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Rob, if I saw a resurrected Jesus I would believe too. And Jesus could solve the problem for the entire world tomorrow with one appearance. But he chooses to leave the disbelievers in disbelief. And he chooses to let millions of erstwhile Christians just walk away from their faith and into agnosticism or atheism. Please explain to me why? Free will again? Or is it the blessing of having faith? Faith, remember, is belief when there IS no evidence.
Jesus did come to the world, and He was rejected. He would be rejected by many today as well.
Jesus Christ does not leave any true believer. That is a promise He makes. People may stop following Him, and He allows it - but He does not leave them. Why do people walk away? I don't know - ask them. From what I have heard, it has very little to do with Jesus and/or the Father. Maybe if they focused more on Him than everyone else, they wouldn't walk away.
I think many people have a problem with God because He doesn't do what they would do. People are often telling God what He should do and they make up their own criteria on who God should be. Or they let non-believers effect how they see God and choose to walk away.
I follow Him for who He is. Why doesn't He reveal Himself to everybody? I don't know. He has revealed Himself to me, and has repeatedly displayed His love for me. So that's what's I go on.
Jesus did come to the world, and He was rejected. He would be rejected by many today as well.
Jesus Christ does not leave any true believer. That is a promise He makes. People may stop following Him, and He allows it - but He does not leave them. Why do people walk away? I don't know - ask them. From what I have heard, it has very little to do with Jesus and/or the Father. Maybe if they focused more on Him than everyone else, they wouldn't walk away.
I think many people have a problem with God because He doesn't do what they would do. People are often telling God what He should do and they make up their own criteria on who God should be. Or they let non-believers effect how they see God and choose to walk away.
I follow Him for who He is. Why doesn't He reveal Himself to everybody? I don't know. He has revealed Himself to me, and has repeatedly displayed His love for me. So that's what's I go on.
So you're saying the millions of Christians, including Christian fundamentalist pastors and evangelicals who are examining the evidence and then walking away from Christianity were not true believers?????
You're saying that I, who followed Christ faithfully for 60 years from infancy and once prayed, "Lord if I ever stray from you and it puts my soul in jeopardy of hell please take my life", I was not a true believer???
Here I am today in nearly perfect health and Jesus has not answered my prayer. I guess he doesn't care about my soul being damned, does he?
So you're saying the millions of Christians, including Christian fundamentalist pastors and evangelicals who are examining the evidence and then walking away from Christianity were not true believers?????
I don't know if they are true believers or not.
I know what Christ says. He is not going to leave believers. The Holy Spirit will be with us forever. Those are His promises
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillobyte
You're saying that I, who followed Christ faithfully for 60 years from infancy and once prayed, "Lord if I ever stray from you and it puts my soul in jeopardy of hell please take my life", I was not a true believer???
Here I am today in nearly perfect health and Jesus has not answered my prayer. I guess he doesn't care about my soul being damned, does he?
I don't know if you are a true believer or not. The way you conduct yourself on C-D, I would lean no. But I am not the judge... I don't know your heart. God does. Jesus does. That's ultimately between you and Him.
Why would He answer your prayer when you are often tearing down His word and His testimony? That seems ludicrous and unrealistic to me - that you would expect Him to give you what you want when you treat Him and His Word as you do.
Here's something else... look at your request.
"Lord if I ever stray from you and it puts my soul in jeopardy of hell please take my life"
If you are a true child of God by faith, your soul will never be in jeopardy. I just told you above what Christ promises. You are so focused on the contractions of minor details that you can't see what He has promised.
If you are a true believer by Jesus' standards (not your standards)... hear me on this... maybe the reason you have perfect health is because your soul is not jeopardy. Please let that sink in.
I know what Christ says. He is not going to leave believers. The Holy Spirit will be with us forever. Those are His promises
I don't know if you are a true believer or not. The way you conduct yourself on C-D, I would lean no. But I am not the judge... I don't know your heart. God does. Jesus does. That's ultimately between you and Him.
Why would He answer your prayer when you are often tearing down His word and His testimony? That seems ludicrous and unrealistic to me - that you would expect Him to give you what you want when you treat Him and His Word as you do.
Here's something else... look at your request.
"Lord if I ever stray from you and it puts my soul in jeopardy of hell please take my life"
If you are a true child of God by faith, your soul will never be in jeopardy. I just told you above what Christ promises. You are so focused on the contractions of minor details that you can't see what He has promised.
If you are a true believer by Jesus' standards (not your standards)... hear me on this... maybe the reason you have perfect health is because your soul is not jeopardy. Please let that sink in.
Apparently my bio has not surfaced as far as I thought.
I was a Bible-believing Christian and anyone who reads my earliest threads from 2009-2012 will see that is a true statement. Around 2012 I started wondering about some of the claims the agnostics were posting so I researched them. I was shocked to find over a period of three years that nearly everything they said about no secular historical record for Jesus was actually true. I started to ask myself, "How could God, who I'm sure wants people to believe in Jesus, not arrange to leave behind a record of Jesus so reliable, so indisputable, so ironclad that no skeptic could raise the slightest objection to it? And when I couldn't answer that question, I had to be truthful with myself and walk away.
