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All right I'm back...my apologies for not having posted in so long. Even though I'd said I wasn't going to post much anymore, and was obviously a bit peeved, that's not my style. A power outage that messed up my computer (because someone had, for some reason, unplugged it from the surge protector and decided that the wall outlet was a better place to plug it in) kept me from responding at first, and then a bit of a personal crisis where forum posts were the last thing on my mind.
But please let me point out, that even in my peeviness (yeah I just made that word up), I was polite, I didn't call anyone any names, I presented my viewpoint without getting into hysterics, and I did this all after several screwdrivers. I didn't even misspell any words while a few sheets to the wind, lol, so I'm pretty proud of myself.
Now getting into the meat of the matter. We have taken your guys' advice into consideration. I don't like being told 'no', but I do like being given reasoning behind cautionary advice and trying to overcome difficulties. The greenhouse...well. Okay so here's our NEW plan.
We'll have it inside our house, with supplemental lighting (most likely LED, expensive to start but they take very little in the way of power, they last for decades, and they aren't as harmful if they break as CFLs are). Windows on the south side, which yes, means more energy expenditures, but at least we're protected from wind, animals, etc. We've looked into the situation with aquaponics, and have found that we CAN set up a system in Alaska (as long as we don't sell the fish for human consumption without a permit and don't have the fish where they can be introduced into the wild, and don't pollute anything with the effluent [fish poop]). So, bring in a few aquariums, set up some grow beds and plumbing and all the other sorts of things associated with aquaponics, and the soil problem is solved as well. Not to sound like a know-it-all. I have done extensive research on it, though, and while this wouldn't be as large of a setup as we were planning here in AZ, it should suit our personal needs fairly well, and provide a dependable source of vegetables and protein, to supplement the small deer and hit-or-miss fishing. This was our plan for here, too, only we were going to grow enough to sell some if we stayed, while we won't be able to have a large enough system to do that if we move to POW Island.
Bears...we had actually figured on setting up an area with an electrified fence. I'd like to set that fence around the perimeter of the land if possible (also depends on the pricing), perhaps clearing out the trees just around the fenceline (if necessary...I could see some enterprising bear using a tree to bypass a fence), and leaving the main tree area inside the property alone, with adequate fencing for my goats & pigs so I don't have to search acreage for them in the rain, and so that I can rotate the areas they are in so that they don't wind up stripping the vegetation in any one area.
My cow...depends on if we can do a fodder system. Still looking into that, but that might be a case of just not worth it.
Energy...we're looking into getting a gasifier. It's no more costly than a solar setup, not dependent upon the sun in a place that rains a lot, and once we've lived there long enough then wood seems like it wouldn't be a problem, as long as we are willing to go chop it ourselves. Could also use our animals' manure, though that seems like it would be better saved for compost, since there are some vegetables I would want that wouldn't grow well in an aquaponic setup (like potatoes). I'm also looking to build (with hubby's help) a masonry stove for heat, so that we can save the electricity produced by the gasifier for important things, like the washer & dryer, lighting, perhaps power tools, and (of course) the computer. Oh, and the freezer/fridge, too, though I'm also looking into having a cold room for refrigeration, not too sure about that yet. We have several ideas we're exploring in that regard.
We're most likely going to go with a shipping container home. With LOTS of insulation. We have a basic layout that includes the greenhouse (lol), and while we are kind of sweating over the pricing of all this, we think that this whole plan is do-able in regards to being self-sufficient, NOT having to worry as much about basic necessities (other than clothing, medical supplies & toiletries, which we would stock up on before coming), and hopefully being able to weather any lack of employment without losing our lives or home. Or going on gov't assistance.
Does that sound better? I do appreciate the advice. I am very much an idea person, and I realize that some of my ideas are pretty out-there, but I can't stop thinking of ways to get past certain problems. Even if those ways don't wind up being feasible, often they point the way to other solutions that are.
