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Wild cats don't eat raw food. They eat freshly killed prey. It's still warm. Sometimes still alive..
We can't even protect human grade meats and eggs from contaminates........would you eat it raw?
Cats don't eat rice, wheat, corn, potatoes, peas, carrots, blueberries... are any other such thing in the wild.
So find a food that best resembles what they do eat in the wild... with all the necessary vitamins and minerals.
Heh.
So, I believe there are practical limits for most people. And while I believe these can extend far beyond simply opening a bag of dry food and topping off a bowl every so often, I don't know that they extend for most people to having freshly killed prey.
But hey, if you want to raise mice and do that, it could be the closest thing to wild.
For most it'll probably be a few notches below that. If you're at least getting meat, moisture and low carb you're a lot closer than many foods that are out there.
I've been to a number of vet clinics in my area over the years and IME most of the vets there had little feline dietary knowledge. In fact, the first vet I saw with Tucker pushed nothing but dry prescription food (which caused many problems, another story)!
I think there is a "CYA" fear for vets when it comes to handling raw food, and the possibility that some people won't or don't understand what a balanced/complete diet is for a cat. It is much safer to suggest something that's either on their shelf or has the AAFCO label on it.
I am transitioning our cats to raw now. Our oldest has been on it for a month now and is doing great. The improvement in his fur alone has been amazing.
As in home prepared raw or cooked? The fact that supplementation is necessary is not proof of anything. Supplementation is necessary for nearly every cooked pet food there is! It's just that they put it IN THE FOOD before selling it to you. There's no magic to the commercial food that prevents it from needing the same supplementation as a home prepared food.
That's pretty basic stuff in terms of food in general. I would hold that up as an example of just how little grasp many vets have of nutritional issues. I mean, I'm far far from a nutritional expert and don't work in the medical profession but even as such a layperson I can understand that commercial foods are supplemented with vitamins and minerals and in the case of cat food, taurine.
She's against raw AND cooked diets prepared in home. She didn't say exactly "supplementation is proof it's not good enough." She said, "I've reviewed various raw and cooked diets, and I have not seen one that I believe is nutritionally complete and doesn't need supplementation." She wasn't saying this to say she supports it with supplementation. She opposes these diets totally. As someone mentioned, she probably doesn't trust owners to find and execute an appropriate diet. She will not recommend a diet she feels isn't complete.
Martha when I went raw with my cats I joined a raw feeding forum and got all the guidance and support I could ask for. I really think that's the best way to go about it.
Prey model raw is actually less costly than a good quality canned diet.
Vet schools are indeed heavily funded by the wealthy giant pet food companies, and the small amount of nutrition taught is sponsored by these same companies. Students are bombarded by advertising and freebies from these pet food companies throughout their education.
If they were to sanction raw feeding, especially home made raw, they'd be risking a lot.
Vets are given incentives and win "gifts" for selling certain brands of pet food in their offices. This also is true. I posted a link about it a while back.
Fortunately there are vets out there who are free thinkers and open to discussing raw diets with their clients who are interested, or already feeding one. Some even want to learn more about it. My vet is very supportive of my raw feeding and is always asking me questions about my methods. And she can't rave enough about my cats' coats and teeth and general health. At her request I often bring in printed pages from various websites I use as resources.
Now I'm not naive enough to think that she is recommending raw feeding to her other clients, willy nilly. She is a staff vet at a privately owned clinic and I know she still "prescribes" those "therapeutic" foods. But I think she tends to push the wet now at least, thanks to what she has learned from me. And she often asks for advice on canned commercial foods now too.
Another point about the "CYA" factor is one of the same reasons that you see recalls for salmonella so often...it might have just as much to do with human handling practices as it does with the health of animals, or more so. Obviously (to most people) when you handle raw meat, you have to be careful of cross contamination, wash your hands thoroughly, etc. But just as there might be people out there who hear about raw feeding and assume they can just toss a cat chunks of chicken breast, and be all good...there might be someone who doesn't know all about the dangers of bacterial contamination, and may inadvertently make themselves ill through bad handling practices.
It just has to be much easier for a vet to recommend store bought pet food that tends to be pretty safe for handling and more or less nutritionally balanced, take the risk of human error out of the equation.
As for prey model raw, there are also a couple of sources where you can actually obtain whole ground prey such as poultry, rabbit, cavies (guinea pigs) and so forth. One need not cope with a cat taking apart a carcass on the kitchen floor...and I know from experience with outdoor cats, sometimes they will eat only the tastiest bits and leave the rest...
