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How would Electric Vehicles do in an endurance challenge. Remember the Mercury Comets 100,000 mile endurance run.
What if there was a competition between Electric Vehicles and cars powered by internal combustion engines?
Which one would win. The competition would involve speed and miles traveled continuously with just pit stops for fuel, charging, and recommended service at prescribed intervals.
Fords Mercury division have done this endurance test in 1964 with a car called the Comet.
The Mercury Comet had a unique advertising campaign. Ford had taken the car out on a test track and drove it continuously at high speed for 100,000 miles.
Of course there were driver changes, oil changes, tire changes, etc. being performed at normal prescribed maintenance recommendations by Ford's pit crews.
It was a successful drive-train reliability demonstration, and advertising campaign. However a competitor called the Ford Mustang was produced, which became a more popular car than the Mercury.
Presently electric cars, using lithium batteries have been produced and available to consumers for 10 plus years. Claims of million mile batteries and eight minute charging times, have also been suggested recently.
A tremendous advantage exists today that Ford did not have in the days of the Comet. Electric vehicle manufacturers have an advantage of being autonomous.
I would suggest that an autonomous or human drivers operate electrical vehicles and run the course as Ford did with its Mercury Comets. The claim of 1,000,000 mile battery and 8 minute charging times would be put to the test.
A simple test of an autonomous or driven electric vehicle, continuously going around a track coming in only for pit stops and battery charges.
Another consideration, that might be even more impressive would be inductance charging having been built into the test track and a non stop endurance race would be even more impressive.
It's what I would consider a golden opportunity for any of the major manufacturers worldwide to publicize such an event if electric vehicles are up to the challenge on the path to becoming mainstream.
Below is a link to the video documenting the Mercury, Comet's endurance run. The video is at the bottom of the page.
Yea, plus something like a Le Mans or Daytona 500 with pit crews would probably be doing battery swapping instead of charging since their goals are to make the best time possible. There are electric motorsport races that exist right now, which makes a lot of sense in the context that motor sports was originally a way for automakers to serve as a testbed for pushing the boundaries of new technologies, but none of them quite have that push to demonstrate flat out endurance the way a 100K mile run does.
Lots of experts out there to define a set of objective rules that all manufactures could agree upon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler
Yea, plus something like a Le Mans or Daytona 500 with pit crews would probably be doing battery swapping instead of charging since their goals are to make the best time possible. There are electric motorsport races that exist right now, which makes a lot of sense in the context that motor sports was originally a way for automakers to serve as a testbed for pushing the boundaries of new technologies, but none of them quite have that push to demonstrate flat out endurance the way a 100K mile run does.
Lots of experts out there to define a set of objective rules that all manufactures could agree upon.
Yes indeed, the cars that participated in this had unmodified drive-trains and made 58 years ago.
I bet any manufacturers could get professional pit crews and the drivers to work for minimum wage just for the bragging rights of being in such an event.
However, giving 10 million bucks to the winning team would be an even better idea. The return on such an event as an investment would be worth a 100,000 super bowl commercials.
Keeping in mind the vehicles would be unmodified production vehicles that are overseen by recognized authorities just like the original race.
E.V. and hybrid cars could swap or charge battery's and have more then one entry to push the boundaries of the new technology's as you have said.
The problem with swapping batteries is unless that car-maker has such a policy offered as an option for it's everyday consumers it would cast doubt on it's creditability as a manufacturer.
The problem with swapping batteries is unless that car-maker has such a policy offered as an option for it's everyday consumers it would cast doubt on it's creditability as a manufacturer.
What does this even mean?
Do ICE cars come with an explicit "policy" that the engine can be replaced? Yet we know they can...
You missed the battery swap thread at the bottom of City-Data page 1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KemBro71
What does this even mean?
Do ICE cars come with an explicit "policy" that the engine can be replaced? Yet we know they can...
(Besides the obvious pot-shot at EVs)
You missed the battery swap thread at the bottom of City-Data page 1.
The fact that battery swapping had been tried by a number of manufacturers and failed to produce favorable economic results left NIO the only E.V. maker offering such a service.
That was brought out in an earlier thread, Something I did not know and accepted with my own suggested caveat.
In this thread, the Mercury Comet endurance race had rules which governed Ford's track and pit behavior.
