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Oh okay, well I did write it so they send down the lawyer immediately after arrested like you said.
He doesn't work just for the gang only though, he is a lawyer who works a at a law firm that will take on any rich clientele.
So he would operate in the way he normally operates or so I would assume for the character. Now you say that the lawyer would know that he is working for a gang before someone is arrested.
But why is that? The gang has never had any members arrested before, so they never had any business to do with a lawyer before. So why would the lawyer know of this gang from before, since this is the first arrest in the story? It seems to make no sense for the lawyer to work for the gang beforehand, cause there are no arrests beforehand. So therefore, the lawyer wouldn't have anything to do for them before that really.
Oh okay, well I did write it so they send down the lawyer immediately after arrested like you said.
He doesn't work just for the gang only though, he is a lawyer who works a at a law firm that will take on any rich clientele.
So he would operate in the way he normally operates or so I would assume for the character. Now you say that the lawyer would know that he is working for a gang before someone is arrested.
But why is that? The gang has never had any members arrested before, so they never had any business to do with a lawyer before. So why would the lawyer know of this gang from before, since this is the first arrest in the story? It seems to make no sense for the lawyer to work for the gang beforehand, cause there are no arrests beforehand. So therefore, the lawyer wouldn't have anything to do for them before that really.
I thought this was a notorious gang? What sort of gang is it, are they big players in drug trade, just kids in the hood type gang, what? Why is the cop so sure a gang is involved in the cops death vs a criminal not part of a gang if the cops aren’t even familiar with them?
What kind of lawyer is it, and where did the gang leader get him from? I don’t think it’s realiztic that this gang leader is so under the radar the cops don’t know who he is, yet a gang member would divulge it to a stranger, lawyer/client privilege or not, they’d get a lawyer who was used to dealing with criminal activity and who they know can be trusted. That’s usually someone with a foot on the “dark side” himself.
Also most lawyers who take on the very wealthy as clients are well
Known. Wouldn’t the gang leader realize hiring some well known very high price lawyer would arouse suspicion if the gang leader is supposed to appear to be just a street thug? Also it’s very hard to believe this gang has been operating long enough and is a big enough player to have amassed millions (enough to pay a $500 an hour lawyer) and never had anyone arrested along the way and no one knows who the leader is, even other gangs or criminals. Most gang leaders work their way up to be leader and have criminal records a mile long.
Think about Breaking Bad. Do you think it’d be believable if Jesse got arrested, Walter paid for a lawyer neither of them know, but gives Jesse the okay to tell this lawyer who he works for, and the lawyer writes down “Walter White is Heisenberg (or whatever his name was) and puts it in a file? Wouldn’t it appear too easy, and sloppy, of Walter? Wouldn’t ALL the cops be suspicious if a punk like Jesse had a high-priced lawyer who normally defends Wall Street types or CEOs?
Basically the gang is going unknown to the police and they are going around committing a series of serial rapes, around the city and city area. They are not known accept for two suspects. One of them is arrested earlier in the story, and the lawyer gets the charges dropped when there is not enough evidence.
But the police only know these two suspects, and do not know the other members. Once the gang knows that the police know the two suspects, the gang leader orders the two gang members, to just play it cool and not make contact with them and let do not let the police know that they are part of a gang, and just act innocent and normal.
I didn't really write how the gang leader got the lawyer, as the story already starts out with the lawyer arriving to represent the client after the arrest. It's told mostly from the main character's POV, so we do not see how the gang met the lawyer. But I would assume that the gang leader did his research on what lawyer would be the best and then called him once one of the members was arrested.
But yes I wanted to have it so that the cops do not know who the gang leader is. They know their is a gang going around committing these types of crimes, but they do not know who they are, accept for two suspects.
The reason why the gang member divulges certain information to the lawyer, is so the lawyer can put up a better defense. But I think the more important question is why wouldn't an arrested person tell the lawyer certain details of the crime to help a lawyer put up a better defense? It's privileged information, so it can't be used to hurt the client. If a lawyer writes it down, the police cannot legally use it, so they are still legally safe. So why not tell the lawyer therefore?
Perhaps the term wealthy was an overstatement, the leader is not a millionaire at all but he can afford to pay for a lawyer that a lot of criminals who are indigent by comparison, could not.
