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This is such a superfluous and disingenuous argument. You confuse loving and accepting people with acceptance and agreement of behavior, which Jesus never did. They are not mutually exclusive. You can both love someone and believe their actions are injurious.
As I said, Jesus was never in opposition with the OT laws. What was a sin against God is still a sin against God, except Jesus provided a better sacrifice to atone for those sins than farm animals and birds.
First, I plainly stated I would rather make a mistake loving and accepting a fellow "sinner," than make one by excluding them, making them feel sub-human, marginalizing their humanity, and self righteously denying them the right to marry. Apparently you would do the opposite--in fact you ARE doing the opposite if you aren't a part of the solution. Good luck on judgment day. God may tell me I was too forgiving and too merciful. It's just a personality flaw which He will have to judge.
And with regards to Jesus and the OT, have you even read them? Have you bothered to look up the "But I say unto you's?" I can't imagine what stories you have created ( or accepted by rote) to make it appear that Jesus accepted scripture as the Pharisees claimed it was delivered. He flat out stated that God was wrong by when He told Moses an eye for an eye. He had a NEW commandment.
Paul refutes many things Jesus said ( and James, the brother of Jesus as well). Jesus and James had very different views than Paul. I accept Paul where he is in agreement with Jesus, and look askance where he does not.
Your religion is very much Paulinian. It was Paul who pased judgment. It was Paul who wrote we are free from the LAW and then turned around to make his own LAWS showing that you can take a Pharisee out of his homeland but you can't take the heart out of a classically trained Pharisee. And this is what we debate. You are firmly ensconced in Christian Pharasaism and unwilling to take a chance that you might overlook some scriptural sinner. I take the approach of forgiving everyone EXCEPT those Pharisees--- the exact same thing that Jesus did.
There is something intrinsically wrong with worshipping a "perfect" book if you have to make creative stories to force round pegs into square holes. And it is the lack of having the heart of Jesus that drives Pharisees to do the same things over and over, century after century.
If you are unwilling to look at how our understanding of God has grown over the centuries, you are unable to grow yourself. The moment one decides he likes where he is spiritually, the spirit of God is no longer speaking to him. My views have changed and are still evolving. God may have finished His work of salvation, but He is just beginning to work changes in the hearts of men and women who are able to have visions beyond the sacred page.
I have no problem accepting that people can do with their money as they wish.
I would hope that someone as well-spoken and informed as yourself would at least acknowledge the fact that Jesus rebuked the Pharisees not for following the Scripture too closely, but not following it close enough. In the time between the OT and the NT, the religious leadership had changed and added things to God's Law which were not of the spirit of God. This is what Jesus rebuked them for.
This is such a superfluous and disingenuous argument. You confuse loving and accepting people with acceptance and agreement of behavior, which Jesus never did. They are not mutually exclusive. You can both love someone and believe their actions are injurious.
As I said, Jesus was never in opposition with the OT laws. What was a sin against God is still a sin against God, except Jesus provided a better sacrifice to atone for those sins than farm animals and birds.
No, but he was dead set AGAINST how they were enforced and the need to follow through on consequences. Jesus tried and is still tryng to teach us LOVE, MERCY, COMPASSION and the abilty to be NON-JUDGEMENTAL of our neighbors.
Then along come some heritic named Paul and sauddenly outlandish CONSEQUENCES are all the rage.
jeff, we've seen hundreds of posts from you that show where your thoughts lie.
And considering just about every one post of mine gets a dozen replies from your camp, i would say I am in the minority if we are judging by quantity of posts.
While Billy remained silent on these kinds of things, Franklin ain't a chip off the old block. He's bought into the Jerry Falwell/Pat Robertson/James Kennedy expression of christianity--I suspect in hopes of regaining some of Daddy's glory by supporting hate tactics.
Billy Graham did not remain silent on the issue, but said God will judge them for their sins. He also told homosexuals it is not too late for them to turn from their sins and come to God. Most recently he supported Mitt Romney on his "Biblical definition of marriage".
"any willing person can be liberated from homosexuality through the power of Jesus Christ."
"Such reformation is possible for you," "Seize it while there's still a chance."
"Your affection for another of your own sex is misdirected and will be judged by God's holy standards,"
Billy Graham did not remain silent on the issue, but said God will judge them for their sins. He also told homosexuals it is not too late for them to turn from their sins and come to God. Most recently he supported Mitt Romney on his "Biblical definition of marriage".
"any willing person can be liberated from homosexuality through the power of Jesus Christ."
"Such reformation is possible for you," "Seize it while there's still a chance."
"Your affection for another of your own sex is misdirected and will be judged by God's holy standards,"
Billy Graham should have remained silent on homosexuality because he certainly didn't know what he was talking about.
No scientific evidence exists to support the effectiveness of any of the conversion therapies that try to change sexual orientation.
Your religion is very much Paulinian. It was Paul who pased judgment. It was Paul who wrote we are free from the LAW and then turned around to make his own LAWS showing that you can take a Pharisee out of his homeland but you can't take the heart out of a classically trained Pharisee. And this is what we debate. You are firmly ensconced in Christian Pharasaism and unwilling to take a chance that you might overlook some scriptural sinner. I take the approach of forgiving everyone EXCEPT those Pharisees--- the exact same thing that Jesus did.
Paul is considered a Saint in both the Catholic and Eastern Orthodox churches. Quite a few Christian Churches are named St. Paul's. And his writings make up most of the New Testament. That's pretty impressive for a guy who wasn't a true Christian.
Prayer won't work either, it will not "liberate" anybody from homosexuality.
He wasn't talking about just prayer.
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