Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I am not talking about the office of elders and deacons, but these ones below.
Ephesians 4: 11And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 14That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
I can see the need for these offices and not just for the pastors. How many churches say they have all these positions filled and active within their churches? Not very many from what I can see. Or am I wrong?
Incidentally, I do not think it counts when a pastor does some evangelizing also. It seems they seperate the offices for a reason so as to not to put all the burden of the ministering of the church to be on the pastors.
Pastor is someone that ministers to the general growth of the body of Christ.
Evangelists should be for outreach in converting new believers.
Apostles are what? Those that contend for the faith in keeping it? They bring to notice the ills of society and their teachings in combatting them?
Prophets are those that are up on daily events in light of prophesy in keeping the congregation aware of things?
Teachers are those that edify in the knowledge of Him.
Granted, some apostles, prophets, evangelists, and teachers are elders and deacons, but how many elders and deacons are apostles, prophets, evangelists, and teachers?
So are all of the offices filled in your church or not?
The Church I go there are some Holy Spirit Teachers who are Pastors and elders, There are about four Pastors with only one Pastor on salary the rest are elders and qualified Pastors who leader and Preach and sometimes teach. There are about ten people who are called to be prophets in the church and Jesus spirit can freely pick whoever he wants at his time to confirm a word or issue for faith or call to redemption, clarity into HIS Word for HIS children, but the Lord rarely give a Word of Knowledge, but maybe special meetings, ... There are about five Evangelist called in the church who do street evangelism and jail evangelism, but the Lead Pastor usually gives a call for new converts for prayer during the service....... There are Apostle anointing for some missionary worker who are sent to India and Africa for the Work of the Lord and some people anointed for prayer for the Apostle, but our church is under the Leadership of an Apostle group from a ministeries from New York who are qualified to issue licences for Pastors to conduct Weddings and funerals authority... Most of the Five Offices of the Holy Spirit but the Lord is still weak on the evangelist and the Apostle, but this work is still there.
some apostles, prophets, evangelists, and teachers are elders and deacons, but how many elders and deacons are apostles, prophets, evangelists, and teachers?
What do you mean by "your church"? With 33,000 + splinter groups (denominations) some having 1000's of individual "churches" (an estimated 3,700,000 "congregations" worldwide) are you saying every individual fellowship should have a complete 5 fold ministry team?
What do you mean by "your church"? With 33,000 + splinter groups (denominations) some having 1000's of individual "churches" (an estimated 3,700,000 "congregations" worldwide) are you saying every individual fellowship should have a complete 5 fold ministry team?
Considering the prophesied sorry state of the Gentile churches before His appearing, I would think that a 5 fold ministry team would prevent apostasy from coming in, but it appears I am wrong. Some churches may have the appearance of a 5 fold ministry, but it does not mean they do it well.
Anyhow... a 5 fold ministry is for this effect.
Ephesians 4: 11And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:14That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
I reckon a five fold ministry is more likely to become complacent in guarding against every wind of doctrine by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness to deceive. Course, if the five fold team are not resting in their laurels and depending on Their Good Shepherd to lead, then it should serve the body of Christ for the perfecting of the saints.
The Church I go there are some Holy Spirit Teachers who are Pastors and elders, There are about four Pastors with only one Pastor on salary the rest are elders and qualified Pastors who leader and Preach and sometimes teach. There are about ten people who are called to be prophets in the church and Jesus spirit can freely pick whoever he wants at his time to confirm a word or issue for faith or call to redemption, clarity into HIS Word for HIS children, but the Lord rarely give a Word of Knowledge, but maybe special meetings, ... There are about five Evangelist called in the church who do street evangelism and jail evangelism, but the Lead Pastor usually gives a call for new converts for prayer during the service....... There are Apostle anointing for some missionary worker who are sent to India and Africa for the Work of the Lord and some people anointed for prayer for the Apostle, but our church is under the Leadership of an Apostle group from a ministeries from New York who are qualified to issue licences for Pastors to conduct Weddings and funerals authority... Most of the Five Offices of the Holy Spirit but the Lord is still weak on the evangelist and the Apostle, but this work is still there.
I am not talking about the office of elders and deacons, but these ones below.
Ephesians 4: 11And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 14That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
I can see the need for these offices and not just for the pastors. How many churches say they have all these positions filled and active within their churches? Not very many from what I can see. Or am I wrong?
Incidentally, I do not think it counts when a pastor does some evangelizing also. It seems they seperate the offices for a reason so as to not to put all the burden of the ministering of the church to be on the pastors.
Pastor is someone that ministers to the general growth of the body of Christ.
Evangelists should be for outreach in converting new believers.
Apostles are what? Those that contend for the faith in keeping it? They bring to notice the ills of society and their teachings in combatting them?
Prophets are those that are up on daily events in light of prophesy in keeping the congregation aware of things?
Teachers are those that edify in the knowledge of Him.
Granted, some apostles, prophets, evangelists, and teachers are elders and deacons, but how many elders and deacons are apostles, prophets, evangelists, and teachers?
So are all of the offices filled in your church or not?
All of these exist in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The Church as a whole is led by a prophet and twelve Apostles, each of whom we believe to have been called of God. The organization established by Jesus Christ shortly before His death ceased to exist when the prophets and apostles He chose were martyred. He has re-established the Church He originally founded, along with the organization described by Paul in Ephesians 4.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