Sounds like a fun adventure! I haven't provided any advice because I don't know a darn thing about POW. I'm an Interior gal but have lived in Anchorage occasionally for work.
All right I'm back...my apologies for not having posted in so long. Even though I'd said I wasn't going to post much anymore, and was obviously a bit peeved, that's not my style. A power outage that messed up my computer (because someone had, for some reason, unplugged it from the surge protector and decided that the wall outlet was a better place to plug it in) kept me from responding at first, and then a bit of a personal crisis where forum posts were the last thing on my mind.
But please let me point out, that even in my peeviness (yeah I just made that word up), I was polite, I didn't call anyone any names, I presented my viewpoint without getting into hysterics, and I did this all after several screwdrivers. I didn't even misspell any words while a few sheets to the wind, lol, so I'm pretty proud of myself.
Now getting into the meat of the matter. We have taken your guys' advice into consideration. I don't like being told 'no', but I do like being given reasoning behind cautionary advice and trying to overcome difficulties. The greenhouse...well. Okay so here's our NEW plan.
We'll have it inside our house, with supplemental lighting (most likely LED, expensive to start but they take very little in the way of power, they last for decades, and they aren't as harmful if they break as CFLs are). Windows on the south side, which yes, means more energy expenditures, but at least we're protected from wind, animals, etc. We've looked into the situation with aquaponics, and have found that we CAN set up a system in Alaska (as long as we don't sell the fish for human consumption without a permit and don't have the fish where they can be introduced into the wild, and don't pollute anything with the effluent [fish poop]). So, bring in a few aquariums, set up some grow beds and plumbing and all the other sorts of things associated with aquaponics, and the soil problem is solved as well. Not to sound like a know-it-all. I have done extensive research on it, though, and while this wouldn't be as large of a setup as we were planning here in AZ, it should suit our personal needs fairly well, and provide a dependable source of vegetables and protein, to supplement the small deer and hit-or-miss fishing. This was our plan for here, too, only we were going to grow enough to sell some if we stayed, while we won't be able to have a large enough system to do that if we move to POW Island.
Bears...we had actually figured on setting up an area with an electrified fence. I'd like to set that fence around the perimeter of the land if possible (also depends on the pricing), perhaps clearing out the trees just around the fenceline (if necessary...I could see some enterprising bear using a tree to bypass a fence), and leaving the main tree area inside the property alone, with adequate fencing for my goats & pigs so I don't have to search acreage for them in the rain, and so that I can rotate the areas they are in so that they don't wind up stripping the vegetation in any one area.
My cow...depends on if we can do a fodder system. Still looking into that, but that might be a case of just not worth it.
Energy...we're looking into getting a gasifier. It's no more costly than a solar setup, not dependent upon the sun in a place that rains a lot, and once we've lived there long enough then wood seems like it wouldn't be a problem, as long as we are willing to go chop it ourselves. Could also use our animals' manure, though that seems like it would be better saved for compost, since there are some vegetables I would want that wouldn't grow well in an aquaponic setup (like potatoes). I'm also looking to build (with hubby's help) a masonry stove for heat, so that we can save the electricity produced by the gasifier for important things, like the washer & dryer, lighting, perhaps power tools, and (of course) the computer. Oh, and the freezer/fridge, too, though I'm also looking into having a cold room for refrigeration, not too sure about that yet. We have several ideas we're exploring in that regard.
We're most likely going to go with a shipping container home. With LOTS of insulation. We have a basic layout that includes the greenhouse (lol), and while we are kind of sweating over the pricing of all this, we think that this whole plan is do-able in regards to being self-sufficient, NOT having to worry as much about basic necessities (other than clothing, medical supplies & toiletries, which we would stock up on before coming), and hopefully being able to weather any lack of employment without losing our lives or home. Or going on gov't assistance.
Does that sound better? I do appreciate the advice. I am very much an idea person, and I realize that some of my ideas are pretty out-there, but I can't stop thinking of ways to get past certain problems. Even if those ways don't wind up being feasible, often they point the way to other solutions that are.