As for the gang wanting have a lawyer who is use to dealing with criminal activity that they could trust, is there a lawyer that is use to dealing with this type of criminal activity? The lawyer is still bound by attorney client privilege, so he is going to divulge any details about the case, given to him by the client.
As for criminal records, the police do not know who any of them are, so they do not know if they have records or not. The one of them who was arrested does not have a record. The gang has also been very careful to leave no prints at the crimes, and whatever dna they did manage to leave behind, none of their DNA is on file so far. So the police do not know who they are.
So they are a notorious gang, cause the police and public knows that a gang is going around committing these crimes but they do not know who any of them are, aside from two suspects at this point.
Now you mentioned Breaking Bad, and asked would Walter hire a lawyer he didn't know. He did do that when Jasper got arrested in the Better Call Saul episode though. He didn't know who Saul was and hired a new lawyer to represent Jasper. So Walt already did do that.
Now as far as Walt giving Jesse the okay to tell him, in my story the guy who is arrested doesn't have to give the name of the leader. He can just tell the lawyer certain details of the crime that maybe the main character could piece together and figure out how to track down the leader from there.
But I think the bottom line question, is, why wouldn't a lawyer want to keep notes for himself so he won't forget anything on the case? It's privileged and cannot legally be used by the police, so why not make notes?
Basically the gang is going unknown to the police and they are going around committing a series of serial rapes, around the city and city area. They are not known accept for two suspects. One of them is arrested earlier in the story, and the lawyer gets the charges dropped when there is not enough evidence.
But the police only know these two suspects, and do not know the other members. Once the gang knows that the police know the two suspects, the gang leader orders the two gang members, to just play it cool and not make contact with them and let do not let the police know that they are part of a gang, and just act innocent and normal.
I didn't really write how the gang leader got the lawyer, as the story already starts out with the lawyer arriving to represent the client after the arrest. It's told mostly from the main character's POV, so we do not see how the gang met the lawyer. But I would assume that the gang leader did his research on what lawyer would be the best and then called him once one of the members was arrested.
But yes I wanted to have it so that the cops do not know who the gang leader is. They know their is a gang going around committing these types of crimes, but they do not know who they are, accept for two suspects.
The reason why the gang member divulges certain information to the lawyer, is so the lawyer can put up a better defense. But I think the more important question is why wouldn't an arrested person tell the lawyer certain details of the crime to help a lawyer put up a better defense? It's privileged information, so it can't be used to hurt the client. If a lawyer writes it down, the police cannot legally use it, so they are still legally safe. So why not tell the lawyer therefore?
Perhaps the term wealthy was an overstatement, the leader is not a millionaire at all but he can afford to pay for a lawyer that a lot of criminals who are indigent by comparison, could not.
As for the gang wanting have a lawyer who is use to dealing with criminal activity that they could trust, is there a lawyer that is use to dealing with this type of criminal activity? The lawyer is still bound by attorney client privilege, so he is going to divulge any details about the case, given to him by the client.
As for criminal records, the police do not know who any of them are, so they do not know if they have records or not. The one of them who was arrested does not have a record. The gang has also been very careful to leave no prints at the crimes, and whatever dna they did manage to leave behind, none of their DNA is on file so far. So the police do not know who they are.
So they are a notorious gang, cause the police and public knows that a gang is going around committing these crimes but they do not know who any of them are, aside from two suspects at this point.
Now you mentioned Breaking Bad, and asked would Walter hire a lawyer he didn't know. He did do that when Jasper got arrested in the Better Call Saul episode though. He didn't know who Saul was and hired a new lawyer to represent Jasper. So Walt already did do that.
Now as far as Walt giving Jesse the okay to tell him, in my story the guy who is arrested doesn't have to give the name of the leader. He can just tell the lawyer certain details of the crime that maybe the main character could piece together and figure out how to track down the leader from there.
But I think the bottom line question, is, why wouldn't a lawyer want to keep notes for himself so he won't forget anything on the case? It's privileged and cannot legally be used by the police, so why not make notes?
I’m confused. If all the gang does is go around and raping people, where do they get their money from? Why is the leader paying all this money for a lawyer it could be hundreds of thousands of dollars if court were required. Even if it’s not a wealthy person’s lawyer. Where does the gang leader get his money?
Also why does this policeman believe that there was a gang behind the murder of the cop, and why is it more important to find the leader than the other members if the gang as a whole murdered the cop? Why didn’t the police use possible jail time as leverage to try to get the gang member to talk before the charges were dropped? Why aren’t they surveilling him and the other known member?
