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The biggest issue with dry food is that it is dry. Cats on a dry diet are perpetually dehydrated.
The second issue is the high carbs. As you say, some canned foods can be almost as high as the dry foods, but at least they provide moisture.
But yeah, there is nothing good about dry "food", at all.
MANY cats on a dry diet are perpetually dehydrated.
Cats on a dry diet are TYPICALLY dehydrated.
SOME cats on a dry diet are dehydrated.
There are many cats who drink plenty of water. For those cats, the dry diet being dry, is not a problem for them. The ingredients in the dry diet, however, is.
I really wish you'd back off on the whole "OMG DRY DEHYDRATED SUFFERING KITTEHS" thing. A cat's natural thirst drive is not the same as a human's natural thirst drive. This does NOT mean that cats reject water. If they did, they would reject moist food, and you'd never put out a water dish for them because there'd be no point. Clearly, cats DO drink water. Some more than others. Most, not enough to accommodate an all-dry diet. But many cats do drink enough to accommodate an all-dry diet.
I think it would be more valuable to find out how much water a cat -should- be drinking, IF they are on an all-dry diet. And if they're not drinking that much (however much it is), then they need to not be on an all-dry diet. If they -are- drinking enough water for an all-dry diet, then only the ingredients of that diet need to be taken into consideration.
Anonchick we have sources for thinking that cats don't typically drink enough water to be adequately hydrated on a dry diet. I, for one, believe Dr. Pierson's assertions, although there have been others.
The point is that some of the issues that crop up long term for cats can be traced to a life of inadequate hydration due to the low thirst drive and dry food. Male cats and urinary blockage. Constipation and other disorders of the digestion. Hairballs. A cat on a wet diet not only is getting the water needed for good urinary health, but moving the entire digestion more quickly, as nature intended. Which is why they can also tolerate certain bacteria that would be more harmful to a human, in addition to whatever enzymes their bodies might have to handle them, the bacteria don't get to hang around long enough to cause a problem. Hair can pass right through and doesn't have to be puked up. Less vomiting, on top of that. That is huge, for me. My friend has a cat that "barfs all the time" as she puts it. Her cat now has very severe dental disease. If you vomited several times a day for years and never brushed your teeth, you'd have dental disease, too. My longhaired cat has never had a hairball, and only ever threw up once when I gave him a weird food experiment (I was trying to rehydrate some freeze dried chicken...it was a silly idea.)
Long hair, grooms constantly, no hairballs.
My friend had a second cat who used to go outside all the time, the second cat caught birds and mice and rarely ate the dry food put out, and it had cleaner teeth and better overall health, until a coyote killed it...
Of course, proper digestion in a cat also has tons to do with the right nutritional stuff going into the food. But anyone who knows anything about digestive function will tell you that you need moisture to aid digestion. Water is critical to the whole process. And according to some veterinary theory these days, many of the more common illnesses that ail cats' insides can be traced back to dehydration as a cause.
MANY cats on a dry diet are perpetually dehydrated.
Cats on a dry diet are TYPICALLY dehydrated.
SOME cats on a dry diet are dehydrated.
There are many cats who drink plenty of water. For those cats, the dry diet being dry, is not a problem for them. The ingredients in the dry diet, however, is.
I really wish you'd back off on the whole "OMG DRY DEHYDRATED SUFFERING KITTEHS" thing. A cat's natural thirst drive is not the same as a human's natural thirst drive. This does NOT mean that cats reject water. If they did, they would reject moist food, and you'd never put out a water dish for them because there'd be no point. Clearly, cats DO drink water. Some more than others. Most, not enough to accommodate an all-dry diet. But many cats do drink enough to accommodate an all-dry diet.
I think it would be more valuable to find out how much water a cat -should- be drinking, IF they are on an all-dry diet. And if they're not drinking that much (however much it is), then they need to not be on an all-dry diet. If they -are- drinking enough water for an all-dry diet, then only the ingredients of that diet need to be taken into consideration.
Not going to happen. Any cat on an all dry diet will be chronically dehydrated. It's their basic biological make-up. Of course they will drink, because they are dehydrated. But they will not, can not, drink enough to counteract the lack of moisture in an all dry diet.
Not going to happen. Any cat on an all dry diet will be chronically dehydrated. It's their basic biological make-up. Of course they will drink, because they are dehydrated. But they will not, can not, drink enough to counteract the lack of moisture in an all dry diet.
Incidentally, to add personal experience to the mix, my cats are on a canned and raw diet. They never drink. Their diet is 78-80% moisture daily intake. The water bowl is freshened daily, but they never go near it.
Incidentally, to add personal experience to the mix, my cats are on a canned and raw diet. They never drink. Their diet is 78-80% moisture daily intake. The water bowl is freshened daily, but they never go near it.
PS great post Sonic_Spork
Mine doesn't drink, either! I've spent money on fountains, but they are hard to keep clean (hard water issues) so we wind up with just bowls of fresh water daily. I've run the faucet for him, he likes to smack at the water with his paw, but has no interest at all in drinking. I have never, ever witnessed him drink water, not even once! I'd be concerned about it if I didn't know he's fine because of his urine output. Indeed he does get the moisture he needs from his canned foods.