These rules were made by recognized experts that have governed other races Daytona etc.
I gave an option allowing charge or swap in the last post but based upon the earlier thread about battery swaps, (the caveat) came from opinions of other people who contributed in that thread.
Maybe in the context of having read both threads my comment will make sense to you.
You missed the battery swap thread at the bottom of City-Data page 1.
The fact that battery swapping had been tried by a number of manufacturers and failed to produce favorable economic results left NIO the only E.V. maker offering such a service.
That was brought out in an earlier thread, Something I did not know and accepted with my own suggested caveat.
In this thread, the Mercury Comet endurance race had rules which governed Ford's track and pit behavior.
These rules were made by recognized experts that have governed other races Daytona etc.
I gave an option allowing charge or swap in the last post but based upon the earlier thread about battery swaps, (the caveat) came from opinions of other people who contributed in that thread.
Maybe in the context of having read both threads my comment will make sense to you.
Thank you for your comment.
I missed nothing.
A dinosaur car stunt has no applicability to anything but a dedication to nostalgia.
Lots of experts out there to define a set of objective rules that all manufactures could agree upon.
Yes indeed, the cars that participated in this had unmodified drive-trains and made 58 years ago.
I bet any manufacturers could get professional pit crews and the drivers to work for minimum wage just for the bragging rights of being in such an event.
However, giving 10 million bucks to the winning team would be an even better idea. The return on such an event as an investment would be worth a 100,000 super bowl commercials.
Keeping in mind the vehicles would be unmodified production vehicles that are overseen by recognized authorities just like the original race.
E.V. and hybrid cars could swap or charge battery's and have more then one entry to push the boundaries of the new technology's as you have said.
The problem with swapping batteries is unless that car-maker has such a policy offered as an option for it's everyday consumers it would cast doubt on it's creditability as a manufacturer.
I was pointing out battery swaps for EV endurance races where the goal is solely completing as many miles within a set of time as possible. That's where battery swapping if allowed would probably make sense. For what you're describing, the goal is more to push how durable the drivetrain of an existing vehicle that the every day consumer can purchase as is, so there wouldn't be much emphasis on battery swapping unless it was a mass market vehicle that was built with battery swapping capability. I'm noting that these are two different kinds of races.
Again I agree (two different kinds of races have been defined).
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler
I was pointing out battery swaps for EV endurance races where the goal is solely completing as many miles within a set of time as possible. That's where battery swapping if allowed would probably make sense. For what you're describing, the goal is more to push how durable the drivetrain of an existing vehicle that the every day consumer can purchase as is, so there wouldn't be much emphasis on battery swapping unless it was a mass market vehicle that was built with battery swapping capability. I'm noting that these are two different kinds of races.
I see your point and had thought of exactly that in my earlier thread. The battery swaps would greatly contribute the fastest unencumbered finish for an E.V.
I agree with you on that point the E.V. with a supply of fresh batteries as in the NIO electric vehicle example with a goal of fastest times and high miles would be interesting
Battery swapping in China's urban market has a lot more to do with research and development or a reward system rather then profit, except in the case of very expensive lease agreements.
That Mercury Comet that raced cost $3000.00 back in the day. It was just an advertisement about an affordable, reliable car that ordinary people could buy.
What makes things more difficult is Ford's cars had to play by rules that are established by the people who make the racing rules not the car companies.
With battery swaps, say they were using 2 battery's during the race it would be concluding batteries could make it for 50,000 miles in a 100,000 mile endurance race.
Now if NIO or any other car maker showed up race day and had a battery swap machine and extra batteries sure they could run, just document it.
The goal of the original contest was to measure the whole package and how it will do in real world ownership conditions.
Again I agree (two different kinds of races have been defined). So I would make another suggestion.
Race the cars by classes economy, mid-range and luxury to keep it real with and without battery swaps as long as it was all documented..
The goal of the original contest was to measure the whole package and how it will do in real world ownership conditions.
But they weren't real world.
Real world the Comet would have rusted out before 100k.
Real world they would not be on a closed track. There'd be snow, potholes, rain, curbs.
Real world there would be 80% more start/stop/traffic, maybe more.
Who drives high speed 99% of the time?
But sure, it was a great stunt. I do think it proved a couple things.
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Le Mans or the Daytona 500 are nowhere close to this level of competition.
