Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I get your point here, I just do not think children should pay the price for adult decisions. Why for instance should I as a 9 year old need to have a 1 1/2 hour long round trip commute to my school? The truth is that by busing me from Idlewild Rd to Lasalle St from 4th - 6th grade all they accomplished was painting a bulls eye on me for the school bullies and teaching me how to defend myself against them. It was one of many truly horrible experiences I can thank the CMS busing system for. Like you my daughter will either be zoned for a school I trust or go to private school. Until they implement school vouchers and public schools have to worry about losing students like a business does clients we (the public) will always be on the losing end.
I remember those days in Charlotte - what a nightmare! Thank goodness we do not have forced busing any longer.
For too many years Charlotte was under a court ordered mandate to integrate it's schools by forced busing. While initially successful, the city and school system grew so large by the late 1980's that this was no longer a workable solution to end segregation. Busing became a logistic nightmare for most kids and their families until it was overturned in the mid '90's. Now we have neighborhood schools
You can read about it, the Swann vs Charlotte Mecklenburg Board of Education case:
In Charlotte, it probably makes more sense to rent a house than buy one, if sending your kids to a specific high school is important to you. I find all of the line-shifting and political imbruglio bizzarre. I went to a county school system .. and the kids from the area I knew from 3rd grade graduated with me in high school. It seemd so normal and obvious, at the time. The only thing jarring was the addition of "new kids" when I went to junior high because of the feed from other elementaries.
Teacher shuffling is another one... CMS is just wild. In my youth, I remember ther'd a a few new teachers each year, plus some of the standby's who had taught our parents.
I live in Mecklenburg, but if I had kids of my own, there's no way I'd be inside the borders. Why endure it? CATS offeres pretty good express bus service to the surrounding counties.
I get your point here, I just do not think children should pay the price for adult decisions. Why for instance should I as a 9 year old need to have a 1 1/2 hour long round trip commute to my school? The truth is that by busing me from Idlewild Rd to Lasalle St from 4th - 6th grade all they accomplished was painting a bulls eye on me for the school bullies and teaching me how to defend myself against them. It was one of many truly horrible experiences I can thank the CMS busing system for. Like you my daughter will either be zoned for a school I trust or go to private school. Until they implement school vouchers and public schools have to worry about losing students like a business does clients we (the public) will always be on the losing end.
So, playing devil's advocate, if busing was an attempt to desegregate schools and provide a more "level" playing field and you feel that busing didn't work, what is your proposed solution? Or do you think it was a problem that didn't need a solution?
So, playing devil's advocate, if busing was an attempt to desegregate schools and provide a more "level" playing field and you feel that busing didn't work, what is your proposed solution? Or do you think it was a problem that didn't need a solution?
Very interesting question... I have to say I've never asked how else to desegregate schools. The first thing that comes to mind is maybe a program helping families buy into certain neighborhoods. Not exactly the subsidized housing system as we know it but maybe a lottery with certain criteria where families with school aged children are helped to purchase existing homes. As far as schools already in less advantaged neighborhoods or those lacking what newer, better schools had, pour some of that busing money into them and make them so attractive that parents are happy to send their kids there. My basic instincts are to make slow gradual changes rather than uprooting communities and families.
My absolute worst CMS experience was being re-zoned to a different high school than the one my sister was already attending. She is one year older so she started Independence in 10th grade then the next year they decided to send me to East Meck, both were good schools at the time, they were just trying to balance out the race percentages between Garinger, EM and Indep. So my widowed father asked for an exception to be made and their (CMS) response was to pull my sister out of Indep and send her to EM where she knew absolutely noone but me. Those were 2 very long & difficult years, lot of fighting between my sister and me, lots of crazy juggling by my father between 2 schools and various events. He had to break down and buy us each a car because we obviously could not share. After those 2 years my sister and I were virtual strangers, I knew few of her friends, she knew none of mine. Then years later I came to find out several athletes were given exceptions based on better sports teams at different school.
I don't have all the answers but there really must have been something better than that right?
While I probably agree in principal that schools should be neighborhood schools, I'm aware enough to realize that that would mean in a lot of instances that there would be very very little diversity in the schools if we did that. The disparities that existed before would continue and that's not right. I'm also aware enough to recognize that people of means will send their kids to their school of choice, private or public. I"ve accepted that most likely my kids will go to private schools, just like their mother. ;-)
This always perplexed me . . . the idea that all kids need to be in a diverse school.
The reason it perplexes me is b/c if you notice what people tend to do when they then choose where to live later on in life . . . it seems to contradict the supposition.
