Is it possible to have an honest discussion about Austin's traffic? (Pflugerville: middle-class, homes)

[mimimomx3]

Why is it, that when we talk about how bad Austin traffic is, we talk about trains, buses, toll roads, ziplines (!), but never HOV lanes? If the goal is to improve traffic, why not incentivize people to reduce the numbers of cars rather than increa$e the number of road$? Gee, I wonder. Could it be because there is no money to take from people's pockets when we create HOV lanes????

[steve78757]

Originally Posted by mimimomx3

Agreed.

I 2nd that.

[austin-steve]

Originally Posted by Komeht

...
How about we meet at 3PM, that way we don't hit any of the traffic.

Would it be rude to say ... "duh"?

I'm still not sure what you're really getting at, unless it's the obvious inane point that Realtors should not trick buyers into not knowing Austin traffic is bad by scheduling 3PM appointments. Uh. Which, if that's your point, is to insult buyers by assuming they could possibly be that stupid, that they're clueless about traffic and commuting as a factor in the house hunting process.

By the way, regarding the $150K 3/2/2 1600 sqft house with big yard on a culdesac in Pflugerville, in which of your coveted low rise compounds would you redirect such a buyer (after you berate them for driving a car) were you their trusted housing adviser?

I stick with my original post. As bad as Austin traffic is now, enjoy it because it ain't getting any better, ever. That horse left the barn long ago.

Steve

[CarnivalGal]

Originally Posted by mimimomx3

Why is it, that when we talk about how bad Austin traffic is, we talk about trains, buses, toll roads, ziplines (!), but never HOV lanes? If the goal is to improve traffic, why not incentivize people to reduce the numbers of cars rather than increa$e the number of road$? Gee, I wonder. Could it be because there is no money to take from people's pockets when we create HOV lanes????

Because that would take away space for bike lanes and future bike lanes. Haven't you noticed how all the bike lanes are improving traffic? Especially on the roads where they reduced the number of car lanes to add one.

[CarnivalGal]

Originally Posted by hoffdano

It is interesting to read all this. Long time resident here. And a frequent enough traveler within the US and elsewhere. Last fall was in Barcelona for a week. Rode the trains regularly. Have ridden Paris Metro multiple times. Been in a small town in central Switzerland and am very impressed with Switzerland's complete integration of bus/rail/boat transit schedules. Been on many trains in Japan including the Shinkansen. As good as these rail systems are - the Swiss one is the standout. It was obviously done with a PLAN, a commitment, and serious budget. Oh - it helps that Switzerland is one country, with only 8M people, and is rich.

What I see missing when people talk about how great some of these world cities are is that no one seems to care that London costs perhaps 75% more to live than it does in Houston. In San Francisco - $800,000 doesn't go very far in terms of housing. Yes you can walk to the coffee shop. And you will send your kids to private school because the public schools are not worthy.

Komeht just doesn't seem to accept that many people, especially families, want affordable homes and good public schools. They need both of those things together. It really is meaningless to most people to live near Uchi. They can't afford it anyway. Let's say he gets his wish and Austin somehow makes it easier to add non-high rise housing in Austin. How many people would then have a central Austin option that don't today? If the 1500 sq. ft. house is $400K it ain't gonna fly except for DINKs. Schools won't improve until the demographics improve. It has nothing to do with AISD's quality.

The laughable part of this discussion is bicycles. Except in the downtown area, bicycles are not practical. Austin is too hot and too hilly for anyone to ride more than a mile or two. Maybe during an apocalyptic event that takes away all gasoline and electricity....

The high costs of living in those areas reflect the fact that there is not really a lot of room to build new housing. There is a limited number of homes available, so the law of supply and demand drives home prices up. We don't have that issue.

[Devout Urbanist]

Originally Posted by hoffdano

What I see missing when people talk about how great some of these world cities are is that no one seems to care that London costs perhaps 75% more to live than it does in Houston. In San Francisco - $800,000 doesn't go very far in terms of housing. Yes you can walk to the coffee shop. And you will send your kids to private school because the public schools are not worthy.

Not true. Edward Glaeser's The Triumph of the City makes this very point. World cities like New York and Paris are expensive in large part because of building ordinances. Their transit networks are not the problem. In these cities it is difficult to add new housing. There is not enough supply to meet the demand so owners are free to charge insanely high prices. Places that build a lot of new housing (not just high-rise condos) tend to be cheaper. Houston and Chicago are relatively cheaper big cities because they are constantly putting up moderately-priced housing for middle-income residents. Cities like Austin can attract middle-income people to the urban core if they will simply eliminate zoning. Let people live and work wherever they want in the city. I don't think schools are as much of an issue in Austin. AISD is pretty good. Filling in the urban core by making it more affordable for middle-income families would only make it better.

[centralaustinite]

Isn't the initial prep work for an HOV lane on Mopac happening right now?

[CptnRn]

Originally Posted by mm57553

Because that would take away space for bike lanes and future bike lanes. Haven't you noticed how all the bike lanes are improving traffic? Especially on the roads where they reduced the number of car lanes to add one.

I just don't understand why I rarely ever see anyone using those bike lanes. Obviously "if you build it, they will come!" Right? So why isn't that working?

I wonder if it has something to do with the heat and humidity here, and during wet years, intense rain, which all makes bicycle commuting impractical for most.

Heck, even when I had a motorcycle, commuting from Rivertown to UT, the weather made it impractical to use at least 50% of the time. A bicycle was out of the question.

[curious1111]

I'm with Austin-Steve on this topic and thread....

Too late, too dumb...

I hope the commute for those 360 residents doubles, then triples until they cry uncle and agree to widen 360. Plenty of room, wont impact the scenery, only help with traffic.

[hoffdano]

Originally Posted by Devout Urbanist

Not true. Edward Glaeser's The Triumph of the City makes this very point. World cities like New York and Paris are expensive in large part because of building ordinances. Their transit networks are not the problem. In these cities it is difficult to add new housing. There is not enough supply to meet the demand so owners are free to charge insanely high prices. Places that build a lot of new housing (not just high-rise condos) tend to be cheaper. Houston and Chicago are relatively cheaper big cities because they are constantly putting up moderately-priced housing for middle-income residents. Cities like Austin can attract middle-income people to the urban core if they will simply eliminate zoning. Let people live and work wherever they want in the city. I don't think schools are as much of an issue in Austin. AISD is pretty good. Filling in the urban core by making it more affordable for middle-income families would only make it better.

I didn't say those cities were expensive because of transit systems. My point is that these "world" cities are not affordable to many people. That's all.

Improving transit in Austin doesn't make Austin any more affordable. If transit into central Austin is improved (by rail, bus, or road) it doesn't make that part of Austin any more affordable. The new homes Komeht envisions are not going to be the price of homes in the burbs. I do not believe Austin could build enough homes in central Austin at a cost of $200K to display all 20,000 people in Pflugerville (for example).