Frustration w/ gutter installation! (rental, insurance, houses)

[brokensky]

Four years ago I contracted w/ a company who had a very nice rep - to tear down part of my gutters and make some repairs.

The crew shows up. None spoke English. I speak Spanish (well, took Spanish four years in high school and then in college, but I am not fluent - but can communicate). The whole experience was outrageous. When they finished up, not only did the gutters leak in places they had never leaked, the idiots messed up flood lighting. Over five weeks, I made numerous phone calls, including to the BBB as well as writing a letter, trying to get the owner to agree to come back and inspect the mess and repair the damage they had done. Never got full satisfaction. Had to hire a handyman to come fix part of the mess.

So we decide last week - maybe it is a good time to just tear everything off, have a good inspection done to make sure there are no problems w/ corners, fascia and soffits (Have not noticed any problems) and have the leaf guards installed.

Talked to the company rep FOUR TIMES. Asked what type of crew they had - how experienced and if they have worker's comp. Oh yes, professional crew, long time experience . . . and worker's comp. Gave me references. Called two. Great job, I hear.

THey showed up 15 mins ago, to do the initial inspection I insisted on to find out what might look like it needed repairing. After all, if I wait til they have the gutters down - and then get told - you need $1200 worth of repairs - a little too late to back out then, right?

And what do I get. Two guys who can't speak English and from what I could ascertain, are here to "tear off the gutters."

Okay. I have had it. I just cancelled the deal on the spot. I am not going thru/ this again. Send me workers who can COMMUNICATE w/ me IN ENGLISH and who can write up a work order, w/ a firm price, that I can sign b/f you start tearing a thing off my house.

What does it take to get professional services these days?????? Where did I go wrong?????

[SouthernBelleInUtah]

Unfortunately, that's a fact of life these days. The spanish-speaking crew who tore out my basement and dug down to get more headroom, also put my lawn chairs under my cherry tree. They then rocked so far back that the rocking chair is permanently "sprung" back and they practiced their ninja throws on the cherry tree with used saw blade disks. Since there was a 10-ft hole between me and the back yard, I didn't find out until they were long gone (gen contractor fired that crew) and the hole filled in. It doesn't help me that the general contractor hired them and it was too little damage to make a big fuss over, considering that was the beginning of an 18 month renovation. Call the BBB and find another company!

[Barkingowl]

Ani go online & look for a contractor on Angie's List. Anyone can be part of the BBB if they pay the membership fee.

[brokensky]

Originally Posted by Barkingowl

Ani go online & look for a contractor on Angie's List. Anyone can be part of the BBB if they pay the membership fee.

You are so right, but I didn't think about it that at the time. (Good advice, tho, Barking). I don't have to have gutters addressed right now. We are not having a problem, but we thought how nice it would be to have the leafguard system installed b/f Fall again (these huge trees all around me make a mess).

I had a bad feeling when they didn't show up yesterday. They were supposed to send out two people to inspect the fascia, soffits, etc. yesterday morning at 8 am, and then after giving me a report and estimate (should there be additional work) they were to tear off the gutters and proceed.

When they didn't show up, I called and one guy said "The truck broke down." And then another guy called later and said "The crew got the days mixed up." I thought right then . . . okay, not good - what is the real story?

So when the guys showed up today and couldn't Habla Ingles (or whatever the correct verb form is) that was it.

I think the Universe was telling me to save my money for something else, LOL. Gutters and leaf guards- next year.

[brokensky]

Originally Posted by SouthernBelleInUtah

Unfortunately, that's a fact of life these days. The spanish-speaking crew who tore out my basement and dug down to get more headroom, also put my lawn chairs under my cherry tree. They then rocked so far back that the rocking chair is permanently "sprung" back and they practiced their ninja throws on the cherry tree with used saw blade disks. Since there was a 10-ft hole between me and the back yard, I didn't find out until they were long gone (gen contractor fired that crew) and the hole filled in. It doesn't help me that the general contractor hired them and it was too little damage to make a big fuss over, considering that was the beginning of an 18 month renovation. Call the BBB and find another company!

See - that is the thing. You are not getting real professionals, you are getting people who are desperate for money (wh/ is why I say these employers should be penalized for hiring illegals). And I don't care what they say - there is no way illegals are being covered under workman's comp. I do not want people on my property who don't have worker's comp. First of all, I don't wanna get sued and secondly, what typically happens is - if someone who is an illegal immigrant has a job site injury - they either do not get proper medical help or they end up at the Emergency Dept . . . w/ no insurance coverage . . . so the hospital has to absorb the cost of treating them (Federal mandate). Essentially, we have let the employer off the hook - (not paying fair wage, not paying worker's comp) and then shifted responsibility for on-site injuries to the rest of us!!! Just makes me so angry.

ICE should be raiding employers who hire illegals, plain and simple!!!!!