And we often have requests on this forum, for ex., with folks asking where they can find an upscale all-black neighborhood . . . or where they can find a predominately Asian neighborhood . . . or a Puerto Rican or Dominican neighborhood . . . etc.
I know what the social theory is behind creating diversity in schools, but it doesn't seem to be a theory that has been proven as true if one looks at how folks decide on lifestyle later in life.
So I find it all quite perplexing and think that it only makes sense that kids should attend school at whatever school is closest to home. As long as the $$$ alloted to each school is the same - and there are no disparities w/ teacher's salaries and facilities . . . then every neighborhood should have a school that is providing the same high standard of education.
Neighborhood schools seem the logical way to keep parental involvement, as well.
So, playing devil's advocate, if busing was an attempt to desegregate schools and provide a more "level" playing field and you feel that busing didn't work, what is your proposed solution? Or do you think it was a problem that didn't need a solution?
But it did work. You have to put that decision in the context of what the schools were then, not now. In those days, it was the law that kids could be denied entrance to certain schools solely on their racial classification. It did not depend on where they lived. I know this very well because the first 5 years I was in school, they were completely segregated.
There were 3 classifications, White, Asian, Black. Whites and Asians attended one set of schools, Blacks were relegated to another set and the two sides did not cross at all. Now we are talking about public schools paid for by taxes by all. The Black schools suffered from no investment and a student graduating from one of these schools was automatically at a disadvantage. Interestingly enough, Whites and Asians could attend a Black school but Blacks absolutely could not attend any of the White schools.
Most people are familiar with Brown vs Board of Education which said "Separate but Equal" was not equal and didn't work. Local school systems found many ways to keep Blacks from attending the greater public school system. So in the early 70s, due to the lawsuit brought against CMS (see my post above), the Supreme Court ordered busing to force the issue. The end result is what we have today where such concepts of governmental backed racial segregation are rejected by most people.
As I mentioned above, I attended segregated schools when I was young. I grew up in Myrtle Beach, and we had a White and Black elementary school, jr. high, and a White highschool and Black highschool. It did not matter where you lived in town, the color of your skin got you an official assignment.
This was not just a Southern phenomenia. Some of the most violent protests against de-segegation took place in such places like Boston, Philly, Detroit, etc.
So I find it all quite perplexing and think that it only makes sense that kids should attend school at whatever school is closest to home. As long as the $$$ alloted to each school is the same - and there are no disparities w/ teacher's salaries and facilities . . . then every neighborhood should have a school that is providing the same high standard of education.
I totally agree with this in theory, but I don't think it's reality. You can't tell me that schools that have PTAs with tons of parental committees -- such as many of the schools in affluent areas of the county -- have the same type of resources as schools in CMS that have to struggle to even get people involved in the PTA (yes, there are some like this in the system). Teachers may be paid the same, and the facilities may be the same, but the schools aren't the same.
If you look at a school that struggles, you will see a lack of parental support and a large student population that has performed below grade level since K. Sadly, many of these students -- particularly in poor performing, high poverty schools with minimal PTA organizations-- are already behind when they begin their schooling and are never able to catch up. In fact, I have seen research that shows that this disparity among children from high poverty backgrounds can be seen as early as 9 months old.
But it did work. (not directed at you but the question in general) You have to put that decision in the context of what the schools were then, not now. In those days, it was the law that kids could be denied entrance to certain schools solely on their racial classification. It did not depend on where they lived. I know this very well because the first 5 years I was in school, they were completely segregated.
There were 3 classifications, White, Asian, Black. Whites and Asians attended one set of schools, Blacks were relegated to another set and the two sides did not cross at all. Now we are talking about public schools paid for by taxes by all. The Black schools suffered from no investment and a student graduating from one of these schools was automatically at a disadvantage. Interestingly enough, Whites and Asians could attend a Black school but Blacks absolutely could not attend any of the White schools.
Most people are familiar with Brown vs Board of Education which said "Separate but Equal" was not equal and didn't work. Local school systems found many ways to keep Blacks from attending the greater public school system. So in the early 70s, due to the lawsuit brought against CMS (see my post above), the Supreme Court ordered busing to force the issue. The end result is what we have today where such concepts of governmental backed racial segregation are rejected by most people.
As I mentioned above, I attended segregated schools when I was young. I grew up in Myrtle Beach, and we had a White and Black elementary school, jr. high, and a White highschool and Black highschool. It did not matter where you lived in town, the color of your skin got you an official assignment.
This was not just a Southern phenomenia. Some of the most violent protests against de-segegation took place in such places like Boston, Philly, Detroit, etc.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
