School Ratings Thread - READ FIRST for school inquiries. (Atlanta: middle schools, gated)

[rcsteiner]

Originally Posted by RainyRainyDay

Thanks, RC. This is really Off Topic for the schools thread, but actually this forum is making me feel that the metro area is more socially and politically diverse than I had been able to perceive, and that's cheering me up a bit.

Well, it *is* a large metro area, after all, and even Cobb County has over 600,000 resident, most of them not in East Cobb.

[mistersocks]

Just read through all the posts here...lots of great information. Thanks to all of the posters.

We moved to ATL from Los Angeles in January and will be looking to buy a house at the end of the year. Since this real estate market we're in means we'll likely be trapped in that house for a LONG TIME, we've started obsessing about schools now. (We have a 1.5-year-old and a still-gestating fetus.)

I was hoping some folks could elaborate on the issue of teacher quality. I'm far more interested in a school with great teachers than one with an in-house TV station or a kindergarten Mandarin immersion program. When I was a public school student in Florida, there were 2 kinds of instructors: the inspiring, idealistic, driven superteacher on a mission and the government bureaucrat with tenure who would rather pop a tape in the VCR than actually teach. The good teachers were some of the best I ever had, but these saints were vastly outnumbered by the sloths.

I'd love to hear about your kids' teachers, in both public and private schools. Any info is great, but intown or Decatur info is especially appreciated, as we are looking to be in the city. I didn't move from LA to sit in traffic. :-)

[cmtiger]

OK.... I know Decatur so I'll take that one. As I mentioned, Decatur K-3 schools are ELOB schools. That means basically that they learn the curriculum by doing class-wide projects/studies on a larger subject rather than learning from drills or textbooks. My kid has a math workbook but no other textbooks. Of course there is some direct teaching but a whole lot of it happens in the context of the the expeditions.

For instance, kids might practice their math by calculating how much corn and other crops an Indian tribe needed to plant to feed everyone through the winter. That calculation would involve basic math operations as well as calendar knowledge and even a bit of an exposure to algabra concepts. They might practice language arts skills by writing about what they saw on a trip to visit an Indian pow wow or burial site or they might write poems about things that the Native Americans valued - or they might make a guide to Native Americans for kids in other classes to read. They might throw in some science by studying the seasons and how they affected the Indians or they might do some work on lunar phases, etc....

It is not easy to teach this way. I requires creativity to come up with the expeditions and team work between teachers to get the expedition off the ground b/c they are grade wide rather than class-wide. They also have to be organized because they have to be very sure that the expeditions cover all of the required GA curriculum. Flexibility and a sense of adventure is required too because often the kids get very excited about the expeditions and will start taking them in an unexpected direction. The teacher has to be able to decide if they can follow the new path without losing curriculum. If she can change direction a bit, she has to go and alter her lesson plans accordingly - which takes effort.

Teachers who are lazy just do not take on these type of schools so they really just don't apply. We do get a lot of applicants though. My kid's elementary is having to add a new kindergarten this year and they had over 40 qualified applicants for the teaching job.

As a result we have some very energetic and creative teachers - most of them also happen to be quite young. We actually lost several older teachers when we first implemented ELOB because they just didn't want to deal with it.

In the older grades... IB is similar in that it is a pain in the butt to teach curriculum through IB pedagogy so "lesser teachers" just don't apply.

I would say that at the K-5 level the vast majority of teachers here are outstanding - there may be one or two dudds. Middle school and high school in Decatur still have some sloths, but they are being weeded out at a good pace now that we have some effective principals over there. So I would think that they will have it worked out by the time your kids finally get there.

Hey, btw, tonight is ELOB Night at Oakhurst Elementary at 6:00 p.m. Why don't you come by and see an example of ELOB work (all the projects and studies are displayed) and meet some of the teachers so you can decide for yourself. Ms. Mack, the principal, will be just inside the front door. Just introduce yourself and tell her you are checking out the school. ELOB night is open to the public. Even your one-year old would have a good time - there is lots to look at.

