Many "Christians" have been deceived and are on their way to destruction (Gospel, woman)
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This is a good thread. This is what the Bible says. If you guys are disagreeing with this than it must be because you and all your friends love to sin and be rebellious to God.
Think of it this way.
You have a friend who went to your house when you were at work. He flirts with your girlfriend, takes some of your money and eats some of your food then leaves. When you got home, your girlfriend told you what happened and you became angry at your friend. So you call him and confront him about his sins against you.
He says to you, "I'm really sorry, I feel horrible, I'm such a sinner, please forgive me, I repent. I put my trust in the fact that you are very forgiving and merciful"
So, you forgive your friend.
The next day, while you are at work, your friend returns again. This time he makes out with your girlfriend, wears your clothes, lays in your bed and watches tv while your girlfriend brings him lunch in bed.
You come home, notice his underwear on the floor, the crumbs all over the bed and you discover what went on.
So again, you confront your friend. He says, "Hey, you caught me, im really sorry, i wont do it again. I put my trust in the fact that you are very forgiving and merciful"
So you forgive your friend again.
The next day, the same thing happens, and the next day and the next day. In fact it happens every single day. Your girlfriend spends every moment with your friend while you are at work. They take your money and have all kinds of fun and go on all kinds of adventures. Then when you get home she is always tired and just wants to sleep.
This is a good thread. This is what the Bible says. If you guys are disagreeing with this than it must be because you and all your friends love to sin and be rebellious to God.
Think of it this way.
You have a friend who went to your house when you were at work. He flirts with your girlfriend, takes some of your money and eats some of your food then leaves. When you got home, your girlfriend told you what happened and you became angry at your friend. So you call him and confront him about his sins against you.
He says to you, "I'm really sorry, I feel horrible, I'm such a sinner, please forgive me, I repent. I put my trust in the fact that you are very forgiving and merciful"
So, you forgive your friend.
The next day, while you are at work, your friend returns again. This time he makes out with your girlfriend, wears your clothes, lays in your bed and watches tv while your girlfriend brings him lunch in bed.
You come home, notice his underwear on the floor, the crumbs all over the bed and you discover what went on.
So again, you confront your friend. He says, "Hey, you caught me, im really sorry, i wont do it again. I put my trust in the fact that you are very forgiving and merciful"
So you forgive your friend again.
The next day, the same thing happens, and the next day and the next day. In fact it happens every single day. Your girlfriend spends every moment with your friend while you are at work. They take your money and have all kinds of fun and go on all kinds of adventures. Then when you get home she is always tired and just wants to sleep.
Let me ask you this. Is your friend actually sorry for his sins against you? Are his actions truly forgivable?
Interesting... change the girlfriend into the wife and you just about got the book of Hosea. Hosea had a prostitute wife and the Lord instructed him to go after her and get her even though she violated her marriage covenant. The Lord's point to Israel through Hosea was that the nation repeatedly forsook the Lord - yet the Lord continued to honor the covenant He made.
Today, God's covenant to His people is sealed with our receipt of the Holy Spirit. He will not break His covenant with us even when we are not faithful. That's His character.
Today, God's covenant to His people is sealed with our receipt of the Holy Spirit. He will not break His covenant with us even when we are not faithful. That's His character.
Yes I agree with you. But I think we disagree on who actually has and lives by the Holy Spirit. It will be evident by the fact that they have turned from the ways of the flesh.
Matthew 18:15-17 “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector."
If a brother sins and you correct him, he will turn from his ways or else he was never actually a brother.
Today, God's covenant to His people is sealed with our receipt of the Holy Spirit. He will not break His covenant with us even when we are not faithful. That's His character.
Are the people of Hebrews 6 vs 4-6 sealed ?__________ or is it ' impossible ' for them?
If one proves unfaithful by committing the ' unforgivable sin ' of Matthew 12:32; Mark 3:29 is he sealed ?
Yes I agree with you. But I think we disagree on who actually has and lives by the Holy Spirit. It will be evident by the fact that they have turned from the ways of the flesh.
Matthew 18:15-17 “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector."
If a brother sins and you correct him, he will turn from his ways or else he was never actually a brother.
Not necessarily... what you describe is what should happen, but it's not a hard rule. God remains faithful. Salvation is more about God's character than our character.
Are the people of Hebrews 6 vs 4-6 sealed ?__________ or is it ' impossible ' for them?
If one proves unfaithful by committing the ' unforgivable sin ' of Matthew 12:32; Mark 3:29 is he sealed ?
Most people reading Hebrews 6, stop at verse 6. You need to go to verse 8.
Hebrews 6:4-8 - For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7 For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8 but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.
Verse 6 does NOT say those people are not saved... it does NOT say they have lost their salvation. It just says His death is applied to us one time. It is impossible to be applied again.
When you keep reading to verse 8, you see that those people are close to being cursed, but are NOT cursed. They are just burned. That is the judgment seat of Christ that is described in 1 Corinthians 3 that believers will endure after this life on earth.
I think that once in a while, Christians may sin. But that is not the norm. If it is the norm for you, you are not a Christian.
Repentance, crucifying the flesh, being born again, picking up your cross and following Christ etc...
These all speak about the process of turning from your sins. It is the very foundation of the faith.
"Trusting in Christ" while continuing sin is not the foundation of the faith.
Repenting, turning from your sin and trusting in Christ is the foundation of the faith.
Hebrews 6 "Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 and of instruction about washings,[a] the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do if God permits. 4 For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt."
I think that once in a while, Christians may sin. But that is not the norm. If it is the norm for you, you are not a Christian.
Repentance, crucifying the flesh, being born again, picking up your cross and following Christ etc...
These all speak about the process of turning from your sins. It is the very foundation of the faith.
"Trusting in Christ" while continuing sin is not the foundation of the faith.
Repenting, turning from your sin and trusting in Christ is the foundation of the faith.
Hebrews 6 "Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 and of instruction about washings,[a] the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do if God permits. 4 For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt."
Again - I agree it should be the norm. But I will not say those who are in that category are 100% unsaved.
This is a good thread. This is what the Bible says. If you guys are disagreeing with this than it must be because you and all your friends love to sin and be rebellious to God.
Think of it this way.
You have a friend who went to your house when you were at work. He flirts with your girlfriend, takes some of your money and eats some of your food then leaves. When you got home, your girlfriend told you what happened and you became angry at your friend. So you call him and confront him about his sins against you.
He says to you, "I'm really sorry, I feel horrible, I'm such a sinner, please forgive me, I repent. I put my trust in the fact that you are very forgiving and merciful"
So, you forgive your friend.
The next day, while you are at work, your friend returns again. This time he makes out with your girlfriend, wears your clothes, lays in your bed and watches tv while your girlfriend brings him lunch in bed.
You come home, notice his underwear on the floor, the crumbs all over the bed and you discover what went on.
So again, you confront your friend. He says, "Hey, you caught me, im really sorry, i wont do it again. I put my trust in the fact that you are very forgiving and merciful"
So you forgive your friend again.
The next day, the same thing happens, and the next day and the next day. In fact it happens every single day. Your girlfriend spends every moment with your friend while you are at work. They take your money and have all kinds of fun and go on all kinds of adventures. Then when you get home she is always tired and just wants to sleep.
Let me ask you this. Is your friend actually sorry for his sins against you? Are his actions truly forgivable?
After the second offense, I wouldn't have that friend, or that girlfriend.
Or any further problems along those lines.
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