Also, the police would not be allowed to simply “give up” looking for a serial rapist gang a city. The mayor and the press would not let them, it would be big news nationally if they was a gang of serial rapists loose in the city, let alone killing a cop on top of it. Every resource would be directed to finding a cop killer and updates would go all the way up to the mayor. It requires some serious suspension of disbelief to believe that the entire department just says “oh well we can’t find him we give up” and this one person is the only one who is determined to find them.
Also, if he were suspected of being part of the serial rape gang when he was arrested, they would’ve brought his victims in to see if they can pick him out of a lineup, recognize his voice, etc. They’d have taken DNA and matched it to samples taken from the victims after the rapes. What exactly was he arrested for?
The gang leader is a doctor so he is somewhat rich from that. If I need to write him so he has to get a cheaper lawyer, I can write it like that.
The gang didn't murder a cop. What happens in is, is that later on in the story, during a chase and shoot out between the main character and the gang, another cop is caught in the crossfire and shot accidentally. The main character plants evidence to make the other police believe that the gang did it, as part of his plant to bring the gang into a trap and bring them down. So the main character makes the other police think that the gang murdered the cop.
The main character doesn't have to find the leader necessarily, I just thought it would be easier for him to manipulate the leader into a trap later on, if he knew who the leader was, since the leader is the one who calls the shots, and is it's best to manipulate him therefore. But I don't necessarily have to have him find the leader particularly, as long as it will still work.
And the police did use jailtime to try to get the arrested gang member to talk, but he still wouldn't talk, cause his lawyer said he can fight it, and he did, and the lawyer gets the charges dropped, so he doesn't talk therefore. But the police still tried.
The police do not simply give up, but they do not know what else to do. Since the charges were dropped, they can't keep surveillance on the two suspects forever, since they did not have enough evidence to begin with, so they can't keep 24 hour surveillance forever. So the police are waiting to get lucky, but the main character wants to actually get something done and not wait for any more crimes to happen.
After the cop is killed which is later on though, the police and everyone is on it for sure of course, but that is later on in the story. But the police do not know who the gang is besides a couple of suspects, where as I wanted the main character to know more, but he has to execute a plan to bring them down himself since he did certain things that he cannot tell his department such as hacking into a lawyer's files, or things like that. So the main character has to come up with a plan himself to bring them down. The police are still on it and still looking, it's just they are playing by their own police rules, where as the main character's plan requires having to sneak around and manipulate the gang, which the police cannot do in the legal capacity that the main character does. So it's not that the police give up, they are just legally at a dead end, compared to the main character who is willing to think outside the legal box and try things like reading a lawyer's files to find certain details that could help.
But we've seen this done in other thrillers countless times. For example in the TV show 24, the whole country is looking for terrorist groups every season, yet Jack Bauer still chooses do work separately on his own from them, cause he prefers to do things his way. But when I talked to real police officers for research, they said that the police cannot keep surveillance on someone for 24 hours a day for months on end, after he is released for lack of evidence. So is what the officers said true then?
The gang leader is a doctor so he is somewhat rich from that. If I need to write him so he has to get a cheaper lawyer, I can write it like that.
The gang didn't murder a cop. What happens in is, is that later on in the story, during a chase and shoot out between the main character and the gang, another cop is caught in the crossfire and shot accidentally. The main character plants evidence to make the other police believe that the gang did it, as part of his plant to bring the gang into a trap and bring them down. So the main character makes the other police think that the gang murdered the cop.
The main character doesn't have to find the leader necessarily, I just thought it would be easier for him to manipulate the leader into a trap later on, if he knew who the leader was, since the leader is the one who calls the shots, and is it's best to manipulate him therefore. But I don't necessarily have to have him find the leader particularly, as long as it will still work.
And the police did use jailtime to try to get the arrested gang member to talk, but he still wouldn't talk, cause his lawyer said he can fight it, and he did, and the lawyer gets the charges dropped, so he doesn't talk therefore. But the police still tried.
The police do not simply give up, but they do not know what else to do. Since the charges were dropped, they can't keep surveillance on the two suspects forever, since they did not have enough evidence to begin with, so they can't keep 24 hour surveillance forever. So the police are waiting to get lucky, but the main character wants to actually get something done and not wait for any more crimes to happen.