After tinkering with shipping containers for awhile, I would recommend nothing but spray foam insulation. If nobody on POW does this, you'll want to have it done to your container somewhere and ship it unless you can do it yourself. I have some solar powered things in Juneau (and Hawaii) and they seem to do pretty well. New solar panels don't require direct sunlight (they produce electricity when its cloudy) and usually when the days are the shortest there is snow on the ground and the reflected light helps charge the batteries.
I have limited experience with hydroponics using an Aerogarden and Prepara units so I understand how the basic process works, and they produce good tasting vegetables, though admittedly I've only grown tomatoes and lettuce. Many people in Hawaii grow tilapia in kiddie pools and use the water for hydroponics. Most places on the big island have little or no soil so this practice is gaining popularity and the pumps can be solar powered. And of course they eat the tilapia when they get to size. You can buy tilapia food in 50 pound bags but you have to protect it from rodents. There is a parasite there called rat lungworm (in humans is literally eats your brain) that is spread by snails and the hydroponic food can be more easily protected from snails than stuff grown in soil. I've often wondered why there isn't more hydroponic food available. If you look at how big supermarkets are and they ship produce in from South America when they could be growing it themselves on their roofs.
As far as the cow goes, many people have tried that before and it has never worked out. Maybe you'll be the first, but shipping the food for the cow in has always been more expensive than shipping the cow products in. I would stick with goats.
Not to sound like a know-it-all or anything, but you can't bring even bring live fish intended for human consumption into the state of Alaska without a permit, unless F&G have changed their ways recently and forgot to tell anyone.
Ouch, Metlakatla. I wasn't being sarcastic when I said it, I was trying to show that I'd at least done some research on this, rather than spouting off whereof I knew not. But point taken, I will dig further. If tilapia are illegal, then can I assume that goldfish aren't? That's our backup plan, in case the information we received was out of date. Goldfish (or other ornamentals) would work, just wouldn't be as practical a venture for us, since we couldn't eat them...but then again, with the small setup we're talking about (maybe 300 gallons worth of fish tanks), it might not be very practical to do it with tilapia anyway. Maybe fresh water shrimp...unless, of course, F&G have laws about that as well. I don't know. Perhaps a permit would be something to look into after all.
We looked into spray foam insulation...and that's so expensive when you factor everything in. So we looked at other alternatives, and found Thermasheath, which from all we can find is the same stuff as the spray stuff, just in sheet form. We thought that if we used the 4" sheets that that would work, perhaps with a small amount of the spray foam to cover corners, etc. The R-factor is 28 for the 4".
Terracore, what you described with the tilapia is, essentially, aquaponics, and yeah it's the fish effluent that feeds the bacteria in the grow beds, that then produce what the plants need to thrive (and the process filters the water so it can be returned to the fish tank, to be recirculated again). It's amazingly awesome and doesn't pollute, doesn't strip the land of nutrients, and produces more meat per acre than growing cows does, PLUS a large amount of vegetables. Very very cool stuff. Way of the future & all that. Feed the world, rah rah rah. Okay I'll stop, lol.
As for feed for goats (and, maybe, the cow), we're thinking about a fodder system, where barley seed is put into a series of trays and allowed to germinate for 7 days (actual days vary, depending on who you ask, but that's the norm). The sprouted barley at 7 days is nutritious, and as you have a new tray being started every day, once you get it going then you have ready-to-serve fodder coming into play every day. You just have to keep it going. That's a very simplified explanation but that's basically it. Mold can be a problem, though, and I could see that being a factor in a rainforest setting, though I would think the temperature would inhibit that. Getting the barley seed in would also be something to consider, but would be less expensive (and easier to store) than hay.
