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This attitude of so many seems to glory in one's sin with no real attempt to draw upon Jesus' grace to the crucifying of the flesh. Jesus knows who are His and who aren't.
And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. - Galatians 5:24
...Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. - 2 Timothy 2:19
When Jesus said "deny thy self"....what self was he speaking about?
K....but you didn't answer the question I posited: what "self" was Jesus referring to? Tell me what "self" means to you....explain your "self" to me.
I thought I did. The "soul realm" is where all the selfish passions (lust, anger, fear, discontent, etc.) are - remember, the Fall "killed" the soul, which actually set it upon the throne of man's nature.
I thought I did. The "soul realm" is where all the selfish passions (lust, anger, fear, discontent, etc.) are - remember, the Fall "killed" the soul, which actually set it upon the throne of man's nature.
If we all died in Adam, why is not so?
You are wrong Elmer...I think that is the problem...you are confusing your false "self" which is your ego/the things, thoughts and forms you identify your "self" with and your true self (your consciousness)...which is egoless, thoughtless and formless. The more one makes their thoughts (beliefs) into their identiy the more cut off one becomes from the spiritual dimension within oneself.
We are not born with identification to our form/egoic thoughts...it is a learned process...and it is also something we can overcome by turning off or dissolving our thoughts/ego...raising our consciousness above thought. This is truly what Jesus meant when he said to "deny thy self".
Try this experiment...be still and just observe your thoughts.
You are wrong Elmer...I think that is the problem...
If something is true about someone, but not true about you - should you call them "wrong"?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyGrl
We are not born with identification to our form/egoic thoughts...it is a learned process...
Humor me then: How is it that an infant who learns to vocalize its feelings into "No!" and "Mine!" - is this a "learned" behavior, or one that is manifesting inner characteristics that were there from the beginning?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristyGrl
...it is also something we can overcome by turning off or dissolving our thoughts/ego...raising our consciousness above thought. This is truly what Jesus meant when he said to "deny thy self".
I partially agree with this, but more of an experiential exercise; the fire of God will burn out the dross of the soulish realm, but the screaming, cursing, fearing manifestations that display themselves are rooted in the spirit of man.
Here's another experiment: There are two people in a lake.
(1) a man who is drowning will take others down with him in any and every attempt to save his own life - that is the carnal nature on display - we would not let go willingly of our life if it was left up to us. (2) a dead body in that same water will float without any effort if there is air trapped in the person's lungs.
It's not what the person is, it's Who's inside them. That's what it means to let go, and let God.
When i ever see,read or hear sinners or christians in sin being slammed by christians i will always speak on behalf of the sinner, without fail.
pcamps - all too often, sin is smoothed over by Christians; matter of fact, sin is par for the course, even for their priests, pastors and teachers. Well, I have news for those who subscribe to that foul doctrine: it is not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ; it's another gospel, and it's heaping damnation upon their heads.
If something is true about someone, but not true about you - should you call them "wrong"?
My bad...but ultimately you are deceived by your egoic thinking...think on that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer
Humor me then: How is it that an infant who learns to vocalize its feelings into "No!" and "Mine!" - is this a "learned" behavior, or one that is manifesting inner characteristics that were there from the beginning?
Yes...this is definitely a learned and conditioned behavior. When a young child learns that a sequence of sounds produced by the parents' vocal chords is his or her name, the child begins to equate a word, which in the mind becomes a thought, with who he or she is...soon after, they will learn the magic word "I" and equate it with their name, which they have already equated with who they are...this is when other thoughts come and merge with the original "I" thought. The next step are thoughts of "me" and "mine" to designate things that become a part of their "I"...this identification with objects, which means investing things, which ultimately are thoughts that represent things, with a sense of self, thereby deriving an identity from them. When you take a toy away from a child, a toy which a child had identified as part of his or her identity as "my" toy, intense suffereing arises...not because the toy has any intrinsic value to the child but because the toy became a part of the child's developing sense of self, or "I".
Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer
I partially agree with this, but more of an experiential exercise; the fire of God will burn out the dross of the soulish realm, but the screaming, cursing, fearing manifestations that display themselves are rooted in the spirit of man.
The only thing that is required is to be still...be thoughtless and aware...this is when one will find and experience their true self...this is when one will KNOW that we are ALL CONNECTED TO THE SOURCE...THAT WE ARE ALL ONE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer
Here's another experiment: There are two people in a lake.
(1) a man who is drowning will take others down with him in any and every attempt to save his own life - that is the carnal nature on display - we would not let go willingly of our life if it was left up to us. (2) a dead body in that same water will float without any effort if there is air trapped in the person's lungs.
You are correct...a person who is not consciously aware of their true self will still be living unconsciously in their egoic/carnal thoughts and will still see themselves as separate and not connected to the rest of humanity and God...so their survival will be one of self/egoic interest and they will not have a concern for anything or anyone else. This is the dysfunction of most of humanity.
When Jesus said to love our neighbor as ourselves...this can only be accomplished if one is consciously aware that our neighbor is ourself...that we are ALL ONE CONSCIOUSNESS....WE ARE ALL CONNECTED....WE ARE ALL ONE. Our actions not only affect us but they affect EVERYONE...which can be better known as the Butterfly Effect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer
It's not what the person is, it's Who's inside them. That's what it means to let go, and let God.
But if one hasn't let go...meaning let go of their thoughts, concepts, forms, in other words their EGO (which is only interested in maintaining the false sense of "self")...one will never even come close to encountering God...which can only be found within and not somewhere out there. Only with conscious awareness of our true self can we shine the light or manifest God into the world.
Christy - isn't this what we've called "New Age", where all we need is already within ourselves?
I absolutely do not believe this to be true.
You can give what I've told you an egoic label as "New Age"...but it is exactly what Jesus taught...Jesus told us the Kingdom of God is found within us...so why would you be looking anywhere else for it???
Take this saying to heart Elmer....Be still and KNOW that I am God.
In the words of Nike......JUST DO IT!!
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