Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
you cannot reject or accept what you have never heard of . . . He has already saved ALL of us anyway . . . you are concerned about "precepts and doctrines of men." As long as we "love God and each other" there is no need to figure out the rest of the nonsense promulgated by religions. The dogma is nothing but human vanity and hubris..
Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep
Has He really saved us all ALREADY? Isn't that really a false statement?
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj
If god doesnt abide by time then it is true. It is done. Where on the timeline the start and end are we cannot see in our time. Right?
From another thread:
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm
That's kind of an odd interpretation... It would seem, if what you're telling us is true, Peter's keys on earth would have preeminence over what happens in heaven. I don't think that is what Mat 16:19 or Mat 18:18 is actually telling us. Here is how these texts read, using the YLT:
Mat 16:19 and I will give to thee the keys of the reign of the heavens, and whatever thou mayest bind upon the earth shall be having been bound in the heavens, and whatever thou mayest loose upon the earth shall be having been loosed in the heavens.'
Mat 18:18 `Verily I say to you, Whatever things ye may bind upon the earth shall be having been bound in the heavens, and whatever things ye may loose on the earth shall be having been loosed in the heavens.
If you'll notice, the verbs "bind" and "loose" (those things being done on earth with Peter's keys) are in the Greek aorist tense, subjunctive mood. Those acts are simple occurrence (punctiliar events, if you will), without regard to timing.
The verb translated as "shall be" is in the Greek future tense.
However, the verbs "bound" and "loosed" (those things done in Heaven) are in the Greek perfect tense. A completed event, acts that have already been completed in Heaven.
The keys given to Peter are simply for locking or unlocking whatever has already been, past tense, locked or unlocked in Heaven. And whatever Peter locks or unlocks, "shall be", future tense, locked or unlocked on earth. That is what those texts actually say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj
In a couple threads it has come up that men are already saved.
Thoughts?
Are all these things already done including salvation?
My belief is that it's already done because God this is God's purpose and He always accomplishes whatever He wills, but God is working out the process through the ages.
1 Corinthians 15:1
It was the Father's good pleasure for the fullness to dwell in Him and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross...
God bless.
Last edited by ShanaBrown; 12-11-2011 at 06:40 PM..
No, All men are not already saved. They shall be, but for now they are not...
Sorry, Trettep. Salvation has nothing to do with us. It was accomplished by Christ for us ALL, period. We just have to "believe Him." Sanctification/justification is our task and that is through "love of God and each other" daily (or repent when we don't).
Even though presently "God is the Saviour of all mankind" He is especially the Saviour of them that believe" (1Tim.4:10).
God wills that all mankind be saved. Believers are saved now by faith but when we are changed and put on immortality and incorruption then we believers will be saved in fact.
The rest of mankind come into salvation at the end of the ages.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