I'd think if I had a grinder I might obtain mice, freeze them first to kill off any parasites, and then grind them up...if I were keen to deal with the hassle of making cat food, which I am not. I used to keep a couple of snakes and I always froze and then thawed the mice for them, don't see why that wouldn't work for cat food...? But I spend more for canned, because I have much more money than time to expend in feeding Nimbus.
30to66at55
I did NOT go to veterinary school (I was going to but im not good with math so I went into animal behavior and zoological science and management instead.
however I WAS a certified Veterinary technicial and have worked with 3 vets who ALL confirmed that nutritional courses are limited and taught BY pet food company reps...
and as Grammyof5 already posted directly form the tufts site
Quote:
the center was upgraded substantially in February with support from Nestle Purina.
I can also say from direct experience veterinary offices recive monetary and equiptment compensation for selling "prescription diets" (ontop of the very small mark up for petfood)
one vets office I worked for got a brand new ultrasound machine courtesy or Mars (the owning company of Royal canin) when they reached a bag sales goal, they also recived a new xray maching from colgate Palmolive (the owners of Hills) then they met a set minimum bag order over the space of a year (I cant remember how many bags it was, something like 5000 bags of food ordered...
veterinary schools and teaching colleges get much of their learning equiptment funding from "sponsorships" by these large companies, purina, Colgate-Palmolive and Mars being the major ones.
xray machines, ultrasounds, autoclaves ect are NOT cheap and teaching colleges and veterinary offices alike depend on generaous donations, scholarships ect to help fund the purchase of large expensive pieces of equiptment...
just like other colleges rely on such things for similar stuff, the community college I whent to has a contract with coke, it only sold coke brand and in return got a bunch of kickbacks for equiptment...
I don't believe it. Veterinarians aren't schooled on nutrition very much and are paid to push commercial dog food. Dogs will not get sick from raw food because they have shorter digestive tracts. I have feeding my dog raw food for months and it has been very good for him. He has not been sick once.
Unless I see proof otherwise, I respectfully reject your claim about Tufts. I can hardly believe that they simply push commercial food because they make money. I just have such a hard time believing that in this day and age. I know too many ethical vets to feel that all of the Tufts nutritionists would buy into doing that. I think that at least most of them have the same ethical standards that you and I would. Re: your comment re: short digestive tracts, you didn't read the entire link which states, if you read it all:
"Top Ten Myths about Raw Meat Diets
1. "Their benefits are proven"
No scientific studies have shown benefits of raw food diets. Their appeal is based on word of mouth, testimonials,
and perceived benefits. For example, raw food diets may result in a shiny coat and small stools because they are
generally high in fat and digestibility. However, these same properties can be achieved with commercial cooked diets
without the risks of raw meat diets.
2. "This is what animals eat in the wild"
Wolves in the wild do eat raw meat (in addition to berries, plants, etc). However, the average lifespan for a wolf in the
wild is only a few years. Therefore, what is nutritionally "optimal" for a wolf is not optimal for our pets who we hope
will live long and healthy lives.
3. "Dogs and cats have short gastrointestinal tracts so won't get infections from Salmonella in raw meat diets"
Dogs' and cats' gastrointestinal tracts are not shorter compared to people when viewed in proportion to their smaller
body size. Dogs and cats can become infected with Salmonella and other bacteria found in raw meat diets, just as
people can (especially young, old, or immunosuppressed individuals)
hahaha "To design customized diets for her patients, Freeman uses Tufts' expanded state-of-the-art nutrition center for animals. Created five years ago at Tufts' hospital for small animals, the center was upgraded substantially in February with support from Nestle Purina."
vet schools are HEAVILY sponsonerd by pet food companies
personally I feed prey model raw, the difference I energy levels, coat and teeth health, skin health, and overall wellness, as well as how much they enjoy their food now is MORE than enough for me...
I DO NOT supliment with ANYTHING...they get whole prey model (minus fur/feathers and heads (just for mess issues) but including green tripe) they do not get ANY other suplimentation. ive been feeding like this for about 2 years now,
I DO think most home cooked diets are NOT nutritionally balanced...
I also think some of the raw diets people follow are NOT nutritionally balanced...
but I think a good correct PREY MODEL (feeding all possible parts of the animal including bone, muscle and organ (including green tripe) is, from MY experience, the best thing someone can do for their CARNIVORE.
Wow! I read your entire post.
but how do I feed 11 cats inside raw food without killing myself making the plates and cleaning up the mess? I have a bad knee and cannot do intensive labor.
Yet, your post is wonderful. (I abridged it but read it all.)
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At her request I often bring in printed pages from various websites I use as resources.
