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In my opinion, most people have simply had the Christian god in their lives sooooooooo long (from the cradle in the Fundamentalist and Pentecostal cases--fanatical parents feeding them Yahweh and Jaysuz, Jaysuz, Jaysuz morning, noon and night) that they cannot imagine life without him. He's like a bad habit or a bad marriage that they'd like to break out of but they either don't know how or are too chicken to try. Believe me, it takes a lot of guts to tell someone you've believed for 50 years can burn you to a crisp to take a flying leap into the nearest lake.
Most Christians probably don't have the guts and so they stay in this bad marriage to Jaysuz until they simply don't care any longer. Others are soooooooooo eager to jump into his arms that they say they can't wait to die so they can be with him. Such an attitude betrays a life devoid of any meaningful external factors to care for such as a spouse, children, career, interests, or anything else that gives meaning to life.
I think often of some poor schlub in here who once said, "All I want in this life is to [die so that I can] be with my beloved Lord and savior". Every time I think of his words I want to break down and cry like a baby. Imagine having nothing worthwhile to live for...a life spent day to day hoping that day is his last. What a pathetic tragedy. The only life he's going to get and he flushes it down the toilet hoping to die so he can join some man god that doesn't even exist.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillobyte
The problem with Christianity is this:
God and Jesus don't manifest an iota in an external sense that can be viewed by science. If God was external--that is, capable of being detected and measured, then God would be objective. But since all this goes on IN THE MIND of the Christian it's all subjective--one Christians feel nothing at all when he prays, another feels a slight moving in his soul, another feels a moderate infilling of something, and yet another gets so jazzed with the dopamine and endorphins firing off like Roman candles that the Christian rockets into an ecstatic orbit around the earth. None of this is real; it's all in the mind of the Christians and we all being individuals it stands to reason the Christians are all going to have different experiences with their emotions.
This guy I speak of, based on what I know about him, is all alone in the world. People like that are at greatest risk of putting all their chips on Jesus. We're social creatures. We've evolved that way so the species doesn't die out. Evolution has made us to desire the opposite sex so that we can procreate and design a family structure of some sort. A great number of us males in this modern screwed-up society crap out in the gene pool and thus, in the mating game. We're either short, fat, bald or ugly in any combination of those undesirable traits so that no member of the female species wants to mate with us. Evolution-wise a female wants to pass her genes on to the best of the species and believe me--short fat bald and ugly simply doesn't cut it in the mating game today.
Jesus becomes an easy substitute for a physical mate when these conditions are in play. The Christian starts off praying to Jesus and little by little he starts conversing with Jesus, then imagining life in heaven with him and before you know it the person is consumed with Jesus to the point he crowd out any possibilities however slight of a real person in his life because he's replaced any hope of having a physical relationship with a woman for a spiritual one with Jesus. Jesus becomes so real to him that Jesus is at the center of all his hope, ambitions and dreams. It gets to the point that he can't hope for anything except being with Jesus in heaven the way a normal person thinks of being with a beautiful wonderful spouse and children on earth. So I believe it is with this poor schlub I speak of.
This is part of the danger of Christianity. Trust me when I say it's no coincidence that Paul likened a Christian's relationship with Jesus to a marriage--you know--Jesus is the bridegroom, the Church is the virgin bride and we marry Jesus at the big wedding banquet in the sky-nonsense.
"For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ." 2Corinthians 11:2
This was no accident. It was a very cleverly-devised scheme by the Church to get pagans hooked on Jesus, and by extension the church leaders to keep them in money and power.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
Very, very occasionally I wander over to the Christianity sub forum when a thread catches my eye.
I don't stay long because, (sorry Christians) for me, it's like visiting an insane asylum.
I remember seeing a thread about the umm upcoming 'rapture'. The OP was so excited about being taken up she just couldn't wait.
For me, visiting the Christianity forum is like visiting tiktok. I'm there about 5 seconds before it's all too much. I think 'whoa!' and get out of there.
I never post there but it's an interesting window to see through.
I should mention that this poor guy I speak of who has expressed wanting nothing more than to be with his beloved savior--he and I have been locking horns for 15 years since I joined in 2008 so I think I know him pretty well, having read hundreds of his posts.
Last edited by thrillobyte; 04-06-2023 at 08:20 AM..
Very, very occasionally I wander over to the Christianity sub forum when a thread catches my eye.
I don't stay long because, (sorry Christians) for me, it's like visiting an insane asylum.
I remember seeing a thread about the umm upcoming 'rapture'. The OP was so excited about being taken up she just couldn't wait.
For me, visiting the Christianity forum is like visiting tiktok. I'm there about 5 seconds before it's all too much. I think 'whoa!' and get out of there.
I never post there but it's an interesting window to see through.
This, indeed.
I have posted on a few occasions but it's rare.
I remember a college class that was one of my favorites. It taught critical thinking, really. One of our weekly assignments was to pick up some trash tabloid paper, choose an article, and critique it.
