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post Brexit I want to see more of a "buy British" programme, a lot of our old industries have either gone to the wall or are on the skids because of EU trade policy.
I buy British meat and fruit and veg where it is available and local produce can be bought in my area although this isn't possible everywhere at the moment I know, some people can only buy food in supermarkets, no markets or farm shops in a lot of urban areas.
post Brexit I want to see more of a "buy British" programme, a lot of our old industries have either gone to the wall or are on the skids because of EU trade policy.
I buy British meat and fruit and veg where it is available and local produce can be bought in my area although this isn't possible everywhere at the moment I know, some people can only buy food in supermarkets, no markets or farm shops in a lot of urban areas.
If they have gone to the wall or are on the skids then it's because they don't have a product that is good enough in terms of quality/price. That's really got nothing to do with the EU.
You could tell people they have to buy worse products at higher prices because they are British, but that will just result in British companies being lazy because they know the have a captive market that can't go elsewhere, which isn't going to be good for innovation or improving those products which are then very unlikely to be exported outside the UK because they are rubbish.
Sounds like a return to the 1960s/70s UK car industry.
You are also never going to get free trade deals with other countries to help British exporters while Britain has a policy of blocking imports like you suggest. No country will agree to that.
Are any bananas sold in the UK actually produced in the EU? I don't remember ever seeing any.
It would be impossible to replace EU sources of champagne, Parmesan cheese, iberico ham etc though as those are only made in the EU.
Parmigiano-Reggiano cannot be sourced anywhere but Italy, but Parmesan certainly can be sourced elsewhere.
That said worst case WTO rules, Champagne is still going to be bought, typically a reasonable vintage champagne will cost £100 a bottle, even with 40% export tariff, I'll still buy 2 bottles instead of 3.
Not having a trade agreement does not end trade, it just demands that the trade is conducted under WTO rules.
Parmigiano-Reggiano cannot be sourced anywhere but Italy, but Parmesan certainly can be sourced elsewhere.
That said worst case WTO rules, Champagne is still going to be bought, typically a reasonable vintage champagne will cost £100 a bottle, even with 40% export tariff, I'll still buy 2 bottles instead of 3.
Not having a trade agreement does not end trade, it just demands that the trade is conducted under WTO rules.
OK, we could change the law, at the moment 'Parmesan' in the EU refers only to Parmigiano-Reggiano, you can't call a cheese Parmesan if it is not Parmigiano-Reggiano unlike in some other parts of the world. But changing the law to allow inferior/fake products isn't exactly progress in my opinion.
It doesn't end trade of course if we leave the EU without a deal, but it does make it more difficult and expensive. Plus there would be extra complications around customs checks, product regulations, cross border supply chains, rules of origin for non-EU trade deals, losing access to FTAs negotiated by the EU that we benefit from a a member state etc etc. All in all a lot of extra cost, a lot of extra bureaucracy, a lot of extra uncertainty, for no clear benefit.
The problem with Farage is he doesn't need to be specific or back any of his claims at all and can literally say whatever he want's and most Brexiteers will still follow him because they fill in the gaps for themselves.
He just goes around saying, the EU is Evil, stuff them, lets leave ,who's with me ?
Anyone with any anti EU or even anti government feelings will follow him blindly, not because of what Brexit is, but what they think it could be.
Let me explain
I sell properties for a living and the easiest thing to sell is off plan properties because like Brexit they don't actually exist, you are selling a dream!
You show the customer a nice shiny brochure with stunning sea views and wall to wall sunshine and people looking very happy swimming in the pool,
You sit back and can literally see the customer let their imagination run wild, not with what this project is, but what it could could be to them, we are all optimistic really and want to believe in the best possible outcome, so people easily get carried away with how great things are going to be down the road, before you know it they've got their credit card out and the contracts signed.
It so very easy for us to build up the positives of a situation in your head but difficult to see the actual reality.
