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Let me go ahead and show all the management, executives, and all other head honchos here as to why most of the workforce has, at least in management and their minions' opinions, an 'entitlement mentality'.
You say for us to go to college and get a BA/BS degree in a field and go apply to some company for a job. Okay, that's fine. I think we're all cool with that. But have you realistically considered how bad an investment you're suggesting to us?
Let's start with the numbers:
Average tuition/books/etc for a 4 year Baccalaureate degree over 4 years: $30,000
Average starting pay for a job that requires a BA/BS degree: $25,000 -$30,000
Okay, you might say, big deal, just live on the cheap and pay off the student loans for the next ten years. But is it really worth the pay you're advertising? Put aside all the promises of promotions; that's bloatware to me. It's sales puffery. Does anyone actually get ahead in this scenario?
I'll use my own numbers and personal finances for this one so some of the numbers may be a bit low to people in expensive areas.
Gross Monthly Income - $2,100
Taxes and SS/Government crap - 420.00
Rent - $500.00 - 550.00
All other expenses - $400.00 - $500.00 (yes it's that cheap for me)
Total Expenses and Taxes $1,320.00 - $1,470.00 per month
This is before paying off those student loans. Realistically, you shouldn't go more than 8 years on a student loan since you'll pay a ton of interest over the long term. You also run a risk of defaulting on the loan the longer you keep it, and defaults on student loans are NOT FUN. There's a lot of bad **** going around because of student loans, believe me. I will use an interest rate of 7% compounding interest for this loan. A 96 month loan on $30,000.00 @ 7% comes out to $409.01 per month. So, subtract this from your monthly income as well:
Gross Monthly Income - $2,100.00
Taxes/SS/Government Crap - $420.00
Rent - $500.00 - $550.00
Student Loans - $409.01
All Other Expenses - $400.00 - $500.00
Total Expenses and Taxes $1,729.01 - $1,879.01
Net Profit per month - $220.99 - $370.99
Sure, you're walking away with money in this scenario. But what would happen if I didn't go back to school and just worked some $10 - $11/hr job? (Assuming $10/hr @ 2080 hours per year)
Gross Monthly Income - $1,700.00
Taxes/SS/Government Crap - $340.00
Rent - $500.00 - $550.00
All Other Expenses - $400.00 - $500.00
Total Expenses and Taxes - $1,280.00 - $1,430.00
Net Profit Per month - $310.00 - $460.00
SO in this case I actually come out ahead WITHOUT a degree. You can make the argument that eventually I'll get raises and promotions - that's something that is a vague promise in the future. For all I know you might keep me for a year and then throw me under the bus with all the other people as before. I suppose an engineering grad might pull a higher salary but those jobs aren't as plentiful as you might think. Also, those jobs are being filled by experienced workers mostly. So, where again is it a good idea to go back to school? As an investment I say it stinks.
So, the next time someone brings up the thought that today's younger workers have an entitlement mentality of any sort, keep this in mind because I am getting sick of the media pushing this BS. My numbers are probably pretty generous; I know that a lot of people spend a lot more on tuition and/or their job has job expenses that are much bigger than what I've shown. A lot of jobs have unwritten requirements like driving a newer car or having the latest fashions or having a full-service cellphone plan, etc etc...or they're only in cities that have a high COL. If corporate America is trying to sell this as a solid investment I'd say that Wall Street and Main Street are both off their rockers.
If total student debt for 4 years ofd school is $30,000 then that should be affordable. Livbe at home with your Parent while you pay it off. Rather, I thought college costs $30,000 a year so 4 years would be $120,000 student debt... Not worth it.
The 'entitlement' mindset probably afflicts more people without a college education, than those with one. Just because politicians pander to the ignorant, by using the euphemism 'entitlement' in place of welfare --- doesn't really 'entitle' anyone to live-off of someone else's labor. Likewise, there is no 'money-back guarantee' written on the back of a college diploma!
Yes, the cost of a college education seems pretty high ... But, what do you suppose the cost of 'ignorance' is --- or even the cost of going through life with less than a high-school education!
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Yes, that college degree figure $2,100 you gave is way too low, it's barely $13/hour and even our lowest paying non-degree jobs pay about $16. The lowest paying jobs requiring a degree are at about $21/hour, so if you want to show real data recalculate at $3,360/month gross income. We are not typical, mind you, many employers in this area are starting new graduates at $50-60,000. Rent is about double yours, though.
Average starting pay for a job that requires a BA/BS degree: $25,000 -$30,000
?????
even if that were true, your pay would presumably advance throughout your lifetime while your student loans stayed the same and then went away altogether.
Average starting pay for a job that requires a BA/BS degree: $25,000 -$30,000
?????
even if that were true, your pay would presumably advance throughout your lifetime while your student loans stayed the same and then went away altogether.
If a college grad is preoccupied with starting salary, it shows he has no confidence in him/her self at all. If that is the case, it was a waste of money and he should have headed for a McJob after grade 12.
There are decent job opportunities that people can take out of high school, but no one want's to get dirt under their pretty nails anymore. Aside from that, they tend to require some form of post secondary training, or even classroom time. Whole lot cheaper though, but less upward potential unless you start your own business or something.
I see entitlement issues with the younger crowd to an extent. They expect things, and they expect them too soon. They know and understand that an economic condition like the one we face today is going to cramp many people's lifestyles, and perhaps delay the progression of careers. What they seem to get upset about is when it happens to THEM. If only it was happening to everyone else BUT me. Sorry, we are all in this together. Hang your head up high and realize that tomorrow is another day.
And I don't know what to tell ya about the college grad crowd. I did the math, I read the fine print, I talked to all the slick salesman at the colleges and the banks running to give me money. Doesn't take a college graduate to figure out it's a rip off and a money grab. No matter, there are lines more waiting to sign up and take my place. And when they can't find jobs, or their jobs suck, while their college loan payments mirror a mortgage payment, we'll have a whole new generation trained to hate the big bad banksters. Pretty soon, antisemitism will run rife, and in combination with these obnoxious socialist policies our current administration favors, I think we know what follows next...
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