It was there that I learned how to get past the "oh, come on" response to ridiculous statements ('man shocked back to life by electric eel').
Visits to the christian forum invokes the 'oh, come on' response and I know, from past experience, that critical thinking isn't going to do a damn thing to the religious.
Key word is inherent. We're animals with evolved brains on a planet in a universe. I don't see how there could be any kind of inherent or objective purpose or meaning to it all, without the supernatural being stuff.
You can still make your own purpose and meaning. Most atheists and agnostics do. It's usually something along the lines of kindness/compassion/love/wonder/adventure, etc.
There may be a "higher purpose" to human life if we are willing to make some bold assumptions about the future trajectory of our species.
If our descendants are able to colonize other planets and eventually spread to other systems in the galaxy, then they may be able to buy some time and delay the extinction of our species.
If there are alien civilizations out there that are way more advanced than us, then they may be able to help us solve many of our problems and establish a presence throughout the galaxy.
This is all pretty optimistic, but who knows? A lot of things can happen if luck is on our side.
There may be a "higher purpose" to human life if we are willing to make some bold assumptions about the future trajectory of our species.
If our descendants are able to colonize other planets and eventually spread to other systems in the galaxy, then they may be able to buy some time and delay the extinction of our species.
If there are alien civilizations out there that are way more advanced than us, then they may be able to help us solve many of our problems and establish a presence throughout the galaxy.
This is all pretty optimistic, but who knows? A lot of things can happen if luck is on our side.
At the species level, you could argue that all species of life (including ours), have the same task/goal, of survival, reproduction, continuance.
There seems to be a quality of all life in that it wants to live, and it wants to stay alive. So maybe you could call that a purpose, at that level. But that still doesn't speak to meaning. Meaning is more about the 'why'.
I remember a college class that was one of my favorites. It taught critical thinking, really. One of our weekly assignments was to pick up some trash tabloid paper, choose an article, and critique it.
It was there that I learned how to get past the "oh, come on" response to ridiculous statements ('man shocked back to life by electric eel').
Visits to the christian forum invokes the 'oh, come on' response and I know, from past experience, that critical thinking isn't going to do a damn thing to the religious.
Right, there's really no point.
And in any case I don't feel it's my place to rain on their parade.
Very, very occasionally I wander over to the Christianity sub forum when a thread catches my eye.
I don't stay long because, (sorry Christians) for me, it's like visiting an insane asylum.
I remember seeing a thread about the umm upcoming 'rapture'. The OP was so excited about being taken up she just couldn't wait.
For me, visiting the Christianity forum is like visiting tiktok. I'm there about 5 seconds before it's all too much. I think 'whoa!' and get out of there.
I never post there but it's an interesting window to see through.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kab0906
This, indeed.
I have posted on a few occasions but it's rare.
I remember a college class that was one of my favorites. It taught critical thinking, really. One of our weekly assignments was to pick up some trash tabloid paper, choose an article, and critique it.
It was there that I learned how to get past the "oh, come on" response to ridiculous statements ('man shocked back to life by electric eel').
Visits to the christian forum invokes the 'oh, come on' response and I know, from past experience, that critical thinking isn't going to do a damn thing to the religious.
INDEED!
To say it's an interesting window is putting it mildly. It's a 3-ring circus over there. I think management, in its infinite wisdom, decided to just ban hardline atheists and skeptics in the Christian sub because it's like mixing oil and water in a red-hot pan. Better to just leave the Christians by themselves to predict the different rapture dates and debate whether Jesus will ride to earth on a white horse or just take the subway.
VS.
Last edited by thrillobyte; 04-06-2023 at 11:25 AM..
At the species level, you could argue that all species of life (including ours), have the same task/goal, of survival, reproduction, continuance.
There seems to be a quality of all life in that it wants to live, and it wants to stay alive. So maybe you could call that a purpose, at that level. But that still doesn't speak to meaning. Meaning is more about the 'why'.
Survival and reproduction are biological motivations of all life. Meaning is a spiritual motivation exclusive to our consciousness (Spirit). Our experiences and knowledge grounded as they are in the physical and biological do not equip us to fully understand spiritual things.
Survival and reproduction are biological motivations of all life. Meaning is a spiritual motivation exclusive to our consciousness (Spirit). Our experiences and knowledge grounded as they are in the physical and biological do not equip us to fully understand spiritual things.
The world is chock full of people who claim to "fully understand spiritual things.". Problem is that they often violently disagree with each other. A pox on all their houses, say I.
Survival and reproduction are biological motivations of all life. Meaning is a spiritual motivation exclusive to our consciousness (Spirit). Our experiences and knowledge grounded as they are in the physical and biological do not equip us to fully understand spiritual things.
FYI, everything is part of the physical universe, including your brain, consciousness, and all your mystical new age mumbo jumbo. It's all made of atoms and sub-atomic particles.
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