Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
"Saved" has two meanings in the jargon and should be recognized as such. An "Arminian" would take it to mean something like, "In a condition that if one's life on earth ended, s/he would have immediate fellowship with Christ (whatever intermediate steps might be thought to occur like soul sleep until the Judgement)." Then you have that final outcome of life that we anticipate while we are still alive and which we can't know for sure until we endure to that end.
I simply do NOT understand all this preoccupation with being saved . . . since WE have nothing to do with it. WE are NOT our saviors . . . Christ IS and it is finished. We don't need to do the lifeguard's job. We just need to appreciate the life we have and spread His love as far and wide as we can as our sign of gratitude. His agape love was so perfect He voluntarily endured horrendous scourging and crucifixion . . . while still loving and forgiving even His torturers and murderers!!! "No greater love . . ." We should be ashamed at not trying to achieve some small imperfect agape love in His honor. How hard is it to "love God and each other" daily and repent when we don't? Not remotely as difficult as what Christ achieved.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ_Maxx
Nobody is buying your blasphemy. It is not us who saves but Christ, however, Christ has told us we must make a choice. Not everyone will be saved. Some will reject Christ's gift of grace.
No! . . . Christ has told us to follow Him and gave specific instructions directly to His disciples. The "precepts and doctrines of men" have created an "easy believism" way that they claim is what Christ wants. It is NOT! You have demonstrated an egregious lack of knowledge of Bible scholarship . . . yet you would pronounce judgments and accusations against the brethren as if you are some authoritative source. Moderator cut: deleted
Last edited by june 7th; 07-04-2014 at 11:03 AM..
Reason: !
"Saved" has two meanings in the jargon and should be recognized as such. An "Arminian" would take it to mean something like, "In a condition that if one's life on earth ended, s/he would have immediate fellowship with Christ (whatever intermediate steps might be thought to occur like soul sleep until the Judgement)." Then you have that final outcome of life that we anticipate while we are still alive and which we can't know for sure until we endure to that end.
Indeed. Salvation is not a light switch, it is a path out of oblivion, given by Jesus Christ. It is a path we must walk... Jesus said,
“Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it."
Do you ever remember a time where you received Christ and a dramatic change occurred in your life? Things like you became very interested in learning about God through His Word and a desire to live for Christ in obedience to His Word?
I didn't say one couldn't be in a saved position( another mortal has 0 clue except in theory) but they must endure till the end or they lose it if they had it to start with. Solomon started worshipping false gods at his end--he lost. He lost Gods favor. Judas may have had it to, but he lost it as well. No one knows what tomorrow brings.
I think we make a lot of changes to become born again in this sense--strip off the old personality( worker of iniquity) and put on the new personality( righteous) --living to do Gods will 24/7--like Jesus did. We cannot do it without God.
Jesus taught---Enter through the narrow gate, for cramped is the road that leads off into life( eternal) Few will find it, For broad and spacious the path that leads to destruction( eternal) many have entered this way.
No! . . . Christ has told us to follow Him and gave specific instructions directly to His disciples. The "precepts and doctrines of men" have created an "easy believism" way that they claim is what Christ wants. It is NOT! You have demonstrated an egregious lack of knowledge of Bible scholarship . . . yet you would pronounce judgments and accusations against the brethren as if you are some authoritative source. Moderator cut: Orphaned
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift
"Saved" has two meanings in the jargon and should be recognized as such. An "Arminian" would take it to mean something like, "In a condition that if one's life on earth ended, s/he would have immediate fellowship with Christ (whatever intermediate steps might be thought to occur like soul sleep until the Judgement)." Then you have that final outcome of life that we anticipate while we are still alive and which we can't know for sure until we endure to that end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ_Maxx
Indeed. Salvation is not a light switch, it is a path out of oblivion, given by Jesus Christ. It is a path we must walk... Jesus said,
“Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it."
-Matthew 7:13-14
Walking does NOT mean "believing the right things." It means we actually FOLLOW Christ's instructions to His disciples to "love God and each other" daily and repent when we don't.
Walking does NOT mean "believing the right things." It means we actually FOLLOW Christ's instructions to His disciples to "love God and each other" daily and repent when we don't.
I love my wife, so I am faithful to her. Love is the beginning, not an ending. We love God, so we obey His commandments, as He told us to do.
I simply do NOT understand all this preoccupation with being saved . . . since WE have nothing to do with it. WE are NOT our saviors . . . Christ IS and it is finished. We don't need to do the lifeguard's job. We just need to appreciate the life we have and spread His love as far and wide as we can as our sign of gratitude. His agape love was so perfect He voluntarily endured horrendous scourging and crucifixion . . . while still loving and forgiving even His torturers and murderers!!! "No greater love . . ." We should be ashamed at not trying to achieve some small imperfect agape love in His honor. How hard is it to "love God and each other" daily and repent when we don't? Not remotely as difficult as what Christ achieved.
I was showing the connection of these teachers that are prevalent all over the world-2Corinthians 11:12-15---One does not want to be taught by these. And how they have 0 right telling anyone they are saved-they elevate themselves into Gods position--only God writes names in the book of life--no mortal knows. Many of these kind teach once saved always saved--not truth. There are others too---the tithe seekers. Jesus taught a parable under the new covenant--LOVE--all the teachers tithed--a little old woman put in 2 little coins, out of love--Jesus said her giving was worth more than all of the others combined. One doesn't get the opportunity to exercise use of the heart if the written law of tithe is there.
The "walk" is one that can only exist in obedience and the tutelage of the Holy Spirit Jesus designated to teach in His place.
Academics do not accomplish this .
God is not manipulated.
Matthew 7;21,22,23, is very clear simply knowing the power of Jesus name is not a relationship.
John 15; Jesus makes it clear that those whom are fruitless( leaches) the Father will have removed from His Son.
A leach is self serving .
Being born of the Spirit is; being carried, supported, and directed of God,
not one doing their own thing no matter how noble it may appear.
Noble deeds and obedience are two different things.
Many different places Jesus said be faithful to the end and being found faithful are significant issues .
One would do well, to desperately seek after Jesus for the introduction of the Holy Spirit, and His tutelage, rather then the things men teach.
I believe a mortal would have to be able to do 1 of 3 things in order to tell another--you are saved( born again)
1) see the name written in the book of life---He cannot
2) he must be able to read the true heart--he cannot
3) he must be able to see the future and see who endured till the end---he cannot.
The true bottom line of being saved---those who endure till the end( death or har-mageddon) will be saved. Matt 10:22
Paul likened it to a race--must run with endurance--one must cross the finish line. 1Cor 9:24--or one could be disapproved.
Thus only in theory can a mortal reason that another is saved--but they do not know. beware these teachers--2Corinthians 11:12-15
While one may believe they are saved, no human can tell another they are.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