[SoBuKev]

Thanks for the heads up on ELOB - I had never heard of that....looks promising. I have a 2 yr old so this stuff is getting to be very important to me.

[mistersocks]

cmtiger--thanks for this! Wish we could have made it to ELOB night...maybe there's another open house type event coming up soon?

ELOB sounds like an interesting approach, and I love that it weeds out the unmotivated teachers. Like any ambitious undertaking, I think it's all about the execution, and it sounds like they're doing a good job. And if there are only a few dim bulbs on the faculty, that's an incredible ratio.

Does Winnona Park Elem use the same pedagogy? (That's a new word for me, so I thought I'd try it out, haha.)

[cmtiger]

Yep - all K-3 schools in Decatur do - Winnona, Clairemont and Oakhurst.

All the schools are out for summer next Friday - so it's pretty much a free for all around here - lots of field days, field trips - visits to the "next" school for those "graduating," assemblies, etc. etc... You could always just get a tour though.

BTW, sorry for all the typos in my post - I was embarrassed to read it tonight! My fingers are really clumsy sometimes.

[mistersocks]

No need to apologize for typos, cmtiger...this is the internet! :-)

As long as I've got you here, I wanted to run this by you. I was discussing ATL schools w/a coworker and said that we were considering Oakhurst. Her reaction was "so you're going to go with a private school." I told her that the Oakhurst schools were considered to be excellent, like all the schools in Decatur, but she told me that there had just been some kind of gang shooting at the middle school.

This coworker isn't a kook or anything, but I'm assuming that she's gotten this story wrong. (Wasn't able to find anything on the internet.)

Clearly Oakhurst is in transition and there are people of vastly different income levels living side by side. Is there a lot of tension?

[globalnomad]

Readers of the school ratings thread might be interested in seeing the 2008 Newsweek and Washington Post Challenge Index.

"The Newsweek and Washington Post Challenge Index measures a public high school’s effort to challenge its students. The formula is simple: Divide the number of Advanced Placement, International Baccalaureate or Cambridge tests a school gave by the number of seniors who graduated in May or June. Tests taken by all students, not just seniors, are counted. Magnet or charter schools with SAT combined verbal and math averages higher than 1300, or ACT average scores above 29, are not included, since they do not have enough average students who need a challenge.

The rating is not a measurement of the overall quality of the school but illuminates one factor that many educators consider important.

The list includes all public schools with a rating of 1.000. There are nearly 1,400 -- the top 5 percent of all 27,000 U.S. high schools in encouraging students to take AP, IB or Cambridge tests. Also listed are the name of the city or school district and the percentage of a school’s students whose family incomes are low enough to qualify for federally subsidized lunches and who also apply for that program. The portion of subsidized-lunch applicants is a rough indicator of a school’s poverty level. High-poverty schools are at a disadvantage in persuading students to take college-level courses, but some on this list have succeeded in doing so anyway.

The Equity and Excellence rate is the percentage of all seniors who have had at least one score on an AP, IB or Cambridge test that would qualify them for college credit. The average AP Equity and Excellence rate for all U.S. schools is about 15 percent.

**Includes IB or Cambridge. All other schools use just AP."
Details of the rankings for Georga public high schools can be found at:

Challenge Index 2008 | washingtonpost.com (http://projects.washingtonpost.com/challengeindex/2008/ - broken link)

