Car2Go + DriverlessCar + Uber - Better than mass transit someday? (Austin: taxis, price)

[austin-steve]

Originally Posted by Austin97

I thought with uber and lyft they quoted you a rate when you requested a car. I have no idea if that is the case or not.

That's the case. You know exactly what it will cost before you even start. Which you actually don't with a cab.

People who don't want to pay the higher fees during busy times don't have to. They can call a cab and wait 1+ hours for it to get there. Or pay the "surge" rate for a quicker ride. Anyone who says they were "surprised" by the cost of the ride is either lying or wasn't paying attention to the screen when operating the app.

Steve

[Aquitaine]

They do. I don't understand all this fracas over surge pricing.

Try to find a regular cab, even in NYC, on New Years' Eve. Good luck! It's a roll of the dice. And you best be going somewhere where they can get a fare back, because otherwise they won't go, no matter what the law says.

If they ended surge pricing, then it would work just peachy right up until there were no cars available. Then you'd have a thousand people all clicking 'refresh' on their app, or else some sort of queue system where everyone who wanted to go home by 10:30 PM would get a ride and everyone who wanted to go home at 12:15 AM would be stuck waiting for hours. I can see it now: 'DRUNK MAN DIES IN DITCH WHILE WAITING FOR UBER.'

When demand exceeds supply, cash is unfortunately the only mechanism that can be relied upon that lets people decide whether it's really worth it. And it does tell you in advance what your fare will be (usually approximately, since traffic can impact it, but not that much). Otherwise you'd be looking at a queue or a lottery or something that would be 'more fair' but totally unreliable. That doesn't work for transportation.

[hoffdano]

Originally Posted by verybadgnome

So is their a ceiling to what uber and lyft can charge based on demand? I have heard of 10 times the base rate in Austin at certain times.

Good thing about a conventional taxi is you know the rate before hand.

You know the RATE, but not the final FEE.

With Uber when you get in the car you know how much the ride will cost (not the rate per mile which doesn't matter).

[CptnRn]

This news article talks about people who were surprised by the surge pricing they had to pay. http://www.austincmgsite.com/news/ne...-florid/nhy43/

Granted the article says that Uber repeatedly tells the user in advance what the cost will be. But I can see this can be a huge problem if you take Uber downtown when prices are reasonable, and then discover that when you want to go home the price as quadrupled. That makes Uber a very undesirable transportation option by my standards.

[Aquitaine]

That makes Uber a very undesirable transportation option by my standards.

Only to the extent that all transportation is undesirable when the facts on the ground change between departure and arrival.

Surge pricing isn't all that common - certainly not here in Austin. It's peak times during big events. If you're going into town for one of those events, you probably already know that. SXSW? New Years' Eve? ACL? Uber's going to cost more.

You can also try Lyft if you don't like Uber - I like both but I don't have any particular loyalty to one.

Uber's surge pricing reflects the same reality that makes finding a cab impossible. If your trip home is 4x your trip out, then a cab is probably also going to tell you that he'll pick you up in an hour.

[Roadking2003]

Originally Posted by austin-steve

People who don't want to pay the higher fees during busy times don't have to. They can call a cab and wait 1+ hours for it to get there. Or pay the "surge" rate for a quicker ride.

The big problem in this whole cab issue is government control of cab companies. There is no need for cities to regulate cab companies like they do. It should all be a free market. If the market demands more cabs, people will provide them.

[Austin97]

Originally Posted by Roadking2003

The big problem in this whole cab issue is government control of cab companies. There is no need for cities to regulate cab companies like they do. It should all be a free market. If the market demands more cabs, people will provide them.

Im for minimal government regulation, but cabs seem to be a good case for regulation. Cabs are mostly used by out of town visitors who cant do the research or dont know the ins and outs of who to trust. If you are in a car and they have your luggage they can easily extort you. What are you going to do?

In some countries unlicensed cab drivers will kidnap you and most will cheat you at least a little. Cabs have cheated me the most of any vendors while traveling. New york, LA, las vegas. Internationally manila is the worst.

Unlicensed drivers also become a huge nuisance. In some airports around the world visitors are constantly harangued by drivers trying to get a fare.

[verybadgnome]

Originally Posted by Roadking2003

The big problem in this whole cab issue is government control of cab companies. There is no need for cities to regulate cab companies like they do. It should all be a free market. If the market demands more cabs, people will provide them.

After taking bandit taxis in the developing world I would have to disagree. What was 'fifteen' when you entered the cab suddenly becomes 'fifty' when you reach your destination.

[austin-steve]

Originally Posted by CptnRn

This news article talks about people who were surprised by the surge pricing they had to pay. http://www.austincmgsite.com/news/ne...-florid/nhy43/

Granted the article says that Uber repeatedly tells the user in advance what the cost will be. But I can see this can be a huge problem if you take Uber downtown when prices are reasonable, and then discover that when you want to go home the price as quadrupled. That makes Uber a very undesirable transportation option by my standards.

Maybe Uber could evolve into a "round trip guaranty" price whereas you can pre-reserve your return trip price and it remains good for a set period of time. So, for example, you catch a ride downtown to the friend's birthday party happy hour at 6PM, and while booking, indicate you will want a return trip as well, and it locks in your return trip cost as long as you return before midnight or something.

Originally Posted by Roadking2003

The big problem in this whole cab issue is government control of cab companies. There is no need for cities to regulate cab companies like they do. It should all be a free market. If the market demands more cabs, people will provide them.

I do think cabs have a reasonable argument in that they are heavily regulated and Uber isn't. Thus Uber can be more nimble and responsive to the market envirnment whereas cab companies are stuck with "industry overhead" rules.

We see the same thing in real estate where something as micro-level as the exact size of require font stating the Brokerage name on a real estate sign is governed by the TX Real Estate Comission, as well as Realtor Code of Ethics rules on "display and advertising", yet Zillow and Trulia are free to do whatever they please, with no actual restrictions, and compete in a manner for site visits and lead acquisition in a way that Brokerage can't match because we are handcuffed by rules that were established, in most cases, before there was even an internet.

So while I support the innovation and disruption Uber and Lyft represent, I can also relate to the unfair playing field that the regulated industry they are disrupting complains about. It is in fact NOT a fair playing field.

Steve

[Paddy the Plasterer]

Originally Posted by Roadking2003

The big problem in this whole cab issue is government control of cab companies. There is no need for cities to regulate cab companies like they do. It should all be a free market. If the market demands more cabs, people will provide them.

I think you are mixing up two things here. Regulation of taxis for public safety, and making it easier to have more taxi licences.
I'm in favour of both. I want the government to implement and enforce certain standards that taxi cabs have to abide by, regarding pricing, safety of vehicle, knowledge of the city bu the driver (though with modern GPS, this is less of an issue) and carry adequate insurance.
However I also think there shouldn't be a limit on the number of taxi licenses.