Apparently my bio has not surfaced as far as I thought.
I was a Bible-believing Christian and anyone who reads my earliest threads from 2009-2012 will see that is a true statement. Around 2012 I started wondering about some of the claims the agnostics were posting so I researched them. I was shocked to find over a period of three years that nearly everything they said about no secular historical record for Jesus was actually true. I started to ask myself, "How could God, who I'm sure wants people to believe in Jesus, not arrange to leave behind a record of Jesus so reliable, so indisputable, so ironclad that no skeptic could raise the slightest objection to it? And when I couldn't answer that question, I had to be truthful with myself and walk away.
Then God answered your prayer. You strayed away. Your soul is not in jeopardy because it does not depend on you. Your health is fine.
However, he does want you to come back to him. You stopped listening to God and started listening to unbelievers. Did you really think people who don't know God are going to vouch for His Son?
You can't please God without faith. Following God is not about proof... it's about faith. We are never asked to prove anything. We are to believe in Him.
Then God answered your prayer. You strayed away. Your soul is not in jeopardy because it does not depend on you. Your health is fine.
However, he does want you to come back to him. You stopped listening to God and started listening to unbelievers. Did you really think people who don't know God are going to vouch for His Son?
You can't please God without faith. Following God is not about proof... it's about faith. We are never asked to prove anything. We are to believe in Him.
Well, the thing is I do believe in God. I just don't believe Jesus Christ is divine. I believe he was just an apocalyptic rabbi who got crucified. That's all the secular record indicates, what little we have dating circa 120- 150 CE.
Well, the thing is I do believe in God. I just don't believe Jesus Christ is divine. I believe he was just an apocalyptic rabbi who got crucified. That's all the secular record indicates, what little we have dating circa 120- 150 CE.
Whole bunch of people would agree with this Thrill.
A lot of believing people are under the opinion that Jesus wasn't divine and Jesus says himself,'' Why call me good? None are good but the father.''
We also see the first coming of Jesus in Ezekiel 45 where on Nisan 14, all the Holy days happen on one day, and this by the sacrifice of a prince who not only sacrifices for the sin of the nation, but also for himself.
Something I go back and forth with myself.
You are a rare person Thrill, most people will not turn just because they think they found truth of something and unless we go with our own hearts and minds, we would be lying to ourselves. That's why I went from an extreme Pentecostal to converting To Judaism, and my beliefs are ever changing. It's like that Holy spirit thing I thought I had until I questioned myself.
'' Does Hannibal have any gifts of the Holy spirit given on Pentecost?''
NO.
For that matter, I don't really know anyone who can walk up to a deaf, or blind, or lame person and then to lay hands on that person and actually expect a miracle, if such things were happening, it would only take 1 person out of millions to prove it, don't you think?
I mean, If I had the gifts of the Holy spirit, you wouldn't be where you are today would you? I have something, but it is not from the Pentecost where the first rain fell on those first disciples.
Have you ever considered that while you were a Christian, that maybe you weren't ever really in the religion of Jesus?
Did you keep his feasts or did you keep Pagan feasts?
Well, the thing is I do believe in God. I just don't believe Jesus Christ is divine. I believe he was just an apocalyptic rabbi who got crucified. That's all the secular record indicates, what little we have dating circa 120- 150 CE.
It's not about belief in God alone. Eternal life is belief in God and His Son whom He sent. If you do not believe Jesus is divine, you do not believe in Him - since that's what He stated. If you do not believe in His death for sins and physical resurrection, which is THE reason He came to earth, then you do not believe in Him.
Those are not my terms.
The dividing line is that simple. Judge for yourself if you are (or were) in the faith. It's between you and God... and He sees your heart.
Apparently my bio has not surfaced as far as I thought.
I was a Bible-believing Christian and anyone who reads my earliest threads from 2009-2012 will see that is a true statement. Around 2012 I started wondering about some of the claims the agnostics were posting so I researched them. I was shocked to find over a period of three years that nearly everything they said about no secular historical record for Jesus was actually true. I started to ask myself, "How could God, who I'm sure wants people to believe in Jesus, not arrange to leave behind a record of Jesus so reliable, so indisputable, so ironclad that no skeptic could raise the slightest objection to it? And when I couldn't answer that question, I had to be truthful with myself and walk away.
When fundies say you weren't truly Christian if you walked away, they are really saying, you were not indoctrinated enough. Report back to your Borg station.
It's not about belief in God alone. Eternal life is belief in God and His Son whom He sent. If you do not believe Jesus is divine, you do not believe in Him - since that's what He stated. If you do not believe in His death for sins and physical resurrection, which is THE reason He came to earth, then you do not believe in Him.
Those are not my terms.
The dividing line is that simple. Judge for yourself if you are (or were) in the faith. It's between you and God... and He sees your heart.
If I die still not believing Jesus was divine will I go to hell?
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