Gnosticism is all around us---

[mitchellmckain]

Originally Posted by janelle144

Of course, but we still need to co-operate with God or we can lose our salvation as Paul warned.

I would put it differently, to say that salvation is never an accomplishment, a right, or indeed something which we have in our pocket. In Romans 10 Paul says that faith doesn't even ask who is saved and who is damned. Doing so implies legalism instead of faith.

[cupper3]

Originally Posted by mitchellmckain

Both Jesus and Paul taught salvation by grace alone.
In Matthew 19 someone asks him what he must do to have eternal life. Jesus answer is "With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.
In Romans 3:24, Ephesians 2:8 and elsewhere Paul teaches that salvation is a gift of grace from God.

Jesus, Paul and James all taught that what God asks of us is faith, but NONE of them taught that what you do doesn't matter. All of them made it abundantly clear that works of love for your fellow human beings in need were central to how God viewed your relationship with Him: Jesus in Matthew 25:31-46, and Paul Romans 2 and 1 Cor 13. In the epistle of James, he explains that faith without works is dead, and religion which is pure and undefiled before God is to visit orphans and widows and to keep oneself unstained from the world. Even back in Isaiha chapter 1, God complains that religion without justice and doing good for those in need simply makes God sick of the whole thing.

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As for hell and eternal punishment, Jesus certainly did teach this many times. BUT you can certainly say that nothing in the Bible taught a whole lot directly about either heaven or hell. I think making to much of oblique parable references to them is a mistake. I think it suffices to say there is indeed a polarity in ultimate human destiny. Frankly I think this comes from the self-destructive nature of bad habits (sin) themselves. Either you fight against them (with help) or they eat away at you from you within until there is nothing left.

Except when Paul and the gospels say that salvation is not by grace alone. The bible is funny that way... says one thing in one place, and something different in others. But... it's inerrant, right.

• For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. 2 Corinthians 5:10
  
• For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. Matthew 16:27
  
• Who will render to each one according to his deeds.... For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified. Romans 2:6, 13
  
• For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. 2 Corinthians 5:10

Yea, the bible is one confused piece of literature.

[MysticPhD]

Originally Posted by mitchellmckain

Both Jesus and Paul taught salvation by grace alone.

This is because WE have nothing to do with our salvation and never did. Jesus did all that was necessary to save us all from permanent separation from God. The idea that we nust do something to save ourselves is a church creation to recruit members. All we need to do is follow Chriist's instructions to His disciples to love God and each other every day and repent when we don't to be sanctified under Christ's perfect love (agape) for us all.