Georgia

RANK SCHOOL LOCATION STATE INDEX SUBS. LUNCH E&E
106 Walton Marietta Ga. 3.516 1 47.9
190 Lakeside Atlanta Ga. 2.844 33 44.2
197 Davidson Fine Arts Magnet Augusta Ga. 2.795 20 55.7
213 Campbell ** Smyrna Ga. 2.727 49.7 17.6
230 Chamblee Charter Chamblee Ga. 2.636 29 --
272 Centennial Roswell Ga. 2.52 17 43.9
301 Riverwood Atlanta Ga. 2.446 25 43
325 Milton Alpharetta Ga. 2.372 80 50.4
330 Berkmar Lilburn Ga. 2.356 63 24.4
343 Columbus Columbus Ga. 2.332 22 45.8
347 Northview Duluth Ga. 2.318 3.89 51.1
364 South Forsyth Cumming Ga. 2.279 7 25.9
407 North Gwinnett Suwanee Ga. 2.185 14 64.9
427 Lassiter Marietta Ga. 2.136 3.9 39.7
437 Norcross ** Norcross Ga. 2.117 48 26
477 Union Grove McDonough Ga. 2.038 14.5 23.3
495 DeKalb School of the Arts DeKalb Ga. 2.02 21 44.9
529 Roswell Roswell Ga. 1.967 21 38.7
530 Chattahoochee Alpharetta Ga. 1.966 7 50.7
555 Marietta ** Marietta Ga. 1.927 55 30
597 Duluth Duluth Ga. 1.861 33.5 34.3
600 Druid Hills Atlanta Ga. 1.858 38 28
649 Brookwood Snellville Ga. 1.76 12 38.2
669 Centennial ** Roswell Ga. 1.735 49.7 22.7
718 Central Gwinnett Lawrenceville Ga. 1.677 54 25
841 Wheeler Marietta Ga. 1.526 31 27.6
848 Harrison Keenesaw Ga. 1.517 3.77 --
879 La Grange La Grange Ga. 1.475 50 18.2
901 Parkview Lilburn Ga. 1.458 19 27.3
941 Avondale Avondale Estates Ga. 1.423 78.4 0.6
951 Osborne Marietta Ga. 1.411 71 10.8
981 Starr's Mill Fayetteville Ga. 1.376 5 34.5
1007 Peachtree Ridge Suwanee Ga. 1.35 22 28.3
1055 Clarke Central Athens Ga. 1.293 58 17
1063 Pope Marietta Ga. 1.286 1% 37.8
1073 Sprayberry Marietta Ga. 1.279 23 25.1
1105 McIntosh Peachtree City Ga. 1.249 7 34.1
1129 Alpharetta Alpharetta Ga. 1.228 8.56 44.8
1138 Carlton J. Kell Marietta Ga. 1.222 16.9 24.7
1141 Lakeside Atlanta Ga. 1.219 15 33.6
1154 Sequoyah Canton Ga. 1.204 10 22.4
1177 Grayson Loganville Ga. 1.179 21 n/a
1190 Dacula Dacula Ga. 1.162 27 15.7
1221 Glynn Academy Brunswick Ga. 1.137 n/a 19.4
1268 Tucker Tucker Ga. 1.094 48 19.86
1270 Eagle's Landing McDonough Ga. 1.091 29 19.8
1324 Collins Hill Suwanee Ga. 1.035 24.2 23.6
1340 Sandy Creek Tyrone Ga. 1.021 22 20.4
1343 Dunwoody Dunwoody Ga. 1.017 28.03 29.9

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by globalnomad

Readers of the school ratings thread might be interested in seeing the 2008 Newsweek and Washington Post Challenge Index.

"The Newsweek and Washington Post Challenge Index measures a public high school’s effort to challenge its students. The formula is simple: Divide the number of Advanced Placement, International Baccalaureate or Cambridge tests a school gave by the number of seniors who graduated in May or June. Tests taken by all students, not just seniors, are counted. Magnet or charter schools with SAT combined verbal and math averages higher than 1300, or ACT average scores above 29, are not included, since they do not have enough average students who need a challenge.

The rating is not a measurement of the overall quality of the school but illuminates one factor that many educators consider important.

The list includes all public schools with a rating of 1.000. There are nearly 1,400 -- the top 5 percent of all 27,000 U.S. high schools in encouraging students to take AP, IB or Cambridge tests. Also listed are the name of the city or school district and the percentage of a school’s students whose family incomes are low enough to qualify for federally subsidized lunches and who also apply for that program. The portion of subsidized-lunch applicants is a rough indicator of a school’s poverty level. High-poverty schools are at a disadvantage in persuading students to take college-level courses, but some on this list have succeeded in doing so anyway.

The Equity and Excellence rate is the percentage of all seniors who have had at least one score on an AP, IB or Cambridge test that would qualify them for college credit. The average AP Equity and Excellence rate for all U.S. schools is about 15 percent.

