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"Woe to the Inhabitants of the Earth and of the Sea For the Devil is Come Down Unto You, Having Great Wrath Because He Knoweth that he Hath But a Short Time!" -Revelations 12:12
"What sorrow awaits the world, because it tempts people to sin. Temptations are inevitable, but what sorrow awaits the person who does the tempting.
One of my favorites.
And the disciples of John and of the Pharisees used to fast: and they come and say unto him, Why do the disciples of John and of the Pharisees fast, but thy disciples fast not?
we have to love them , we have to pray for them !! we don't have to falsely unite with that kind of error or follow them to their destruction in what they are about to do to Our Father God and his son . either do we have to do that with the false churches who errors are in the same way !!
when he take the sticks to unite them , you will know it !! but don't do it in the flesh or in their temple because it won't end well!
I doubt they were all corrupted Jews. Keep in mind that they had to work within the limits put down by the Romans thus not causing any friction. The High Priest chosen by them probably had to have the blessings of the Roman leaders to be made the High Priest. The Sadducees and Pharisees both had full understanding of what the Tanakh stated. They both had the 613 commandments to enforce. The difference is one group followed what was written in the Tanakh and the other group followed the Talmud (oral law) as it related to the Tanakh. The Talmud expands in further expanded detail of what the Tanakh states. Thus the Talmud of today already has discussed the meanings written in the Tanakh. We, as Jews, don't have to attempt to figure out what the Tanakh means. We instead learn how they came to their conclusions by arguing the premise to see where it leads to. Thus leading to the laws and traditions we follow today. Keep in mind that in today's terminology they were both Orthodox.
I don't usually quote NT, but:
Matthew 5:17-20
17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.
Keep in mind that between the death of JC and the start of the writing (or compilation) of the NT, there is a 60 year hole. Thus what was written, may not be exactly what happened. The NT states he was known by the courts already (which may be years) before being brought up to them. According to the descriptions in the NT, he would have been seen as Reform in the Orthodox realm. Thus in numerous ways making him a Heretic. Which leads one to question, why did he get convicted yet his inner circle of 12 were set free?
JC as you put it was convicted with false testimony. Even the witnesses themselves contradicted one another in their charges against JC. And he didn't even defend himself by speaking out.
It would be like saying the Law and the Prophets contradicted one another.
Then the whole assembly rose and led him off to Pilate. 2And they began to accuse him, saying, “We have found this man subverting our nation. He opposes payment of taxes to Caesar and claims to be Messiah, a king.”
3So Pilate asked Jesus, “Are you the king of the Jews?”
“You have said so,” Jesus replied.
4Then Pilate announced to the chief priests and the crowd, “I find no basis for a charge against this man.”
5But they insisted, “He stirs up the people all over Judea by his teaching. He started in Galilee and has come all the way here.”
6On hearing this, Pilate asked if the man was a Galilean. 7When he learned that Jesus was under Herod’s jurisdiction, he sent him to Herod, who was also in Jerusalem at that time.
8When Herod saw Jesus, he was greatly pleased, because for a long time he had been wanting to see him. From what he had heard about him, he hoped to see him perform a sign of some sort. 9He plied him with many questions, but Jesus gave him no answer. 10The chief priests and the teachers of the law were standing there, vehemently accusing him. 11Then Herod and his soldiers ridiculed and mocked him. Dressing him in an elegant robe, they sent him back to Pilate. 12That day Herod and Pilate became friends—before this they had been enemies.
13Pilate called together the chief priests, the rulers and the people, 14and said to them, “You brought me this man as one who was inciting the people to rebellion. I have examined him in your presence and have found no basis for your charges against him. 15Neither has Herod, for he sent him back to us; as you can see, he has done nothing to deserve death. 16Therefore, I will punish him and then release him.” [17]a
18But the whole crowd shouted, “Away with this man! Release Barabbas to us!” 19(Barabbas had been thrown into prison for an insurrection in the city, and for murder.)
20Wanting to release Jesus, Pilate appealed to them again. 21But they kept shouting, “Crucify him! Crucify him!”
22For the third time he spoke to them: “Why? What crime has this man committed? I have found in him no grounds for the death penalty. Therefore I will have him punished and then release him.”
23But with loud shouts they insistently demanded that he be crucified, and their shouts prevailed. 24So Pilate decided to grant their demand. 25He released the man who had been thrown into prison for insurrection and murder, the one they asked for, and surrendered Jesus to their will.
