go? - Dallas Business Journal
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Old 05-26-2014, 03:46 PM
 
Location: The Bayou City
3,220 posts, read 3,578,105 times
Reputation: 1449
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dallaz View Post
A list of projects from the top of my head


New apartments in West End U/C

Fairfield West End Corgan

The Farmer's Market redevelopment U/C

At groundbreaking, Rawlings hails Dallas Farmers Market’s $65-million makeover one of Dallas’ ‘best ideas’ ever | Dallas Morning News

1401 Elm Place conversion U/C

Construction work is about to start at Downtown Dallas’ vacant 1401 Elm tower | Dallas Morning News


Statler-Hilton Conversion

Dallas council approves $46.5 million for redevelopment of old Statler Hilton in downtown | Dallas Morning News

Hall Arts Center U/C

There's plans for a future 30 story residential tower and mixed use building

Hall Arts Office project groundbreaking tomorrow in downtown Dallas | Dallas Morning News

Butler Brothers Building Conversion

$85M redevelopment near Dallas City Hall ?ready to go? - Dallas Business Journal
nice! thanks for the breakdown on the projects in downtown Dallas. for comparison since Dallas leads the polls, here is a list of projects off the top of my head U/C in downtown Houston.

- East End and Southeast light rail lines down Capital and Rusk

- 350 Million Dollar 1,000 room Marriott Marquis
Marriott Marquis Houston breaks ground at the convention center with some unexpected features - Houston Business Journal

- 80 Million Dollar JW Marriott
New $80 million downtown hotel to save a 102-year-old skyscraper - CultureMap Houston

- 23 story Block 256 Hilcorp Tower
HOUSTON | 1111 Travis | 346 FT / 105 M | 23 FLOORS - SkyscraperPage Forum

- 49 story Hines 609 Main
Hines starts construction on 609 Main at Texas office tower in downtown Houston - Houston Business Journal

- 24 story SkyHouse
SkyHouse Houston's official ground breaking set for April - Houston Business Journal

- Block 334 Apartments
Block 334 Apartments

- Fingers Apartments
Finger Cos. breaks ground on apartments next to Houston's Minute Maid Park - Houston Business Journal

- 70 Million Dollar Mickey Leland Federal Building Renovation
Jacobs wins contract in Houston - L.A. Biz

- Old Texaco Building renovation and Phase II 38 story residential tower
Exclusive: Developer moves forward with downtown's next luxe high-rise - Houston Business Journal

- Savoy renovation to Holiday Inn
Holiday Inn to be built in place of abandoned hotel in downtown Houston - Prime Property

- GreenStreet renovation
Midway Cos. sets GreenStreet renovation in motion this month - Houston Business Journal

- Sunset Coffee Building renovation
Houston's own Plymouth Rock finally gets the respect it deserves - CultureMap Houston

with an additional 25+ projects planned or in prep stages for downtown.
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Old 05-26-2014, 10:10 PM
 
1,307 posts, read 2,066,090 times
Reputation: 2726
This poll is total bs. Downtown Dallas is at best the 5th most vibrant downtown in the state of Texas, and in terms of the wider sunbelt - a collection of generally weak downtowns, downtown Dallas is better than downtown Charlotte, OKC, and downtown Phoenix, but otherwise is WAY less vibrant than the downtowns in Los Angeles, San Diego, Austin, Fort Worth, San Antonio, Houston, Atlanta, Miami, New Orleans, and is roughly equivalent to the downtowns in Denver, Tulsa, Orlando, Sacramento, and Albuquerque. It has better urban bones than most, so the deserted, abandoned feel is even more prominent.

Dallas, as the capital of the southern plains is the most midwestern feeling big city in Texas, and its downtown pales in terms of vibrancy to downtown Indianapolis, St. Louis and Detroit. I wish downtown Dallas was better, and it appears that there are efforts in that direction, but right now of the top ten MSA's in terms of population, downtown Dallas is easily the WORST. Thank God for Fort Worth.
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