Which Scenario Is Better? To Go To College Or Not To Go? (2014, degree)

[Shorty458]

Originally Posted by Chicago87

Scenario One:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
• Goes to college to major in something "useless" and to "find herself".
• Takes out $30,000 a year in student loans to cover tuition, room and board, food, partying, vacations, spring break, entertainment, transportation, cost of living, clothes, summer vacation, iPhone, etc.
• Drops or fails a class here and there.
• Graduates in five years.

$30,000 x 5 = $150,000 in debt

The Result Five Years Later: $150,000 in crushing debt, no job, almost nil job prospects, no work experience, and broke.




Scenario Two:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
• Gets a minimum wage job that pays $7.25 an hour, 40 hours a week.
• Get a 3% cost of living wage after one year to $7.48 a hour.
• Get a promotion after two years and earns $10 a hour.
• Gets another 3% cost of living raise after 3 years and earns $10.30 a hour.
• After four years on the job, gets another promotion and earns $12.50 a hour now.
• After five years, gets another 3% cost of living increase to $12.88 a hour.

$7.25 x 40 x 52 = $15,080
$7.48 x 40 x 52 = $15,558
$10 x 40 x 52 = $20,800
$10.30 x 40 x 52 = 21,424
$12.50 x 40 x 52 = 24,960

Total money earned after five years = $97,822 EARNED

The Result Five Years Later: No debt, stable job that pays almost $13 an hour, five years work experience, and $97,822 EARNED.

These two scenario's are so different from each other and I'm not sure they are very normal situations. Most students won't need to take out 30K a year unless if they are going to a private college or out of state.

No work experience? When I was in college, all of my friends had part time jobs. I was a waitress for example, and since I had customer service experience, employers really liked that!

Finding a FT job right after graduating high school is not very likely, and yes they might have earned almost 100K, but that doesn't mean they have 100K sitting around. They will have expenses they need to pay. Car payment, insurance, gas, cell phone, maybe rent, credit cards, etc.

But then again, getting a college degree does not guarantee you a job. I have a friend who has a B.A. (I have an A.A.) who was laid off and could not find work and is now a part time cashier at Walmart.

Then again, on the other hand my husband and I are looking to relocate back to CT, and some of the job postings I am looking at are BA required, even though I had all the other requirements, there are a lot of positions that will not even give you the time of day since you don't have a B.A.

So yes - there are good & bad chances w/ the scenario's you listed.

[EzPeterson]

Originally Posted by Chicago87

Scenario One:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
• Goes to college to major in something "useless" and to "find herself".
• Takes out $30,000 a year in student loans to cover tuition, room and board, food, partying, vacations, spring break, entertainment, transportation, cost of living, clothes, summer vacation, iPhone, etc.
• Drops or fails a class here and there.
• Graduates in five years.

$30,000 x 5 = $150,000 in debt

The Result Five Years Later: $150,000 in crushing debt, no job, almost nil job prospects, no work experience, and broke.




Scenario Two:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
• Gets a minimum wage job that pays $7.25 an hour, 40 hours a week.
• Get a 3% cost of living wage after one year to $7.48 a hour.
• Get a promotion after two years and earns $10 a hour.
• Gets another 3% cost of living raise after 3 years and earns $10.30 a hour.
• After four years on the job, gets another promotion and earns $12.50 a hour now.
• After five years, gets another 3% cost of living increase to $12.88 a hour.

$7.25 x 40 x 52 = $15,080
$7.48 x 40 x 52 = $15,558
$10 x 40 x 52 = $20,800
$10.30 x 40 x 52 = 21,424
$12.50 x 40 x 52 = 24,960

Total money earned after five years = $97,822 EARNED

The Result Five Years Later: No debt, stable job that pays almost $13 an hour, five years work experience, and $97,822 EARNED.

Ah yes, life is routinely built on simple choices with guaranteed outcomes.

[omaraz]

Originally Posted by Chicago87

Scenario One:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
• Goes to college to major in something "useless" and to "find herself".
• Takes out $30,000 a year in student loans to cover tuition, room and board, food, partying, vacations, spring break, entertainment, transportation, cost of living, clothes, summer vacation, iPhone, etc.
• Drops or fails a class here and there.
• Graduates in five years.

$30,000 x 5 = $150,000 in debt

The Result Five Years Later: $150,000 in crushing debt, no job, almost nil job prospects, no work experience, and broke.