The Crucifixion of Jesus
26As the soldiers led him away, they seized Simon from Cyrene, who was on his way in from the country, and put the cross on him and made him carry it behind Jesus. 27A large number of people followed him, including women who mourned and wailed for him. 28Jesus turned and said to them, “Daughters of Jerusalem, do not weep for me; weep for yourselves and for your children. 29For the time will come when you will say, ‘Blessed are the childless women, the wombs that never bore and the breasts that never nursed!’ 30Then
“ ‘they will say to the mountains, “Fall on us!”
and to the hills, “Cover us!” ’b
31For if people do these things when the tree is green, what will happen when it is dry?”
32Two other men, both criminals, were also led out with him to be executed. 33When they came to the place called the Skull, they crucified him there, along with the criminals—one on his right, the other on his left. 34Jesus said, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.”c And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.
35The people stood watching, and the rulers even sneered at him. They said, “He saved others; let him save himself if he is God’s Messiah, the Chosen One.”
36The soldiers also came up and mocked him. They offered him wine vinegar 37and said, “If you are the king of the Jews, save yourself.”
38There was a written notice above him, which read: THIS IS THE KING OF THE JEWS.
39One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”
40But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”
42Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom
JC as you put it was convicted with false testimony. Even the witnesses themselves contradicted one another in their charges against JC. And he didn't even defend himself by speaking out.
It would be like saying the Law and the Prophets contradicted one another.
In the case of the the Talmud (Oral Law), they do have sages contradicting each other.
JC as you put it was convicted with false testimony. Even the witnesses themselves contradicted one another in their charges against JC. And he didn't even defend himself by speaking out.
....
But that doesn't address why his 12 followers weren't arrested also.
Depends on what's considered a mistake. One of the discrepancies I noticed in Rashis commentary may have been something I can only describe as placement accordance .
That's just an example though. Most problems I find are transliteration and translation, and not to mention current cultural misunderstandings in the definition of a single word. Of course language arts is not even close to anything ive ever worked at.
And I admit my writting is probably not up to par.
Guess that's why I focused mostly with art,illustration as a medium.
That was very kind.
Thankyou for the link.
You are a blessing.
(1)Why would they be arrested.? You know better.
That would have undone the whole council right there.
Probably why the disciples were hunted later.
(2)Oh and something to note maybe.
Why were JC feet anointed?
(1) As I'm not a Christian, I wouldn't actually know better. Me reading the NT is not the same as studying it. My early education (as soon as I could understand the spoken word) was Orthodox Judaism with a designated path of being a Rabbi. I left my sect (Hassidic) during my mid teens to gain a real world education (I'm an Engineer).
Knowing past law and current secular law, JCs group of 12 should've been arrested due to their association. They were apostles and not simply followers or students. Thus prosecution by association. As numerous parts of the NT were written centuries later, then there is room to assume that changes were made so the NT made sense (even though there are still many conflicts from one set of books to another). With 60 missing years who's to say that the 12 didn't turn on JC, to save their own lives which is why JC was quiet in defending himself and Judas committing suicide due to the guilt he felt for doing so?
(1) As I'm not a Christian, I wouldn't actually know better. Me reading the NT is not the same as studying it. My early education (as soon as I could understand the spoken word) was Orthodox Judaism with a designated path of being a Rabbi. I left my sect (Hassidic) during my mid teens to gain a real world education (I'm an Engineer).
Knowing past law and current secular law, JCs group of 12 should've been arrested due to their association. They were apostles and not simply followers or students. Thus prosecution by association. As numerous parts of the NT were written centuries later, then there is room to assume that changes were made so the NT made sense (even though there are still many conflicts from one set of books to another). With 60 missing years who's to say that the 12 didn't turn on JC, to save their own lives which is why JC was quiet in defending himself and Judas committing suicide due to the guilt he felt for doing so?
(2) Feet stinked then as they do now?
It is simply an assertion to say that the books were written 60 (or more) later.
The nature of history is that the time of written cannot be confirmed, especially under the circumstance that no one is keeping the original scrolls.
Moreover, you don't read the Bible do you? All Jesus' disciples chose to fleet at first, even Peter chose to deny. Perhaps only John witnessed the execution. The execution was done within a day after the arrest. No one was pointing figure to Jesus and His group of followers except for Judas, while he regretted write after Jesus' death. You don't even read Jewish laws, do you? You need at least 2 witnesses in order to accuse someone permitting a crime. Even today's prosecution system will choose to abort in the lack of valid evidence and the lack of valid witnesses.
Jesus was executed because Sanhedrin managed to find enough 'witnesses' to do false witnessing against Jesus. As long as Jesus was executed, no one would like to further arrest anyone as it is said the even Pilate didn't want the death of Jesus. The portrayed situation is that prosecution itself is not legitimate or else the execution won't be in such a short time. Today's prosecution system never put anyone to death right after the arrest, or does it? To simply put, the Jews in charge only wanted Jesus' death, then case closed!
Last edited by Hawkins; 04-06-2017 at 09:00 AM..
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