Goats also like 'woody' materials to eat. They aren't necessarily grass eaters, and (much to my dismay) absolutely love trees, shrubs, bushes, you name it. So whatever roughage they would be missing out on with the sprouted barley fodder, they could make up for in eating from the land. Hmmm. Assuming nothing's poisonous, will have to check THAT as well.
I'll look into the new solar panels as well...thanks for the tip
stiffnecked, we could do that as well, and have considered it. It's definitely an option at this point, we had just liked the tilapia as an alternative in case we had rough hunting/fishing periods.
I don't mean this as a criticism, or as "don't move to Alaska," but...why are you set on PoW? It seems like all the things you want to do could be done easier and more affordably any number of places in the lower 48.
Why is it an "ouch"? The Alaska F&G website will tell you the same thing that I did. Perhaps you should have focused your research on the real regulations involving what you want to do rather than whatever you found on the internet that vaguely told you what you wanted to hear.
I'm guessing that your "research" went no farther than this page, which is an absolute joke of the first order:
I would advise that you not consider internet...resources...such as this to be any kind of gospel truth. The people on this site can't apparently can't even read, let alone spell, or they would have understood that the F&G official that they're quoting wasn't referencing anything other than ornamental aquarium fish. If you're planning on raising goldfish as a "backup plan", best of luck to you.
FFS. You can't even bring a dog into the state of Alaska without certification; what on earth makes you think that you can import live fish or fish eggs without some sort of regulation? You found some lame source on the internet and have the nerve to call that "research."
Personally, I don't give a rat's ass whether you grow your tulapia in aquariums in your container home up to the rafters on the bottom of your rooftop greenhouse, but you need to know that you.cannot.legally.import.live.fish.into.the.State .of.Alaska without going through the proper channels.and.even.then.it.is,a.very.difficult.proc ess. There is a reason why backyard fish farming doesn't happen in Alaska. Do some real research rather than trying to pass of tenuous internet postings as some sort of gospel truth.
I'd suggest that you become as self sufficient as possible, since I don't think that you're going to fit in with the locals. It isn't your "ideas" that won't fit in, but rather, as I stated before, your attitude. You seem to want to spit in the face of anyone who offers you advice, even though you supposedly came here asking for "advice."
Quote:
Windows on the south side, which yes, means more energy expenditures, but at least we're protected from wind, animals, etc.
Thank you so much for informing me that windows on the south side are "protected from the wind." I never would have known that if you hadn't been kind enough to mention it. Good Heavens, someone should have had the courtesy to tell the winds on POW that it just isn't polite to blow from that pesky south side, because they do it on a regular basis.
It has already been pointed out to you that livestock animals cannot adequately forage in a rain forest so let me say it one.more.time. The available forage materials don't contain enough nutrients to keep the animals alive. Again, the rain.leaches.out.nutrients.from.the.ground.
I'm glad that you're able to hold your own after consuming numerous cocktails.
That skill may be of more value to you than any of your other wild ideas.
But again, it isn't your wild ideas that are the problem. It's your attitude. You state that you don't "like to be told no"--but no one has told you "no" here. They've just tried to offer you the advice that you came here asking for.
Again, if you bring the attitude that you've portrayed here to POW, I sincerely hope that you can survive without jobs.
Best of luck to ya. I'm someone who has a small degree of influence over my friends and neighbors on POW...I won't be recommending your services to anyone.
Wow metlakatla i think kashta was just saying that the windows were protecting from the wind not that the wind did not blow from the south. You seem to have a serious chip on your shoulder. I am new to this forum but geez maybe you should leave threats out of it. My family and i are also looking at moving to pow island and my research involved calling the local feed store to inquire about bringing goats and the man who ran the store told me he owns several goats and they seem to forage while he provides only a bale a month of hay. Seems to me that his real world experience is research enough for me.
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and doesn't pollute, doesn't strip the land of nutrients, and produces more meat per acre than growing cows does, PLUS a large amount of vegetables. Very very cool stuff. Way of the future & all that. Feed the world, rah rah rah. Okay I'll stop, lol.