Scenario Two:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
• Gets a minimum wage job that pays $7.25 an hour, 40 hours a week.
• Get a 3% cost of living wage after one year to $7.48 a hour.
• Get a promotion after two years and earns $10 a hour.
• Gets another 3% cost of living raise after 3 years and earns $10.30 a hour.
• After four years on the job, gets another promotion and earns $12.50 a hour now.
• After five years, gets another 3% cost of living increase to $12.88 a hour.

$7.25 x 40 x 52 = $15,080
$7.48 x 40 x 52 = $15,558
$10 x 40 x 52 = $20,800
$10.30 x 40 x 52 = 21,424
$12.50 x 40 x 52 = 24,960

Total money earned after five years = $97,822 EARNED

The Result Five Years Later: No debt, stable job that pays almost $13 an hour, five years work experience, and $97,822 EARNED.

As with many of your posts, I'm not sure why you go out of your way make college look evil unless one is working in a STEM field but in five years of school it's possible but unlikely that someone is spending $150k for an undergraduate degree.

On the other side of your scenario, making $24k/year is pretty low and if it takes five years to earn almost $100k then it's completely not worth it if there is no stability, and with $13/hr and no degree...there's no stability.

Not everyone that goes to college does so to "find themselves" or blindly spend money because they want to go to a particular school and not every high school graduate works five years straight without ever deciding to take some college courses or a degree program. Life isn't as simple as your two examples.

[davenj08]

Originally Posted by andywire

If you want to work a professional gig for a major corp, then yes, the college track would be ideal. Thing is, these types of positions represent a minority as far as jobs go. 80% of jobs out there today involve working for small/mid sized businesses, the real heart of the economic system. When you have 75% of the HS class pursuing a college degree, it should be obvious that we may be over educating society as a whole.

Worse yet, we're stuffing non college material through the college track, whether they will benefit from it or not. All we are doing is encouraging a bubble in the cost of college, which is bad for everyone except the colleges themselves.

Education in Asia is cheap and I fail to understand why it is so expensive in US. It costs less than 20k in tuition at a very decent univesity for a 4 year undergrad.

Maybe time to outsource our college education, even better outsource our students so they can go to other countries, do their college education and return back to US or whichever country can offer them the employment of their choice. This is already being done on a very small scale but why not do this on a larger scale? US based private schools should open branches in let's say Asia and allow US students to do their full-time 4 year college education there? Maybe a mixed model of 3 years outside of US and the final year here in US? Should cut down education cost significantly and make it more affordable.

[ggumbo]

Originally Posted by davenj08

Education in Asia is cheap and I fail to understand why it is so expensive in US. It costs less than 20k in tuition at a very decent univesity for a 4 year undergrad.

College education in Florida is cheap (for in state, public university, undergrads). For tuition alone going to a university like UF, FSU, or UCF would cost someone about $5,000-$6,000/year!!! Not to mention the Bright Futures Scholarship and Florida PrePaid, both are available for ANY Florida resident to earn/use.

In college I had a 100% academic scholarship, but had friends who paid/took out loans. But I never once heard anyone talk about loans/debt of more than like $20,000.

[davenj08]

Originally Posted by ggumbo

College education in Florida is cheap (for in state, public university, undergrads). For tuition alone going to a university like UF, FSU, or UCF would cost someone about $5,000-$6,000/year!!! Not to mention the Bright Futures Scholarship and Florida PrePaid, both are available for ANY Florida resident to earn/use.

In college I had a 100% academic scholarship, but had friends who paid/took out loans. But I never once heard anyone talk about loans/debt of more than like $20,000.

Education should be inexpensive. Even college education. It should be looked as an investment in the youth, in the society, even if it means government has to set up more State universities, Community colleges and trade schools and spend a large amount of money. It will have a far better impact on the society (and return on investment) than handing out welfare and unemployment over extended periods because of lack of skills.

[ggumbo]

Originally Posted by davenj08

Education should be inexpensive. Even college education. It should be looked as an investment in the youth, in the society, even if it means government has to set up more State universities, Community colleges and trade schools and spend a large amount of money. It will have a far better impact on the society (and return on investment) than handing out welfare and unemployment over extended periods because of lack of skills.

Agreed, it shouldn't be expensive. One thing I really admired when I was going to college in FL was that in-state tuition was so much cheaper compared to other schools. FSU, UF, and UCF are all well regarded public universities and in-state tuition at those three schools are less expensive than lower ranked schools in other states!

However, to stay competitive, FL is increasing tuition every single year.

