Public Employee Unions want to change Prop. 13 so busness property tax goes up & up more every year. (move, homeless)

[SportyandMisty]

Originally Posted by TheFlats

Prop 13 helps the 1% more than any other group.

Assumes facts not in evidence. At any rate, you say that as if it were a bad thing.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by TheFlats

So if you bought a house for 600K in 2007. In 2012 you would have trouble selling it for 300K. You should be taxed on the 600K value of the house instead of the "unrealized" 300K?

I said that property taxes should be based on the value of the property. You said that's what Prop 13 is. I said no. Now, using the last refuge of a losing argument, semantics, you're telling me that no one can truly define the value of a house? If that were the case then the HELOC industry would be in big trouble, haha.

Here is the verbatim section of Prop 13 as approved by 2/3 of California Voters... (By the way... I was too young to vote when Prop 13 passed)

Section 2.

(a) The full cash value means the County Assessors valuation of real property as shown on the 1975-76 tax bill under “full cash value,” or thereafter, the appraised value of real property when purchased, newly constructed, or a change in ownership has occurred after the 1975 assessment. All real property not already assessed up to the 1975-76 tax levels may be reassessed to reflect that valuation


So you are in sync with Prop 13.

I said an arms length sale between a willing seller and able buyer... determines value...

I also said an appraisal would mean more if the person appraising was willing to buy for the appraised price.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by TheFlats

Yeah, that's how it works in all those other states. Value goes up, property taxes go up, rents go up. How about landlords in San Francisco paying property taxes on 10% of their building's current value and charging market rate rents while pocketing the tax break?

Many metro areas have Rent Control including San Francisco.

By the way... other states have limits on tax increases and also provisions for seniors/disabled.

I will take Texas Property Tax if California gets rid of Income Tax...

California is not a low tax state... unbelievable there are still those in support of higher taxes.

I live in Oakland and we pay high property tax... just today the Mayor of Oakland and Vice Mayor commented on the politics and corruption in Oakland government... my 12k in property taxes for a 1957 home of 1725 square feet is already confiscatory.... but no one forced me to buy.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by TheFlats

So if you bought a house for 600K in 2007. In 2012 you would have trouble selling it for 300K. You should be taxed on the 600K value of the house instead of the "unrealized" 300K?

I said that property taxes should be based on the value of the property. You said that's what Prop 13 is. I said no. Now, using the last refuge of a losing argument, semantics, you're telling me that no one can truly define the value of a house? If that were the case then the HELOC industry would be in big trouble, haha.

Prop 8 modified prop 13 and allowed for property tax reductions if property values decreased. Here's how it works:
Decline in Market Value (Prop 8) Background and Overview

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by TheFlats

Yeah, that's how it works in all those other states. Value goes up, property taxes go up, rents go up. How about landlords in San Francisco paying property taxes on 10% of their building's current value and charging market rate rents while pocketing the tax break?

Rent is based on supply and demand, not the amount of property tax paid. I think California would benefit from a split tax roll like Nevada has which allows for up to a 3% annual increase on residential property and an 8% annual increase on commercial properties and all non owner occupied homes.

[Ultrarunner]

Rent is based on supply and demand but the amount of rentals in a market is affected by cost.

I would anticipate fewer rental homes should taxes spike...

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Rent is based on supply and demand but the amount of rentals in a market is affected by cost.

I would anticipate fewer rental homes should taxes spike...

You're probably correct about single family home rentals, but I don't think people would quit renting multi-family units

[Ultrarunner]

5 units and up are pretty much stuck... the single family homes are already seeing decline in numbers here in the SF East Bay as they become owner occupant...

At one time 50% of the neighborhood where I once lived was rentals... all owner occupied now.

It is simply the numbers... rents are $2500 and homes are pushing 700K...

Each sale is a windfall for the tax man and county assessor...

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by PrudentialBroker

Man I remember when Prop 13 came out, so many ppl were against it.

Only 1/3 of the voters were against it, so I suspect the ones against it did not own homes.

[aslowdodge]

Originally Posted by TheFlats

Yeah, that's how it works in all those other states. Value goes up, property taxes go up, rents go up. How about landlords in San Francisco paying property taxes on 10% of their building's current value and charging market rate rents while pocketing the tax break?

Wow, the more you write, the less credibility you have.
You really have no idea what's going on.
I gave an example of how your tax structure failed in my out of state properties which you conveniently did not address but you did respond to other parts of that post. Guess that's what happens when you make a statement and get proven wrong. Instead I'd admitting it you just pretend no one sees it . Well done.

On my rentals my property taxes have gone up, but rents have not. It's not always about how much it costs to hold that property, but what the market will bear. But wait, you know better than landlords and investors who are actually doing it because you have this idea that trumps all real world experience.

How about landlords in San Francisco paying 10% of value not getting market rents because of rent control? Like others have said, it may be worth a lot more if he could cash out, but that money is not his to use until he sells.
If you had a trust that gave you a million dollars but you couldn't get to until you turn 50 and you are 25 now, do you really have that million?