After the cop is killed which is later on though, the police and everyone is on it for sure of course, but that is later on in the story. But the police do not know who the gang is besides a couple of suspects, where as I wanted the main character to know more, but he has to execute a plan to bring them down himself since he did certain things that he cannot tell his department such as hacking into a lawyer's files, or things like that. So the main character has to come up with a plan himself to bring them down. The police are still on it and still looking, it's just they are playing by their own police rules, where as the main character's plan requires having to sneak around and manipulate the gang, which the police cannot do in the legal capacity that the main character does. So it's not that the police give up, they are just legally at a dead end, compared to the main character who is willing to think outside the legal box and try things like reading a lawyer's files to find certain details that could help.
But we've seen this done in other thrillers countless times. For example in the TV show 24, the whole country is looking for terrorist groups every season, yet Jack Bauer still chooses do work separately on his own from them, cause he prefers to do things his way. But when I talked to real police officers for research, they said that the police cannot keep surveillance on someone for 24 hours a day for months on end, after he is released for lack of evidence. So is what the officers said true then?
So the cop is a bad and crooked cop, you said earlier he wasn’t. Planting evidence is as bad as it gets. Also why is this cop so eager to get this one gang he’s willing to sell his soul, allow the people who actually DID kill the cop get away, and possibly lose his job for it? Also why would a doctor be a gang raper in his spare time? It doesn’t make much sense. You don’t say what race you’ve made these people but be careful there.
I don’t know, there’s a lot of things that don’t make sense to me. I don’t understand the purpose of the gang. Is the gang some sort of fetish group for professionals who like to rape women? What Doctor would be involved in some sort of a gang that just goes around raping people?
I don’t understand why a cop would be so hot to get this gang that he would let the people that actually did kill the cop go. Your cup is a bad cop, a crooked cop if he plans evidence. You said he was just hacking files that could be forgiven, planting evidence is pretty major especially when it results in a cop killer going free because he made the cops think someone else did it. For what reason is the cup so upset us with this gang, that he’s willing to let someone who shot a cop in crossfire go completely in order to catch this gang? The gang they had the shoot out with sounds way more dangerous than the gang of rapists. They have actually killed someone. Yet the cop is willing to let them go in order to catch the other gang? Why?
I also think a gang of serial rapists terrorizing a city would be a big deal. It affects tourism and it would have the people who live in that city up in arms. Yes they would spend the money to surveille people for as long as it took in order to catch them. Unless you’re setting it in a ghetto environment, which people outside that area wouldnt care that much about. But if you do that, I wouldn’t expect much audience support for a white cop planting false evidence against a gang of color. I still don’t understand his motivation for that though. What is the evidence that he plants?
The cop becomes a crooked cop later. Just not at first. Basically he develops into one as the story goes on, he becomes much more cynical and willing to do what it takes more since the villains keep getting away with their previous crimes.
Basically the gang is going around doing it because they they are suffering from involuntary celibacy, and they want to strike back at society and send a message cause of how they are treated.
The cop is one of the rape victims of the gang earlier in the story, and the gang didn't leave enough evidence to prosecute, so that is why is so determined to get them. As for the gang's race, I am not sure, and I have left them raceless in the script. I would assume they are the majority race of the city I have decided to set it in. I haven't picked a city yet but an American city of some sort.
Basically the cop starts out lawful, but then as he cannot get the gang more and more he becomes darker, such as resorting to breaking into files or invading privacy rights to find out info, but then as a cop gets killed, he uses that later as his chance to trap them, etc. So he becomes darker as it goes along.
.
Basically the evidence he plants is the gang's calling card, but this causes the cops to survey the two suspects they have more and keep watch and then the main character can lure them into a trap later.
The gang in the shootout is the gang of rapists, but he makes an accidental shooting, look much more intentional and deliberate and plants the calling card and also forces another character to make a phone certain phone call, to get the ball rolling. Things like that. I think it would all make sense in it's full form. The only parts readers have talked about are some of the legal system parts such as would a lawyer write something down or things like that. Mainly I just need a way for the main character to find out more about the gang, rather than just knowing two members who are trying to law low and keep quiet, since they are being watched.
The cop becomes a crooked cop later. Just not at first. Basically he develops into one as the story goes on, he becomes much more cynical and willing to do what it takes more since the villains keep getting away with their previous crimes.
Basically the gang is going around doing it because they they are suffering from involuntary celibacy, and they want to strike back at society and send a message cause of how they are treated.