[mdovell]

Originally Posted by davenj08

Education in Asia is cheap and I fail to understand why it is so expensive in US. Should cut down education cost significantly and make it more affordable.

It's subsidized...that's why.

What gets people into a school are largely grades and payment. You don't pay you don't get in. You don't have say at least a 2.0 you can't get in.

When demand is subsidized for anything prices go up.

When supply is subsidized for anything prices go down.

Here's some examples.

When the food surplus is subsidized that means low cost food here. For example the student lunch program has supply subsidized. That is there's so much food that the government takes some and gives it to a student lunch program. It is cheaper to buy student lunches in a school than any other place in the country. Infact I even knew people after graduating high school that came back in for a $2 lunch vice principal saw him and he was asked to leave

If demand is subsidized it is not creating more capasity. Example Boston Red Sox. Fenway park sells out constantly (except 2012 season). Ticket prices go up with winning teams and the number of seats expands but they will never lower ticket prices. Cable television might be considered another in that what you pay subsidizes the demand for other stations. So the only way to expand viewers for them is the number of channels. What was once "57 channels and there's nothing on" is now 550 channels with still nothing on are cable companies going to lower prices? Probably not.

So basically demand is assured for a college education and thus the loans are assured. So from there the capacity is maximized and there's no real incentive to lower prices.

So how do we lower prices? Well we reverse it. FAFSA would be replaced with block grants to states to expand their university systems. From these systems would generate more competition and without FAFSA there would be fewer attending classes which would cause them to lower prices.

Basically you break up a monopoly and get its new parts to compete with one other. Remember AT&T? Yes things were simpler back then but do we really think we'd have all the technology with smart phones if the old AT&T was still around?

So what's blocking this? Well competition would outright drive wages down of professors and staff and one might argue the value of the degree itself.

[wideworld]

Originally Posted by Chicago87

Scenario One:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
• Goes to college to major in something "useless" and to "find herself".
• Takes out $30,000 a year in student loans to cover tuition, room and board, food, partying, vacations, spring break, entertainment, transportation, cost of living, clothes, summer vacation, iPhone, etc.
• Drops or fails a class here and there.
• Graduates in five years.

$30,000 x 5 = $150,000 in debt

The Result Five Years Later: $150,000 in crushing debt, no job, almost nil job prospects, no work experience, and broke.




Scenario Two:

• 18 year old high school graduate.
  
• Gets a minimum wage job that pays $7.25 an hour, 40 hours a week.
• Get a 3% cost of living wage after one year to $7.48 a hour.
• Get a promotion after two years and earns $10 a hour.
• Gets another 3% cost of living raise after 3 years and earns $10.30 a hour.
• After four years on the job, gets another promotion and earns $12.50 a hour now.
• After five years, gets another 3% cost of living increase to $12.88 a hour.

$7.25 x 40 x 52 = $15,080
$7.48 x 40 x 52 = $15,558
$10 x 40 x 52 = $20,800
$10.30 x 40 x 52 = 21,424
$12.50 x 40 x 52 = 24,960

Total money earned after five years = $97,822 EARNED

The Result Five Years Later: No debt, stable job that pays almost $13 an hour, five years work experience, and $97,822 EARNED.

Let me know who put this guarantee in writing for you and signed on the dotted line.

[drunkwithwords]

I graduated high school about seven years ago. I went to college but dropped out after a couple years. The figures for someone who hasn't graduated college is somewhat accurate. I started off at the very bottom earning about $7.70 an hour, finally found an office job that paid twice as much, and now I'm in a cushy office job making more than I ever thought I would. Not a lot to many but for me, it's great as I have little debt, no car, and a simple life.

From the figures you have, of course it would be intelligent to choose the path with no debt. But college can be beneficial for many people. Some people receive scholarships, grants, their parents pay, etc. Others enter a field that they are passionate about, and they can only get into that field with a degree. Depending on the amount of debt and the field they are entering, it could be paid off rather quickly.

Conversely, someone who doesn't want a college degree won't be without debt at some point. Ever had a car break down on $9.00 an hour? Some folks (like me) went to college for a few years and just realized it wasn't for them. I couldn't afford school on my own and had to take out loans. Being young, I didn't realize the importance of living frugally, so I spent a lot of money (on my credit cards of course) on fast food and nice "things." Basically, I was really stupid with my money. Not saying everyone else will be, but figures drastically change when you factor in certain events that can change someone's ability to make money/pay off debt.