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Truck drivers definitely should not be calling themselves "operating engineers." There is a craft trade know as operating engineers (from the old days, much like a locomotive engineer but in plants). They could be getting cross union there.
It's a non-union state.
Heck, if the guys who test soil density can be called test engineers, why can't the truck drivers and machine operators call themselves operating engineers?
At the concrete plant, the guy that mixes concrete is called the concrete engineer. No, he doesn't have any credential.
I will only be down there for a few months as they scramble to find a permanent bridge engineer for that job. I've been quite annoyed by the overuse of the title engineer for everybody down there. Up here in my home state if you're not a PE you're not an engineer, period.
It says more about the worker, than the company, if they're calling themselves the title. Even more is said if they're taking some sort of joy/pride from such a title. I can accept a job tomorrow. If my title was "Monkey Girl" or "Madam President of the Branch", I wouldn't call myself either. I would take the Monkey Girl job if it paid more money. However, I could imagine someone who has low self esteem thinking being the "President of the Branch" (when the company has 100s of "presidents") meaning they've made it. It's a way to make stupid workers complacent without a raise. At last two jobs, I had a title that was basically sounded like I was an executive. I didn't go around calling myself to coworkers or clients, because I knew it was misleading. I didn't ask for it, it was the name of the position before I got there. Really, this is something to blame on employees. If employees stopped calling themselves untrue titles and demanded money instead, it would stop. This reminds me of the episode of Cheers where Rebecca either doesn't want to, or can't, give Woody or Sam a raise and dupes both into taking jobs with titles and no raise.
Whoa, hold your horses. Where did anyone say that the employees were proudly proclaiming themselves the title? I know of it because of Subway's ridiculous promotional materials. Never once heard an employee say it.
Anyway, it is a strange idea that people fall for getting a fancier title instead of a raise. My assumption is that if the job duties have increased enough, it requires a new title to reflect it and should come with a raise.
Not participation trophies, just adults who want to feel important. The fancy titles are funny though and a bit insulting. If your title is "engineer," you better have the college degree to match.
That's just ridiculous. I get in a medical setting having your full credentials listed because they each have a meaning that matters to the public. When you see a Dr you want to know they're an MD. If I'm seeing a nurse I'd want to know it's an R. N. with a BSN or an APRN etc...
Making up titles for stuff that doesn't exist is ridiculous, especially the High School Graduate nonsense.
LOL, True. In all fairness the person requesting the High School Graduate sign was asking because it was becoming a joke. He does not have an office, like the Materials Manager guy. So his request was in a joking manner.
Heck, if the guys who test soil density can be called test engineers, why can't the truck drivers and machine operators call themselves operating engineers?
At the concrete plant, the guy that mixes concrete is called the concrete engineer. No, he doesn't have any credential.
I will only be down there for a few months as they scramble to find a permanent bridge engineer for that job. I've been quite annoyed by the overuse of the title engineer for everybody down there. Up here in my home state if you're not a PE you're not an engineer, period.
An operating engineer is one who works in a Physical plant, such as a steam plant, boiler operation, chiller, Plant operation setting. Many places or locales require someone that is licensed to work in the field. City of Los Angeles requires a Licensed Boiler Operator and Building Operating Engineer.
I have known a few soils engineers. Each of them went to school to get a degree in Engineering. Civil Engineering to be exact. I don't know any truck drivers that went on to earn a BS in Driving a truck.
Actually, it is. My original point is being an engineer used to actually mean something. Nowadays, most people don't even think much of an engineer anymore because everyone is an engineer nowadays.
Going around with a density test gauge and writing down numbers is not an engineering work. Making actual design decisions in a hundred million dollar project is.
A few months ago, I was at my dentist office getting my teeth examined and cleaned. The dental hygienist while setting up was talking to me. She asked me what I did. I said I was a bridge engineer. She asked me if there's a lot of women in my industry. I said no. Then I told her we just got a couple girls in the office and we treat them like gold because there just aren't that many women engineers around. I don't care how politically incorrect this sounds, but the reality is in engineering the male to female ratio is horrendously lopsided. She then made a comment that left me bewildered. She said wow these new girls in my office must be really smart. Everything she drives by a construction site and sees a flagger, she thinks to herself wow she is really smart. I thought to myself did she just say being an engineer is the same thing as a construction worker?
