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Old 09-13-2018, 07:17 PM
 
Location: Twin Cities
5,831 posts, read 7,723,596 times
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Are you suggesting that people not be allowed to quit at will?
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Old 09-13-2018, 07:31 PM
 
Location: southern california
61,286 posts, read 87,497,027 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenfield View Post
Are you suggesting that people not be allowed to quit at will?
I was asked for an example of an employer asking for loyalty I gave it
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Old 09-13-2018, 08:56 PM
 
2,762 posts, read 3,190,223 times
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All you have to do is see how lately employers have been whining about how candidates are ghosting them, yet employers have been doing this to candidates for a very long time.

i.e. the employers demand loyalty, yet they don't give it.

In other words, employers sure can dish it out, but they can't take it.
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Old 09-14-2018, 05:36 AM
miu
 
Location: MA/NH
17,770 posts, read 40,206,433 times
Reputation: 18106
Quote:
Originally Posted by High Altitude View Post
All you have to do is see how lately employers have been whining about how candidates are ghosting them, yet employers have been doing this to candidates for a very long time.

i.e. the employers demand loyalty, yet they don't give it.

In other words, employers sure can dish it out, but they can't take it.
IMO much of the problem with employers is... Wall Street. When companies go public, their stockholders demand that there are profits and expect stocks to go up. This causes companies to get focused on their numbers and led to employees getting the shaft.

And the hate should not be directed solely to the Wall Street traders, but also to the public buying the stocks and demanding profitable goals without a conscience. And not just the "wealthy public" but any person with a 401K or pension fund.

It's just a downside to capitalism. But no system is perfect. Every system has its good and bad sides.

My solution is to never only work for one employer. I usually have several side part time employers. And another reason for that is that no workplace is perfect, and working different places keeps me from feeling trapped and unhappy at one workplace. Usually, I am only feeling fed up at the management or co-workers at only one place at a time. Haha.

I also have really good antique picking skills (self taught) and I also pick up additional work skills all of the time (I was a grill cook at a PGA tournament recently and for three days was grilling for seven hours straight at a time). It's just not wise to keep all of ones eggs in one basket. I always have a Plan B for any situation. When I finally retire, I have a hot dog cart ready to go.
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Old 09-14-2018, 06:17 AM
 
5,985 posts, read 2,923,871 times
Reputation: 9026
Quote:
Originally Posted by High Altitude View Post
All you have to do is see how lately employers have been whining about how candidates are ghosting them, yet employers have been doing this to candidates for a very long time.

i.e. the employers demand loyalty, yet they don't give it.

In other words, employers sure can dish it out, but they can't take it.
Employers don't give loyalty. They don't give you a paycheck?

You work for them, not the other way around. They make the rules, not you. Did you forget that?
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Old 09-14-2018, 10:25 AM
 
2,129 posts, read 1,780,561 times
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US unemployment is way higher than 3.1%. They do a lot of hand waving such as ignoring anyone who has been out of work for over a year to make the rate SEEM lower than it actually is, plus a high percentage of the "employed" are either under-employed (not enough hours) or they are paid very low wages, or both.

I'll move to any European country that will have me (as long as I can afford to live there - and note that there are a LOT of places in the US I can't afford, either). I had actually planned to move to Canada, but became disabled before I accomplished that. I truly and completely regret putting it off too long.

Yes, "at will" employment needs to die. "At will" is interpreted BY EMPLOYERS to mean that they have no responsibility to their employees whatsoever. It is routinely used to penalize anyone the employer doesn't like. For instance, my brother was fired by an employer after the guy got on my brother's fakebook page and found he had posted some anti-homophobic statements. He TOLD my brother this was why he was being fired, but there were no witnesses, and in an at-will state, you can be fired for no reason at all. So OFFICIALLY he was fired for no reason at all, but in FACT he was fired because the guy was such a flaming bigot he wouldn't tolerate anyone who doesn't share his heinous bigotry.
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Old 09-14-2018, 10:34 AM
 
8,316 posts, read 3,942,256 times
Reputation: 10658
Quote:
Originally Posted by AmericaBravoCharles View Post
I'll keep it short and sweet for now:

I'm an American who has worked in several other developed countries that don't have at-will employment. I've found that in these countries, work productivity is as high as, and morale is much higher than, in the standard American workplace.

The concept of at-will employment seems to me to be very outdated. I don't necessarily want a prototypical western European-style system, where it can be very difficult to terminate one's employment. I'd be fine with a Canadian-style system, which means at-will, but with a series of legally-defined precautions and procedures that employers must take to advise an employee of their performance before letting them go.

Does the U.S.-style system of at-will employment need to die? Short of government intervention, what would it take for this to happen?
Don't forget that at-will works both ways. Yes, an employer can pretty much fire you at any time for any reason other than race, age, gender or sexual or religious orientation. But you as an employee are also able to quit at any time for any reason to move to a better job or for any other reason. No strings attached. For whatever benefit employers gain from firing at will, the risk of attrition is significant when valuable and hard to replace employees can walk out the door at any time.

Last edited by GearHeadDave; 09-14-2018 at 10:47 AM..
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Old 09-14-2018, 10:36 AM
YAZ
 
Location: Phoenix,AZ
7,708 posts, read 14,101,831 times
Reputation: 7045
Quote:
Originally Posted by High Altitude View Post
All you have to do is see how lately employers have been whining about how candidates are ghosting them, yet employers have been doing this to candidates for a very long time.

i.e. the employers demand loyalty, yet they don't give it.

In other words, employers sure can dish it out, but they can't take it.
No kidding.

I can understand not responding to the hundreds (in some cases), of resumes/applications that folks submit.....but not responding to a candidate after an interview?

Very unprofessional.
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Old 09-14-2018, 11:24 AM
 
3,271 posts, read 2,194,657 times
Reputation: 2458
Quote:
Originally Posted by miu View Post
I see no reason to protect slackers and give them job security.
Lol @ "devout atheist humanist"
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Old 09-14-2018, 02:14 PM
 
Location: Paranoid State
13,044 posts, read 13,887,772 times
Reputation: 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by miu View Post
IMO much of the problem with employers is... Wall Street. When companies go public, their stockholders demand that there are profits and expect stocks to go up.
The major stockholders: public sector union pension plans such as CalPERS and CalSTRS. Are you prepared to tell public sector union employees that their future gold-plated pensions & Cadillac health care will be cut?


Other major shareholders: individual people with their 401K plans, IRAs, and Roth-401K and RothIRAs, saving for their retirement.

We're talking actual people. Some are widows & little old ladies who put food on the table based on the returns from the companies in which they own stock.
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