MARTA Expansion into Clayton = Long awaited Commuter Rail?

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by gtcorndog

I understand the desire for rail to Macon. I get that. I don't think it is warranted though. The discussion jumps the shark when other goofy extension ideas with bad assumptions are thrown in. I'd focus on the cities in the 40 mile range that have a chance of developing a good commuter base. That is where the real value is IMO.

At this point in time of a fast-growing population that is continuing to boom and place vehicles on a severely-constrained regional road network, most outlying places within that 40 mile range (Cumming, Buford, Canton, Lawrenceville, etc) are in need of regional HRT, both for logistical and economic development purposes.

Originally Posted by gtcorndog

Given the finite resources we have, spending money on plans that don't provide real, immediate, needed transportation solutions is not a good strategy. Doing "nice to haves" is not a luxury we have.

I agree with your point that the transportation projects that are implemented need to have an immediate impact if we are using our almost totally-depleted current resources to pay for them.

But we should not and cannot invest only in transportation projects that provide immediate and very short-term traffic relief. It is critically-important that we also invest heavily in transportation projects that have a long-term benefit for purposes of both logistical enhancement and economic development.

And if we don't have the resources available to invest in those transportation projects that provide a long-term benefit (heck, right now we don't even really have the resources on hand to invest in many transportation projects that provide a short-term benefit) then we have to find ways to come up with the resources to do so....That's because transportation is something that is critical to our existence.

Without a viable and functioning multimodal transportation network (roads and transit) our economy and our quality-of-life will suffer greatly.

Originally Posted by gtcorndog

That is why I oppose the streetcar and the Clifton Corridor projects.

While I'm not necessarily all that crazy about the Atlanta Streetcar as a logistical benefit, I do think that the Atlanta Streetcar is an excellent economic development purposes. I just wish that the Atlanta Streetcar project was financed and funded differently and much more creatively with real estate development revenues and a Value Capture taxing district (a CID, TAD and TIF) instead of being so overly-reliant on federal aid.

The Clifton Corridor is an absolute logistical necessity because of the lack of easy automobile access to and from one of the Atlanta region's major employment and activity centers in the Emory University area (Emory is accessible mostly only by severely-congested 2-lane roads). Though I do think that an area as important as Emory University needs grade-separated, dedicated-track Heavy Rail Transit access instead of Light Rail Transit that would attempt to operate on constrained area streets that are already crowded with traffic during daylight hours.

Originally Posted by gtcorndog

I do think that projects like the MARTA 400 extension, the 285/400 interchange reconstruction and BRT in Cobb are good projects because they either impact a massive audience or offer a transportation solution that doesn't currently exist along routes that don't have alternatives. I am in favor of mor express buss or BRT service because it offers much of the same benefits without the same capital requirements. I don't care if BRT isn't sexy. It offers a solution and if traffic is bad enough, people will ride it.

I agree that projects like the GA 400 MARTA extension and the I-285/GA 400 interchange are good investments of transportation funds.

I also agree that there is a place for higher-frequency and/or higher-capacity bus service to be utilized in the Atlanta region. Though, I think that higher-frequency and higher-capacity bus service (including BRT, where adequate) needs to be operated in conjunction with high-capacity passenger rail transit service....And I think that it is critically-important that both higher-capacity bus service and high-capacity passenger rail transit service be self-funded with revenues from streams like transit-owned real estate development, Value Capture taxing districts, private sponsorships and private donations.

Also, like others have stated before, I don't think that BRT is the absolute best high-capacity transit option for a high-capacity transportation corridor like Cobb Parkway which at this point desperately needs high-capacity passenger rail transit service and has been in need of high-capacity passenger rail transit service for many years.

Originally Posted by gtcorndog

If you have to convince people transit is cool in order to get them to ride, then the transportation situation isn't bad enough for them to switch. If the alternative is more efficient than driving, they'll ride. It isn't a hard concept IMO.

One of the reasons that people are not riding transit in large numbers in large major metro region with severe traffic congestion problems like Atlanta is because the transit that is often available is inadequate in its availability (...at this point Metro Atlanta's transit offerings are relatively extremely-limited in geographical reach, inconsistent in its availability and inconvenient to use, particularly for those who live outside of the I-285 Perimeter).

That's a good point that people will ride transit if it is more efficient than driving....Which is why we need to make the investments that are necessary to make transit as quick, efficient, effective and convenient to use as possible so that transit will be a viable option for most commuters in a large major metro region with as severely-constrained of a road network as Atlanta.

[mattee01]

Originally Posted by Gulch

Reading the comments section made my eyes burn.

Mine too... Geez these people alone could disprove the theory of natural selection.

[MathmanMathman]

Originally Posted by bu2

Basically the hassle and security delays in airports make 200-600 miles work well for trains.

Lately, I've been zipping through the TSA. Doesn't bode well for HSR.

[cqholt]

Commuter rail from Atlanta to Lovejoy is: ‘The Little Engine That Could’ | SaportaReport
Maria Saporta explains:

There was a misunderstanding because of the wording of the FTA letter,” said Lemon, who has had her facts checked out with all the powers that be. “The deobligating of those funds basically said to Georgia DOT, because you haven’t done anything in a long, long while, we are going to take your name off those funds. When you get ready to use these funds for construction of the commuter rail line, then you simply apply to the FTA to reauthorize those funds.

- See more at: Commuter rail from Atlanta to Lovejoy is: ‘The Little Engine That Could’ | SaportaReport

The letter stated that the reason for deobligating the funds was because over the years, GDOT “was unable to secure the local financial share” of the cost of the project. The Clayton tax would qualify for that local share.

- See more at: Commuter rail from Atlanta to Lovejoy is: ‘The Little Engine That Could’ | SaportaReport

[tikigod311]

I read the letter from NS and its not quite as bad as Maria made it out to be. It would be nice if they took a more welcoming or cooperative tone towards commuter rail, but I can understand their position.

NS is potentially being put in a position to look like the bad guy due to rosy and inaccurate cost projections. In the future, after environmental studies and engineering have taken place and the real cost is figured, NS is going to look like they are being uncooperative when they require costly infrastructure necessary to lessen the impact to their operations. All while politicians blame NS for being uncooperative, when really they were using inaccurate cost projections to sell the project from the get go.

But I agree, this can be a huge benefit to NS with certain infrastructure upgrades.

[demonta4]

MARTA CEO begins to build relationship with Clayton businesses | Clayton News Daily

[LynnHarris]

Congressman Scott: Clayton MARTA vote could revive Macon to Atlanta commuter line - Atlanta Business Chronicle