I'm guessing what comes next will be nurses and nurse's assistants will be called a variation of doctor.
There's been several members here from time to time have admitted that they worked as a sanitation engineer, aka garbage collector. This title is rampant especially in California.
Every job evolves over time based on technological advances and other factors. But the general job responsibilities remain the same. Sure, my secretary doesn't type my emails for me, but she's still my secretary.
The president, for example, used to not have nuclear codes to worry about. Ever since we started having nukes, did we change his title to president-with-nuclear-codes?
Yes, it does. Vector is still in business.
My partner just applied to internships for next summer. He came across some "account managers" positions. He called them and asked them what the internship was for. It turned out it was for door to door knives sales.
Yep they are almost there with the medical field, they are called nurse practioners, the last step before they call them XXX doctors or some other such variation with doctor in the title (though the AMA may be preventing this which is why it has not occurred yet).
I think states need to start passing legislation making it a crime to call someone an engineer who is not licensed. It is deceptive and intellectually dishonest to the point of fraud.
If you are a new grad with an EIT then you say your an EIT.
An operating engineer is one who works in a Physical plant, such as a steam plant, boiler operation, chiller, Plant operation setting. Many places or locales require someone that is licensed to work in the field. City of Los Angeles requires a Licensed Boiler Operator and Building Operating Engineer.
I have known a few soils engineers. Each of them went to school to get a degree in Engineering. Civil Engineering to be exact. I don't know any truck drivers that went on to earn a BS in Driving a truck.
Having a BS in civil engineering does not make one a civil engineer. I don't care if the soil tester has a PHD in soil testing. His role is to take density tests, aka a test technician.
Let's look at it this way. Does the soil testing guy make any design decision? If something goes wrong, is he responsible? He takes readings and reports his findings to one of the engineers, who then gives a yay or nay.
I have known quite a few people with art degrees working at starbucks. Are these artists? What about the law school graduate who passed the bar exam but never found a job and work as a waitress? Is she a lawyer?
This is actually the first thing I tell all the young guys I train. Just because they got an engineering degree does not make them engineers. If they don't demonstrate it, they are not engineers.
Having a BS in civil engineering does not make one a civil engineer. I don't care if the soil tester has a PHD in soil testing. His role is to take density tests, aka a test technician.
Let's look at it this way. Does the soil testing guy make any design decision? If something goes wrong, is he responsible? He takes readings and reports his findings to one of the engineers, who then gives a yay or nay.
I have known quite a few people with art degrees working at starbucks. Are these artists? What about the law school graduate who passed the bar exam but never found a job and work as a waitress? Is she a lawyer?
This is actually the first thing I tell all the young guys I train. Just because they got an engineering degree does not make them engineers. If they don't demonstrate it, they are not engineers.
If she passed the BAR then yes she is technically a lawyer and if an engineer is a registered PE then they are an engineer even if they were forced into some sub par job due to circumstances.
Being a doctor, lawyer or engineer is OUTSIDE of the job title. You get to take the title with you where ever you go. YOU are the engineer not the employer who gives you the label. We don't completely work for the company store ... yet.
Even if your job roll is a soils tech if you have a PhD you are a doctorate of what ever field, or if you have a PE you are an engineer. His roll might be a soil tech because he is desperate and his wife does not want to leave that school district for a few years but he still gets to call himself an engineer.
Now someone with an associates that barely covers algebra, nope most certainly not an engineer, I don't care what job responsibility the company embues.
I would even take it a step further and say that a PE that got their PE without examination is not an engineer by title (which texas was doing for a period of time until they realized no one could get comity because it was a joke).
If a company wants to have a monkey making design decisions that monkey is not an engineer and the company will pay for the consequences when things go awry.
We need to start bringing back serious jail time for CEOs that are cutting corners like this to line their pockets.
If you have young people working for you as "engineers in training" who don't even have an engineering degree it makes me question what your actual quals are? Yes, some how people make it through rigorous programs and still manage to boondoggle a project, but to say that removing all barriers to entry is a good idea is throwing out the baby with the bath water.
Keeping high barriers to entry at least helps keep a lot of the fly by nighters out of the profession, just because some slip through does not mean we abandon the entire certification process.
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