The cop is one of the rape victims of the gang earlier in the story, and the gang didn't leave enough evidence to prosecute, so that is why is so determined to get them. As for the gang's race, I am not sure, and I have left them raceless in the script. I would assume they are the majority race of the city I have decided to set it in. I haven't picked a city yet but an American city of some sort.
Basically the cop starts out lawful, but then as he cannot get the gang more and more he becomes darker, such as resorting to breaking into files or invading privacy rights to find out info, but then as a cop gets killed, he uses that later as his chance to trap them, etc. So he becomes darker as it goes along.
.
Basically the evidence he plants is the gang's calling card, but this causes the cops to survey the two suspects they have more and keep watch and then the main character can lure them into a trap later.
The gang in the shootout is the gang of rapists, but he makes an accidental shooting, look much more intentional and deliberate and plants the calling card and also forces another character to make a phone certain phone call, to get the ball rolling. Things like that. I think it would all make sense in it's full form. The only parts readers have talked about are some of the legal system parts such as would a lawyer write something down or things like that. Mainly I just need a way for the main character to find out more about the gang, rather than just knowing two members who are trying to law low and keep quiet, since they are being watched.
I don’t have much time, but why isn’t there DNA evidence from the rapes, what did the gang member get arrested for, and why didn’t they take DNA from him?
You can’t tell me or an audience a doctor can’t get laid, that’s not believable. Are you making the gang socially awkward, handicapped, what is the reason they are un-doable? If the cops had a shoot out with the gang, why did the cop have to plant evidence making it appear that it was the gang? Is this set an a time before they were a body cams and cameras everywhere? If there was a car chase first didn’t they get a license number?
I think making them a gang of rapists makes it unnecessarily complicated and unbelievable. The only reason a gang would leave behind a "calling card" is they want notoriety, and they would have it, in spades. A gang of angry virgins wreaking havoc and revenge on a city including gang-raping a cop?? That would be a HUGE story, they would be on the news 24/7 and probably have a dozen threads here. There is no way the police department would say they don't have enough money to do enough, every resource would be going to this.
Is it that important to make them rapists (although a movie about such a gang might be interesting, told from their POV)? Why not simply make them a gang who makes their money from drugs? Just because they sell drugs doesn't mean they can't rape a cop, or a cop's little sister, to make her want revenge.
Well I thought of the gang of rapists idea first, and I feel that if I change them to a much more typical common gang for drugs or money, it just wouldn't be the same though. I feel that the themes would change completely, and it would be too different of a story.
When the first gang member is arrested, what happens is is that the one of the new recruits in the gang, has to rape a kidnapped victim to get pass one of their tests so to speak, but he gets cold feet, and morally cannot do it. He gets scared that the gang will now consider him a liability if he cannot do it, so he panics and takes off running, and the gang chases after him. The police on patrol spots them and manages to arrest one of them as the others get away. The police feel that they match the description of the gang, from the prior crimes, since they are wearing the same disguises, gloves and masks.
But since running after someone is not necessarily a crime, that they can prove, they were forced to let him go. The police can watch keep watching him and devote more manpower to him but I was told the department couldn't do it forever, when I asked the police. But if they can' I can write it so they put much more people on him, it's just that he is instructed by the gang, to stay put and not participate in any more of the crimes, so he doesn't arouse any more suspicion.
So since this is the only lead the police have, even if they put a whole city of manpower on him, all the guy is doing is acting normal, living out his private life away from the others.
So the main character gets ideas to do more drastic things, like hack into the lawyers files, or his email, and he is willing to invade privacy rights, to find out more about the gang, to build from there.
And I was thinking of writing it so that the main character doesn't report that he was raped, because he knows that the gang is not leaving hardly any evidence at the crimes, so he knows they won't be caught. He knows that if he reports it, that he will not be allowed to be part of the investigation of the case, so he figures why report it when they are not going to get caught from his report, and that he might as well, get on the case instead, if his superiors doesn't know he is one of the victims.
At least that is how I was told to write it, so he can get on the case. But I was thinking of writing it kind of like the show 24, where as even if all the police are on it, the main character still chooses do things his own way, and still gets ahead as a result. So couldn't I still have the main character get ahead his own way?
Also, if hacking into the lawyer's files would be a dead end, then perhaps I can have the main character track down other clues instead to find out who other members are, so he can monitor them, if that's better.
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