Oh, and thanks...I wanted to have your back a little there, because it's not just some silly notion you're on about. It's information that has been published by feline specialist vets...I'm not saying that it is above or beyond any challenge, all medical theory should certainly be questioned. But my experiences make me inclined to agree with it.
If my cat develops one of the problems I'm hoping to prevent, despite his wet diet, I'll be sure to come and let you guys know!
Also, I had a conversation on my lunch break today with a lady who runs a natural pet food store (I was pickin' up some Tiki for the Nimbus) and she was saying that she has had 3 male cats with stones, and the one she put on dry prescription Hills as recommended by her vet at the time went drastically downhill in a matter of hours...it came to a situation where she didn't have the $3K for an emergency surgery and he was PTS. After that, she began doing her research on the matter, and decided to go with all wet diets for her cats. She said it has provided stable good health for her animals for the last few years and she's fully on board with it.
I do have one of those cats who formed struvite in spite of a canned diet, because, in retrospect, the wet food I was feeding was very high in carbohydrate, which can create an alkaline urine in some cats, and cause the cat to form struvite crystals. So the vet at the time, after the third repeat problem, insisted she had to be on the c/d. She would not eat the canned, so I gave her the dry, even though it killed me to do it, I thought it had to be. Thank goodness I know better now, but the damage was done before I finally learned my lesson (all other cats were always on a canned diet)
Even on low carb canned and raw she is still prone to a higher than average urinary pH, but no more struvite thankfully, probably because she pees so much more.
Incidentally the cat in question ate (against my better judgement) c/d kibble for six years, and it controlled her urine pH, but she (and I) have paid for that in diamonds. Her digestion, including motility is ruined from the high carb dry diet. She is ten years old, and it's been 2 1/2 years since I stopped that disgusting so called "food", but even with the great imrpovement in her diet, she will always have digestive problems, I expect.
If I can save even one cat and human from experiencing what this cat and I have been through, and will continue to go through for the rest of her life, it's worth it.
Any wet IS better than dry, but some cats just can't handle the carb load, even in wet.
Last edited by catsmom21; 06-12-2014 at 04:01 PM..
Not going to happen. Any cat on an all dry diet will be chronically dehydrated. It's their basic biological make-up. Of course they will drink, because they are dehydrated. But they will not, can not, drink enough to counteract the lack of moisture in an all dry diet.
With that logic, any HUMAN on an all-dry diet will be chronically dehydrated. So will any mammal, bird, and reptile. Water is a necessary component of all diets, human and non-human. If they can't get it in their food, it has to be provided some other way. But see, that's why animals who are given all-dry diets are also given water. Not because they're dehydrated, but rather, to prevent them from becoming dehydrated.
This is just basic science, and common sense. You don't have to be Lisa Piersen or even memorize the link to her website to figure this out.
With that logic, any HUMAN on an all-dry diet will be chronically dehydrated. So will any mammal, bird, and reptile. Water is a necessary component of all diets, human and non-human. If they can't get it in their food, it has to be provided some other way. But see, that's why animals who are given all-dry diets are also given water. Not because they're dehydrated, but rather, to prevent them from becoming dehydrated.
This is just basic science, and common sense. You don't have to be Lisa Piersen or even memorize the link to her website to figure this out.
Perhaps you should make some effort educate yourself about feline nutrition, and obligate carnivores. We're not talking about humans or birds or reptiles. We're talking about cats. Cats do not, will not, can not, drink enough to compensate for an all dry diet.
You could do some reading. You might learn something.
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Last edited by catsmom21; 06-13-2014 at 06:39 PM..
You really need to educate yourself about feline nutrition, and obligate carnivores. We're not talking about humans or birds or reptiles. We're talking about cats. Cats do not, will not, can not, drink enough to compensate for an all dry diet.
Do some reading. Learn something.
.
You are incorrect.
If you were correct, then ALL cats who are on all-dry diets, would have kidney failure. Since MANY cats live on an all-dry diet and do NOT get kidney failure, then your theory is just - wrong. The truth is, that cats have a low thirst drive, and most cats don't try to drink enough water. Some do - but most don't. And you can know for sure by find out how much water a cat -should- consume, in order to be properly hydrated. Even cats living on the savannahs seek out water holes to supplement their all-raw-meat prey diet.
But many is not all. Neither is most. All is an absolute. Dehydration leads to kidney failure. If any animal is consistently dehydrated, eventually their kidneys will suffer. Since suffering kidneys is not a truth of all cats who live on all-dry diets, the claim that all-dry diets always result in dehydration is also not true.
Again - this is just plain logic and common sense. It's something we learned in grade-school, sorry I don't have the source since the internet hadn't been invented yet. It was called sets and subsets, and it was part of our math curriculum. It goes like this:
All cats require food and water.
ALL dehydration eventually leads to damage to kidneys, if not treated, and can lead to kidney failure, and death as a direct result of kidney failure.
SOME cats who eat only dry food, are dehydrated.
ALL cats who are dehydrated, and whose dehydration is not corrected, eventually suffer kidney failure.
NOT all cats who eat all-dry food suffer kidney failure, or even kidney damage.
THEREFORE
NOT all cats who eat all-dry food will become dehydrated.
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