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Sorry sciotamicks. I still don't understand the answer. I'm not trying to be difficult, I'm just having a hard time following you on that.
Hi trettep,
Sorry for not getting back to you sooner. I believe God salvaged the covenant between Him and man. Adam was given eternal life, if he obeyed. He failed, and lost that life. Christ mended that back together. Now how does man get that life back? This is the crux of the redemptive scheme. To not eat from the tree of knowledge, but to eat from the tree of life. To attain the resurrection of the dead, one must believe in Christ. At least that is how I see it. Now what God does apart from that, is left open to Him alone. I am sure His mercy is great.
I'm talking about Adam and whether Jesus died in order that Adam would be forgiven for the sin he committed by disobeying God.
Not really. I see a lot of sins, but Adam didn't commit any of them. Other people did.
That's where I disagree. I think babies die because they are sick.
I don't think the baby did "get the sin," because I believe that Christ atoned for it, and it was forgiven. I believe babies are without sin. I think we die because Adam's sin brought death into the world.
None of this actually answers my question, though. When Jesus Christ atoned for the sins of mankind, I thought that included Adam. It sounds like you believe you will be forgiven of your sins because Jesus died to pay the price for them, but that you don't believe He paid the price for Adam's sin and that Adam therefore died as an unrepentant sinner. Correct me, please, if I've misunderstood you.
It's like being the 'CEO' of your own company, and all the employees you have are a representative of you and your company. Therefore no matter what they do, (inside or outside), of the company, they are still held accountable as being a part of you. Being a human-being we are still held accountable for our actions, (good/bad). Adam was no different. The only thing Adam had that (at that time) the others didn't have was total responsibility for all of 'Creation,' as well as his own. He represented not only all of creation but he was God's representative on earth. This was handed down through the ages, even to this day and time, no matter what we may think or do,...good or bad,...right or wrong,...old or young,...etc.
No one is responsible for another person's sin. One may be responsible for being a part of a company that he knows does bad things, but that is his own responsibility. All "Adams sin" did was indicate that men have a propensity TO do selfish things, but that is not "sin" until they DO them. The doctrine of "original sin" is a crock, and "the Atonement" is the opportunity for each of us to wipe our own slate clean and participate in our community with a fresh start.
No one is responsible for another person's sin. One may be responsible for being a part of a company that he knows does bad things, but that is his own responsibility. All "Adams sin" did was indicate that men have a propensity TO do selfish things, but that is not "sin" until they DO them. The doctrine of "original sin" is a crock, and "the Atonement" is the opportunity for each of us to wipe our own slate clean and participate in our community with a fresh start.
Hi, sciotamicks. It's good to see you again! I definitely agree that all of us suffer physical death because of Adam's transgression. I also agree that we are all born with the propensity to sin. I guess I just believe that if Jesus Christ will forgive me of my sins, He would do the same for Adam. If He forgave Adam for his sin, I don't see how we could still inherit it. The sin itself would be atoned for, forgiven, forgotten, (IMO).
I guess another question I could have asked instead is, "Is Adam going to heaven or hell, and why?"
You are right in believing that Adam's sin is forgiven. Everyone's sin is forgiven, but the question is after realizing that your sin is forgiven, then what are you going to do with your life. Now to answer you about Adam. In the New Testament we read that Jesus died for all sin. That means sin from Adam also. In the Old Testament they didn't know about Jesus (personally) dying for their sins. But everyone had the opportunity to repent of their sins through the 'Priest.' Prophets also came on the scene to declare the Word of God. Now here is where it gets a little hard for some people to understand. Do ever remember in your child-hood or adult-hood Roman Catholics mentioning something about "Pergatory, a place where the dead would go and sleep until the day of the resurrection,...and all other denominations would say that they (the Catholics) were wrong,...that they were taking scripture out of context?
Well,..upon my study of the Holy Bible,...I have found out that the Catholics were not far off the mark. The only thing they were wrong about was the name.
In the New Testament, when Jesus was hanging on the cross between two thieves,...one of them asked Jesus to remember him when Him come into His Kingdom. Jesus told him,... "TODAY YOU SHALL BE WITH ME IN PARADISE."
now if you study those scriptures more closely, you will see that the 'Paradise' Jesus was talking about and the 'Pergatory' the Catholics talk about is the same place,...
When Jesus died and went down into the grave the first place He stopped at was 'Paradise.' There He was with all the saints from the Old Testament, and gave them all an opportunity to accept Him as their Savior and Lord. In other words,...yes Adam had an opportunity to be receive salvation just like you and I have. sorry for the longness of my answer, but that was the only way I could answer it and hope you received an understanding. Maybe sometime in the future, I will have an opportunity to further explain this and give you proper scripture with it. Bishop!
You are right in believing that Adam's sin is forgiven. Everyone's sin is forgiven, but the question is after realizing that your sin is forgiven, then what are you going to do with your life. Now to answer you about Adam. In the New Testament we read that Jesus died for all sin. That means sin from Adam also. In the Old Testament they didn't know about Jesus (personally) dying for their sins. But everyone had the opportunity to repent of their sins through the 'Priest.' Prophets also came on the scene to declare the Word of God. Now here is where it gets a little hard for some people to understand. Do ever remember in your child-hood or adult-hood Roman Catholics mentioning something about "Pergatory, a place where the dead would go and sleep until the day of the resurrection,...and all other denominations would say that they (the Catholics) were wrong,...that they were taking scripture out of context?
Well,..upon my study of the Holy Bible,...I have found out that the Catholics were not far off the mark. The only thing they were wrong about was the name.
In the New Testament, when Jesus was hanging on the cross between two thieves,...one of them asked Jesus to remember him when Him come into His Kingdom. Jesus told him,... "TODAY YOU SHALL BE WITH ME IN PARADISE."
now if you study those scriptures more closely, you will see that the 'Paradise' Jesus was talking about and the 'Pergatory' the Catholics talk about is the same place,...
When Jesus died and went down into the grave the first place He stopped at was 'Paradise.' There He was with all the saints from the Old Testament, and gave them all an opportunity to accept Him as their Savior and Lord. In other words,...yes Adam had an opportunity to be receive salvation just like you and I have. sorry for the longness of my answer, but that was the only way I could answer it and hope you received an understanding. Maybe sometime in the future, I will have an opportunity to further explain this and give you proper scripture with it. Bishop!
Hi, and welcome to the forum!
When I asked the question (back about 2 1/2 years ago ), I was curious as to whether anyone would come up with the answer you did. Without reviewing the entire thread, I would suspect that no one did.
The point of my question was to try to figure out exactly why so many people believe we're still being held accountable for something Adam did. If Adam truly was forgiven through Christ's Atonement (as you and I agree he was), then why do people think God is still declaring all of Adam's descendants "guilty" from the moment they draw their first breath. If God forgave Adam, then we are not guilty nor will we be held accountable for what he did; we will, however, be held accountable for our own behavior.
The concept of Paradise/Purgatory wasn't exactly where I was going with the thread, but I more or less agree with you. At least, we appear to be on more or less the same track.
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Adams Responsibility
), I was curious as to whether anyone would come up with the answer you did. Without reviewing the entire thread, I would suspect that no one did. 
