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Let's see. The governments are getting ready to ban a functioning technology in favor of something that doesn't exist yet? What are the new technology's environmental constraints? What are its costs? Inquiring minds wonder.
If it is so wonderful why the need for mandates and what, frankly amounts to lockdown? Why are we tying a torniquette across our necks to prevent a sniffle in the future?
None of this answers my question about the new battery and electric generation technology on the horizon.
......... With solar panels on the house, you'd be able to basically drive for free.
As long as you don't count the $30,000 it costs to convert your house to solar power. Other than that $30,000, it is free to drive the electric car...... as long as you don't count the cost of the battery which is the fuel source that eventually gets used up.
None of this answers my question about the new battery and electric generation technology on the horizon.
My point is that this is future, not present technology. Heaven only knows what will be developed in the future, what it will cost and what environmental consequences it will have.
My point is that this is future, not present technology. Heaven only knows what will be developed in the future, what it will cost and what environmental consequences it will have.
Kind of like these 2035 laws that will either be amended anyway or simply happen on their own as more and more people convert voluntarily.
The first country to have a 100% BEV goal is Norway in three years. They are currently at 79.3%.
2022 totals 200,840 registrations in Norway
Volkswagen with 26,068
Toyota with 24,381
Tesla at 21,303
Mercedes 15,539
BMW at 14,037
Volvo with 12,850
Audi with 10,326
Skoda 9,886
Hyundai with 9,044
Ford in 10th with 8,700
In comparison California had 1,667,831 vehicle registrations in 2022 or over 8X the number in Norway. As California has roughly 8X the population of Norway that is consistent.
But California sold 17.1% vehicles as Battery Electric Vehicles, much lower than Norway's 79.3%
Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy
Kind of like these 2035 laws that will either be amended anyway or simply happen on their own as more and more people convert voluntarily.
There are about 400,000 Norwegians that live north of the Arctic Circle.
I suppose we will have to see what Norway does with their voluntary goals in three years. There may be a handful of people who live in rural areas that insist they need a Toyota hybrid, and they just simply can't safely function on the range of a BEV.
2022 Toyota RAV4 Prime 4WD City MPG:41 Highway MPG:38 EPA range: 600 miles All Elec: 0-42 miles
2023 Toyota RAV4 Hybrid AWD City MPG:41 Highway MPG:38 EPA range: 580 miles
Will a free society deny that rural dweller the right to purchase this RAV4 ?
The state's with big air conditioning bills are naturally the highest consumers of electricity. Tennessee also tends to use electricity for heat pumps as the relatively mild winters don't require the kind of hear needed in New england where people heat with oil, natural gas and wood. [list][*]FL 1,096 kWh per month 2021 $130 average monthly residential bill in 2021
Florida is in the 90-95% range for using electricity for both heating and cooling. Heat pumps work well down here and are more cost effective than having different furnace and AC units. The majority of new developments won’t even run gas lines for appliance use.
So even though electric consumption is high, total energy use in homes is on the low side.
If the state wanted to do more solar, we have the annual days of sunshine to make it pretty cost effective.
Kind of like these 2035 laws that will either be amended anyway or simply happen on their own as more and more people convert voluntarily.
The problem with that is the withering of ICE infrastructure, such as the cars themselves, filling stations, parts, etc. It's very hard to turn a battleship around that fast.
Florida is in the 90-95% range for using electricity for both heating and cooling. Heat pumps work well down here and are more cost effective than having different furnace and AC units. The majority of new developments won’t even run gas lines for appliance use.
The actual determination of how much electricity is used in each state is in reality more complex than just simply who uses the most air conditioning. But consumption is very low in VT, ME, MA, NH because there is no need for air conditioning and it is far too cold for heat pumps.
However, with the adoption of EVs (other than NY where a large percentage of the population takes public transportation), electric consumption will depend more an population instead of climate.
Personally, I think CA is painting themselves into a corner by refusing to consider new types of nuclear generators.