Sadly 2-3 years later when the property is actually built and the customer turns up again to pick up the keys, it looks very little like the picture they had built in their head, the lovely sea views have gone, taken away by another block that was built in front of theirs and the quality and actual dimensions of the property they had built up in their heads is nowhere to be found, the swimming pool was not in the contract at all and there for aesthetic reasons only, unfortunately at this point it's too late. you've signed up to the dream and have to live with the reality.
Brexit is nothing but off pan selling or timeshare, it's selling something that isn't factual or real, it's selling whatever dream you have in your head, but it's a good dream so you'll go along anyhow.
For the record, I do everything I can to put people off buying a dream and prefer people to buy a property they can walk into, touch the walls, see the views and know that what they actually see is what they are buying.
I sleep better this way and so do those who have bought off me.
Last edited by britinspain; 06-05-2019 at 06:06 AM..
Just how you think UK will go it alone I've no idea. You are using the language mass produced by various self interests wanting UK out for own convenience and money making opportunities rather than much care about your working class bloke in Grimsby who was sold out long ago. The miners being an example, decimated due in part to ideological reasons in part by economic reasoning. It was cheaper for Thatcher to import coal from Poland to which she happily did.
When has people's democracy ever been the deciding factor on government decision making? They run spin campaigns of lies and half truths and PR purely to gain power.
Brit's are so good at divide and rule.
Farage of course if ever got the opportunity would likely sell out the NHS to American profit interests, hardly in the interests of the ever increasingly working class of Britain.
One is more likely to happen is more authoritarian government, less rights of citizens, greater rewards for the well off. I have yet to read anything other than Farage feathering his own nest with little positive than to oppose with sketchy detail in the very least at how things would pan out.
Are you trying to suggest UK does not promote goods outside EU? That would be totally wrong. There is a lot of promotion outside Euro zone but most trade, not unreasonably expected is within the EU zone.
I'm sorry but do you have any evidence at all on this? Any? You accuse me of using language 'mass produced by various self interests'. At the end of the day its about Democracy, if (and its a VERY BIG if) Farage came to power and decided to sell out the NHS (which simply ain't happening) then at least the electorate would get the final say. Democracy is THE most important thing for any country on this planet, our ancestors fought for it and the EU is simply NOT Democratic - come back to me when Europe is governed by one central power and when its the people of Europe that vote on that one central power.
OK, we could change the law, at the moment 'Parmesan' in the EU refers only to Parmigiano-Reggiano, you can't call a cheese Parmesan if it is not Parmigiano-Reggiano unlike in some other parts of the world. But changing the law to allow inferior/fake products isn't exactly progress in my opinion.
Depends on your perspective, one of my favorite vodkas is distilled in France. At the end of the day what do you care of the origin, if it looks the same, tastes the same, has the same quality standards?
Anything else is just sheer snobbery. Indeed the reason for EU special designations is to maintain a high price on goods purely because of its place of origin, no other reason than that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MnM258
It doesn't end trade of course if we leave the EU without a deal, but it does make it more difficult and expensive. Plus there would be extra complications around customs checks, product regulations, cross border supply chains, rules of origin for non-EU trade deals, losing access to FTAs negotiated by the EU that we benefit from a a member state etc etc. All in all a lot of extra cost, a lot of extra bureaucracy, a lot of extra uncertainty, for no clear benefit.
Short term economically? Sure. Theres a name for people whose sole interest is economics, at the cost of all else, a name it shares with the oldest profession. Long term economically? Its unclear, the EU has economic issues, its losing ground against competing economies, it has the drag of Southern European, and Eastern European redevelopment and need for their economic growth too.
That said, I just read this morning about Catalan MEPs being denied their seats in the European Parliament. These are lawfully elected representatives of their constituents, but are being denied since they're also Catalan separatists (no convictions for the crime of wanting independence). How is that democratic?
That's just one small issue with the EU parliament. The second issue is responsibility, right now we have a mom and dad situation, bad stuff happens and dad blames mom, and mom blames dad, who is at fault? Dunno. We need to know where the buck stops, we can't do that with two policy makers running our country. So there's two options, have the EU parliament as the only policy maker, or the UK government as the only policy maker. Choose one, which do you want?
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