**Includes IB or Cambridge. All other schools use just AP."
Details of the rankings for Georga public high schools can be found at:

Challenge Index 2008 | washingtonpost.com (http://projects.washingtonpost.com/challengeindex/2008/ - broken link)

Georgia

RANK SCHOOL LOCATION STATE INDEX SUBS. LUNCH E&E
106 Walton Marietta Ga. 3.516 1 47.9
190 Lakeside Atlanta Ga. 2.844 33 44.2
197 Davidson Fine Arts Magnet Augusta Ga. 2.795 20 55.7
213 Campbell ** Smyrna Ga. 2.727 49.7 17.6
230 Chamblee Charter Chamblee Ga. 2.636 29 --
272 Centennial Roswell Ga. 2.52 17 43.9
301 Riverwood Atlanta Ga. 2.446 25 43
325 Milton Alpharetta Ga. 2.372 80 50.4
330 Berkmar Lilburn Ga. 2.356 63 24.4
343 Columbus Columbus Ga. 2.332 22 45.8
347 Northview Duluth Ga. 2.318 3.89 51.1
364 South Forsyth Cumming Ga. 2.279 7 25.9
407 North Gwinnett Suwanee Ga. 2.185 14 64.9
427 Lassiter Marietta Ga. 2.136 3.9 39.7
437 Norcross ** Norcross Ga. 2.117 48 26
477 Union Grove McDonough Ga. 2.038 14.5 23.3
495 DeKalb School of the Arts DeKalb Ga. 2.02 21 44.9
529 Roswell Roswell Ga. 1.967 21 38.7
530 Chattahoochee Alpharetta Ga. 1.966 7 50.7
555 Marietta ** Marietta Ga. 1.927 55 30
597 Duluth Duluth Ga. 1.861 33.5 34.3
600 Druid Hills Atlanta Ga. 1.858 38 28
649 Brookwood Snellville Ga. 1.76 12 38.2
669 Centennial ** Roswell Ga. 1.735 49.7 22.7
718 Central Gwinnett Lawrenceville Ga. 1.677 54 25
841 Wheeler Marietta Ga. 1.526 31 27.6
848 Harrison Keenesaw Ga. 1.517 3.77 --
879 La Grange La Grange Ga. 1.475 50 18.2
901 Parkview Lilburn Ga. 1.458 19 27.3
941 Avondale Avondale Estates Ga. 1.423 78.4 0.6
951 Osborne Marietta Ga. 1.411 71 10.8
981 Starr's Mill Fayetteville Ga. 1.376 5 34.5
1007 Peachtree Ridge Suwanee Ga. 1.35 22 28.3
1055 Clarke Central Athens Ga. 1.293 58 17
1063 Pope Marietta Ga. 1.286 1% 37.8
1073 Sprayberry Marietta Ga. 1.279 23 25.1
1105 McIntosh Peachtree City Ga. 1.249 7 34.1
1129 Alpharetta Alpharetta Ga. 1.228 8.56 44.8
1138 Carlton J. Kell Marietta Ga. 1.222 16.9 24.7
1141 Lakeside Atlanta Ga. 1.219 15 33.6
1154 Sequoyah Canton Ga. 1.204 10 22.4
1177 Grayson Loganville Ga. 1.179 21 n/a
1190 Dacula Dacula Ga. 1.162 27 15.7
1221 Glynn Academy Brunswick Ga. 1.137 n/a 19.4
1268 Tucker Tucker Ga. 1.094 48 19.86
1270 Eagle's Landing McDonough Ga. 1.091 29 19.8
1324 Collins Hill Suwanee Ga. 1.035 24.2 23.6
1340 Sandy Creek Tyrone Ga. 1.021 22 20.4
1343 Dunwoody Dunwoody Ga. 1.017 28.03 29.9

Note: #1141...the second time Lakeside-Atlanta is listed. #1141 is more than likely a type-o...it is probably supposed to be Lakeside-Evans in Columbia County (Metro Augusta).

[kagan3903]

thanks, I like the list instead of a link of blah blah...