HI 531 kWh per month 2021 $178 average monthly residential bill in 2021 33.49 Cents/kWh
CA 542 kWh per month 2021 $124 average monthly residential bill in 2021 22.82 Cents/kWh
VT 567 kWh per month 2021 $109 average monthly residential bill in 2021 19.26 Cents/kWh
ME 584 kWh per month 2021 $99 average monthly residential bill in 2021 17.02 Cents/kWh
RI 585 kWh per month 2021 $130 average monthly residential bill in 2021 22.30 Cents/kWh
AK 594 kWh per month 2021 $134 average monthly residential bill in 2021 22.55 Cents/kWh
MA 596 kWh per month 2021 $136 average monthly residential bill in 2021 22.89 Cents/kWh
NY 599 kWh per month 2021 $117 average monthly residential bill in 2021 19.48 Cents/kWh
NH 631 kWh per month 2021 $125 average monthly residential bill in 2021 19.85 Cents/kWh
NM 646 kWh per month 2021 $87 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.52 Cents/kWh
MI 670 kWh per month 2021 $118 average monthly residential bill in 2021 17.54 Cents/kWh
NJ 687 kWh per month 2021 $112 average monthly residential bill in 2021 16.35 Cents/kWh
WI 690 kWh per month 2021 $100 average monthly residential bill in 2021 14.52 Cents/kWh
CO 704 kWh per month 2021 $92 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.07 Cents/kWh
DC 706 kWh per month 2021 $92 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.09 Cents/kWh
CT 713 kWh per month 2021 $156 average monthly residential bill in 2021 21.91 Cents/kWh
IL 728 kWh per month 2021 $96 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.18 Cents/kWh
UT 775 kWh per month 2021 $81 average monthly residential bill in 2021 10.43 Cents/kWh
MN 776 kWh per month 2021 $105 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.50 Cents/kWh
PA 851 kWh per month 2021 $117 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.76 Cents/kWh
IA 861 kWh per month 2021 $110 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.73 Cents/kWh
WY 867 kWh per month 2021 $97 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.17 Cents/kWh
MT 872 kWh per month 2021 $98 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.22 Cents/kWh
OH 879 kWh per month 2021 $112 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.77 Cents/kWh
US 886 kWh per month 2021 $121 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.66 Cents/kWh
KS 890 kWh per month 2021 $116 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.98 Cents/kWh
OR 936 kWh per month 2021 $106 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.37 Cents/kWh
IN 946 kWh per month 2021 $127 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.37 Cents/kWh
DE 950 kWh per month 2021 $119 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.52 Cents/kWh
NV 959 kWh per month 2021 $110 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.49 Cents/kWh
ID 961 kWh per month 2021 $98 average monthly residential bill in 2021 10.16 Cents/kWh
MD 973 kWh per month 2021 $128 average monthly residential bill in 2021 13.12 Cents/kWh
WA 984 kWh per month 2021 $99 average monthly residential bill in 2021 10.11 Cents/kWh
NE 1,005 kWh per month 2021 $108 average monthly residential bill in 2021 10.75 Cents/kWh
SD 1,019 kWh per month 2021 $125 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.22 Cents/kWh
MO 1,039 kWh per month 2021 $119 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.42 Cents/kWh
ND 1,041 kWh per month 2021 $113 average monthly residential bill in 2021 10.85 Cents/kWh
AZ 1,048 kWh per month 2021 $131 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.54 Cents/kWh
NC 1,063 kWh per month 2021 $120 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.32 Cents/kWh
WV 1,066 kWh per month 2021 $130 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.15 Cents/kWh
GA 1,072 kWh per month 2021 $134 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.51 Cents/kWh
SC 1,078 kWh per month 2021 $139 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.86 Cents/kWh
KY 1,084 kWh per month 2021 $125 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.50 Cents/kWh
OK 1,088 kWh per month 2021 $120 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.00 Cents/kWh
TX 1,094 kWh per month 2021 $132 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.11 Cents/kWh
VA 1,094 kWh per month 2021 $131 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.96 Cents/kWh
FL 1,096 kWh per month 2021 $130 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.90 Cents/kWh
AR 1,098 kWh per month 2021 $124 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.27 Cents/kWh
AL 1,140 kWh per month 2021 $148 average monthly residential bill in 2021 12.96 Cents/kWh
MS 1,171 kWh per month 2021 $135 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.56 Cents/kWh
TN 1,183 kWh per month 2021 $131 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.07 Cents/kWh
LA 1,192 kWh per month 2021 $131 average monthly residential bill in 2021 11.02 Cents/kWh
Ranked by Price per kWh
Spoiler
HI 33.49 Cents/kWh
MA 22.89 Cents/kWh
CA 22.82 Cents/kWh
AK 22.55 Cents/kWh
RI 22.30 Cents/kWh
CT 21.91 Cents/kWh
NH 19.85 Cents/kWh
NY 19.48 Cents/kWh
VT 19.26 Cents/kWh
MI 17.54 Cents/kWh
ME 17.02 Cents/kWh
NJ 16.35 Cents/kWh
WI 14.52 Cents/kWh
PA 13.76 Cents/kWh
US 13.66 Cents/kWh
NM 13.52 Cents/kWh
MN 13.50 Cents/kWh
IN 13.37 Cents/kWh
IL 13.18 Cents/kWh
MD 13.12 Cents/kWh
DC 13.09 Cents/kWh
CO 13.07 Cents/kWh
KS 12.98 Cents/kWh
AL 12.96 Cents/kWh
SC 12.86 Cents/kWh
OH 12.77 Cents/kWh
IA 12.73 Cents/kWh
AZ 12.54 Cents/kWh
DE 12.52 Cents/kWh
GA 12.51 Cents/kWh
SD 12.22 Cents/kWh
WV 12.15 Cents/kWh
TX 12.11 Cents/kWh
VA 11.96 Cents/kWh
FL 11.90 Cents/kWh
MS 11.56 Cents/kWh
KY 11.50 Cents/kWh
NV 11.49 Cents/kWh
MO 11.42 Cents/kWh
OR 11.37 Cents/kWh
NC 11.32 Cents/kWh
AR 11.27 Cents/kWh
MT 11.22 Cents/kWh
WY 11.17 Cents/kWh
TN 11.07 Cents/kWh
LA 11.02 Cents/kWh
OK 11.00 Cents/kWh
ND 10.85 Cents/kWh
NE 10.75 Cents/kWh
UT 10.43 Cents/kWh
ID 10.16 Cents/kWh
WA 10.11 Cents/kWh
Last edited by PacoMartin; 03-06-2023 at 05:43 PM..
I haven’t lived in California since 2005, and I’ve never lived in NJ (nor would I want to). So I don’t have a dog directly in the fight.
But c’mon guys. Let buyers decide. Please. It’s bad enough that federal regs have kinda ruined cars. Nobody else needs to step in and dictate that certain energy sources are persona non grata.
Is there at least an option to buy something out of state, new, and register it? At least NJ is small, so nobody would have to go that far.
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