[flexysteve]

Maybe its my short New England fuse or watching too much Holmes on Homes (which I highly recommend). But at the first sign that the crew is unprofessional or doesn't know WTF they are doing, have them stop asap. Pay for jobs in segments and stop paying and tell them not to come back. Theres always other contractors who can finish up properly. Theres no sense in having a bad contractor finish a poor job, only to have to pay again to have someone else rip it out.

There are plenty of good companies looking for work, especially now, not to have to deal with people like this. Bad contractors and companies can do alot more harm than good in short order. If these guys had gone hog wild you may have needed new soffits, shingles, and fascia boards before they are done.

Sad to say about contractors but Cover Your A-- and Don't Trust Anyone.

[brokensky]

Originally Posted by flexysteve

Maybe its my short New England fuse or watching too much Holmes on Homes (which I highly recommend). But at the first sign that the crew is unprofessional or doesn't know WTF they are doing, have them stop asap. Pay for jobs in segments and stop paying and tell them not to come back. Theres always other contractors who can finish up properly. Theres no sense in having a bad contractor finish a poor job, only to have to pay again to have someone else rip it out.

There are plenty of good companies looking for work, especially now, not to have to deal with people like this. Bad contractors and companies can do alot more harm than good in short order. If these guys had gone hog wild you may have needed new soffits, shingles, and fascia boards before they are done.

Sad to say about contractors but Cover Your A-- and Don't Trust Anyone.

Thank you, Steve. The Polite Homeowner side of me felt bad about sending the guys off . . . but the Tough Business Side said - this ain't working.

I appreciate your making me feel like I wasn't a total wacko for going w/ my gut on this one . . .

[TheEmissary]

Originally Posted by anifani821

Thank you, Steve. The Polite Homeowner side of me felt bad about sending the guys off . . . but the Tough Business Side said - this ain't working.

I appreciate your making me feel like I wasn't a total wacko for going w/ my gut on this one . . .

ani - You have nothing to feel guilty about in the least. You are paying your hard-earned money for a specific service. One of the most basic premises of any service is the ability to communicate your wishes to those performing that service. I don't think that includes the ability on your part, to speak Spanish like a native in conveying what you want done. At the very least, one of this company's employees should have, at a minimum, proficiency in English. That's not asking for alot. These guys might have done a good job, but you have no way of knowing that. What do you think are the chances that they were actually legal immigrants? Probably slim to none!

I just wish that all of the people that were annoyed with illegal immigration were even more annoyed with the employers who hired them. Perhaps, if the company you chose were fined $25,000 for hiring these people, maybe next time a new customer would be greeted with employees that speak English.

As long as these small businesses can get away with hiring illegals for $7 to $10 an hour and pocketing the profits, I'm afraid it will be "business as usual".

[brokensky]

Originally Posted by TheEmissary

ani - You have nothing to feel guilty about in the least. You are paying your hard-earned money for a specific service. One of the most basic premises of any service is the ability to communicate your wishes to those performing that service. I don't think that includes the ability on your part, to speak Spanish like a native in conveying what you want done. At the very least, one of this company's employees should have, at a minimum, proficiency in English. That's not asking for alot. These guys might have done a good job, but you have no way of knowing that. What do you think are the chances that they were actually legal immigrants? Probably slim to none!

I just wish that all of the people that were annoyed with illegal immigration were even more annoyed with the employers who hired them. Perhaps, if the company you chose were fined $25,000 for hiring these people, maybe next time a new customer would be greeted with employees that speak English.

As long as these small businesses can get away with hiring illegals for $7 to $10 an hour and pocketing the profits, I'm afraid it will be "business as usual".

Thank you Em - wise words!!! And I agree - fine the employers!!

I will continue to say this and don't care if it is PC or not. Hiring illegal immigrants has created an indentured slave class in this country. People come here illegally and have no police protection, now Wage & Hour Board protection, no workmen's comp . . . they are paid under the table (allowing the employer to get away w/ tax fraud, may I add!!!!!). I am furious that our gov't is turning a blind eye to employers who are, in my opinion, engaging in abusive practices - the employees are truly treated no better than slaves - heck - even slaves get food and board and these guys don't get high enuff wages to do much more than pile into rental houses by the dozens.

To me, these practices verge on human rights violations. Just outrageous.

[flexysteve]

Don't feel bad about choosing whatever contractor you like. If you don't want illegals, ask the contractor if there will be illegals working on the job. If there will be, tell him he won't get your money. That is more effective than going through the government and hoping they fine the business. We are in a free society, if you want a woman contractor or an irish one or one who can do the work while riding on a unicycle then go for it.

I am of the opinion that if I'm paying someone to do a job for me, I should be able to communicate with them and ask them why are they doing that or voice a concern if they do something wrong. If there is no supervisor at the site who I feel is knowledgeable, I'll send them packing.