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Old 09-25-2014, 08:16 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
Not having to vote, is a freedom and a right.
I teach my children that rights come with responsibilities. I also teach them not to steal and cheat and to give as well as take. I'm glad to live in a society that doesn't undermine my right to teach them that, or their right to do it. It also has values the same as my own. That's what makes this the best country in the world, IMHO. If there was another one we'd be living there
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Old 09-25-2014, 11:26 PM
 
Location: Top of the South, NZ
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Sounds good in theory, but I don't think rights/responsibility thing is a universal truth. I get what you're saying though.

The kids were very interested in the election, and I tell the them that voting is an obligation and not a right that should be squandered.

I'm also glad to live in a country that doesn't undermine my right to teach them not to steal and cheat,

Last edited by Joe90; 09-25-2014 at 11:43 PM..
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Old 09-26-2014, 03:13 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90 View Post
Internet Mana party was just a slightly amusing sideshow.

Not having to vote, is a freedom and a right.
+1 Australia has chosen to force all citizens to vote, where NZ is much like most of the free world and chosen not to, I see pros and cons, no need to get all hysterical about it.

As for Internet Mana, just a bad joke, can't imagine why anyone would back them, and as it turns out very few did:P
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Old 09-30-2014, 01:49 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel,J View Post
The last two elections have had record low turnouts, this one was the third worst in 100 years. It's been declining since the introduction of MMP which may mean a lot of people don't understand it or National's long term Dirty Tricks campaign (exposed in Nicky Hager's book of the same name) succeeded in destabilising the opposition and Nat's critics long before the election . Almost as many people didn't show up to vote as the number of people who voted for National. National attracting a third of the vote doesn't mean the majority of New Zealanders are getting what they want, rather they are stuck with what they get.

What is interesting is a lot of overseas voters ticked Green and Internet Mana boxes, so some of us have got our heads screwed on straight
The "Dirty Tricks" argument is overblown, and they allegations are just that, allegations (they haven't been proven.). Bitterness comes out when your side didn't win.

I look at Australia and the financial mess they're that was created thanks to the Labour party, and glad to see New Zealand seems to have their heads on right-limited government with a respect to freedoms, solid financial stewardship, and an government environment that isn't about handouts.
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Old 09-30-2014, 03:48 PM
 
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If they weren't proven why did Judith Collins resign?
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Old 09-30-2014, 05:28 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Samuel,J View Post
If they weren't proven why did Judith Collins resign?
Who knows. It's irrelevant now and didn't seem to matter to voters.
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Old 09-30-2014, 07:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Wolfpacker View Post
Who knows. It's irrelevant now and didn't seem to matter to voters.
On the contrary, if it was irrelevant and didn't matter to voters she wouldn't have resigned. Trying to undermine the director of the Serious Fraud Office, the organisation he worked for and the Financial Markets Authority is a serious matter. It's bad enough for any government minister to do something like that, unacceptable when she was the Minister responsible for justice and the SFO at the time.

There were other things too (not least Bronwyn Pullar) but it was the Oravida *endorsement* (of which her husband was a director) that earned her the final warning, followed by final final warnings.

Not that I'm saying she's any worse than any other member of National's government, she's just the one who got caught and became the sacrificial lamb.
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Old 09-30-2014, 11:50 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel,J View Post
On the contrary, if it was irrelevant and didn't matter to voters she wouldn't have resigned. Trying to undermine the director of the Serious Fraud Office, the organisation he worked for and the Financial Markets Authority is a serious matter. It's bad enough for any government minister to do something like that, unacceptable when she was the Minister responsible for justice and the SFO at the time.

There were other things too (not least Bronwyn Pullar) but it was the Oravida *endorsement* (of which her husband was a director) that earned her the final warning, followed by final final warnings.

Not that I'm saying she's any worse than any other member of National's government, she's just the one who got caught and became the sacrificial lamb.
People can resign because politics is a dirty game in general, especially when the opponents can create something in the 24-hour ratings-driven media that may or not be true. All political parties have skeletons in their closets. Don't kid yourself if you don't believe that.
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Old 10-01-2014, 12:24 AM
 
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And some have bone yards in theirs.
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Old 10-01-2014, 01:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfpacker View Post

I look at Australia and the financial mess they're that was created thanks to the Labour party, and glad to see New Zealand seems to have their heads on right-limited government with a respect to freedoms, solid financial stewardship, and an government environment that isn't about handouts.
I assume you mean the Australian Labor Party, as opposed to the NZ Labour Party. Neither Aus or NZ can legitimately be labeled a "financial mess" in comparison to most western economies, but on a lot of macro measures Australia does look a bit better.

The Tax burden as a % of GDP: Aus 25.6 NZ 31.7 Source: Government spending - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Government debt as a % of GDP : Aus (net) 11.641 NZ (net) 26.416 Source:List of countries by public debt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As for government handouts, see: Social and welfare issues - OECD

Not sure what freedoms Kiwis have that Aussies don't - we certainly have a lot more checks and balances in our system of government.
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