Christianity and science

[omega2xx]

Originally Posted by pcamps

“Ask the animals, and they will teach you, or the birds of the air, and they will tell you; or speak to the earth, and it will teach you, or let the fish of the seainform you. Which of these does not know that the hand of the Lord has done this? In his hand is the life of every creature and the breath of all mankind.” (Job 12:7-10)

Again you don't understand the verse you quote. The things mentioned in those verse does not say God is in everything. I gave you some verses that said God was not in them. Why do you ignore them.

“The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands. Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they display knowledge. There is no speech or language where their voice is not heard. Their voice goes out into all the earth, their words to the ends of the world. Psalm 19:1-4

Those verse dond't say or even imply God is in them.

Typical fundamentalist. He is in the fire and brimstone that consume folk but he is not in the wind and earthquake.. What about the earthquake that shook the foundations of the prison that Paul and Silas were in ?.

Typical cafeteria Christian. I only take what taste good to me.

We look for God(his voice) first in the inside(Something fundamentalists don't get, the kingdom is within)not in the earthquake and winds, although he is in them?. You know like speaking from a burning bush. Evil is the illusion you accept when you are looking at anything other than God. God cannot look upon evil, therefore in God's eyes it does not exist, even though it appears to. If you cannot seek God in the mountains, the sea, the clouds the sun, the wind, the rain, the birds, the animals etc, you are walking around with your eyes closed.

Typical statement of someone ignorant of Christian fundamentalism.

Know the scriptures better and in context, it will benefit you no end.

Stop making up your own, non-Biblical context, it will benefit you to no end.

[omega2xx]

Originally Posted by pcamps

So what do you do with the contradictory scriptures that state God cannot look upon sin. You do know you have to be careful what you look at don't you ?.

Answered.

Why do you think the Psalmist said i see the Lord before me i shall not be moved......

Because when we see(spiritually) the Lord, we are not move from putting mour trust in Him.

What do you think Joshua and Caleb saw in the promised lands themselves as grasshoppers at the size of its inhabitants or them like grasshoppers in the sight of God who was with them. Why do you think throughout the whole of the scriptures we are admonished to look to God?, Exactly because what we behold we become like.

Again, you do not understand the Scriptures you quote. Looking TO God does not imply we sill become like Him We look TO God for assurance of spiritual truth---Jesus loves me this I know, for the Bible tells me so---This things I have written that you may KNOW, you have eternal life.

Answer me this too if evil is real, who created it and provide the scriptures where it tells you it was created. I can provide 1 for you, but you won't like it.

First of all I am not the one who said evil was created.

I probably wont like you answer because it wont be Scriptural. Tell me what you think and I will comment on it.

[omega2xx]

Originally Posted by Wardendresden

Quite interesting. So you wouldn't be harmed if your entire family were wiped out and you were beset by boils? Calamity is not evil--it is just?

Of coursed I would be harmed. What's your point? Calamity is bad, but it is not evil. A tornado is bad and it is a calamity, but it is not levil.

Job argued with God over what befell him. His friends urged him to repent. Although God set Job straight about his argument, he also said those 'friends' had failed Job.

Right. They were admonished and Job was justified.

Jews know one heck of a lot more about the Tanakh than Christians.

What makes you think so? The only way Jews and Christians now anything abut the Bible is through serious study and prayer. Christians are just as capable as Jews are to do that.

And that rabbi did NOT misquote Isaiah 45:7. You depend on the Masoretic text which is flawed and on mistranslations into English. Here is Young's Literal Translation:

I depend on the experts in Hebrew not the Masoretic text. Thosse who traqnslate Bibles ino English do not use the Masoretic text. They use the OT mss available. If the Masoreti text is flawed, who cares? Not me. First of all the word can be translated "evil" or "calamity." Sdo we need to determine the source of evil. What God created was very good. Evil came into existence when Adam sinned.

Now if you aren't into literal translations, you aren't into the Bible.
Amos 3:6 has a lot of misinterpretations, too--using "calamity" inappropriately or at least without it giving a clear understanding of where it came from:
Young's literal translation, Amos 3:6<<


If a word has more than one meaning, either one can be literal and then common sense must take over. GOD DID NOT CREAT EVIL.

If you believe what some man says over what God say, you are the one who has been duped. Satan killing Jobe's children for not reason was evil, it was not a trick. An adversary is not a trickster, it is one opposed to something. Satan is opposed to God.

Lets look at some of his comments and see if they are Biblical.





As for me, I never blame God NOR Satan for my shortcomings and sin. It's all me. All my choice. Without a trickster, no choice I ever made would be mine alone. I be like you, mindlessly reading the Bible and grasping at untested theology spouted from the pulpit instead of wrestling with God as Job did. "Calamity" is a test of one's character.

"If Satan has no power except that given by God, we are left wondering whether evil can come from God, a proposition which the early biblical writers and ancient Church Fathers like Augustine raised. We heard the prophet Amos asking “If there is evil in a city, has Yahweh not done it?” (Amos 3:6)."

Satan is an angel, a cherub. All angels have power, but power can be used for good or for evil. What Satan did to job was evil.

"God’s portrayal as a character of absolute goodness is the result of a theology that is read into the Christian Scriptures,""

That is one of the dumbest statement one can make. God's goodness is not read into the Scripture, it is specifically stated throughout the Bible.

Psa 31:19 - How great is Your goodness...
Ps3"6 - Surly goodness and lovingkindness will follow me all the days of my life.

yet which is not necessarily supported by a close reading of the texts. Not only is this theology challenged by the Bible, it is also challenged by existentially and morally comparing such a theology of absolute Good versus absolute Evil with the realities of life. All have faced, or will face, tragedy, misery, illness, and death.

This theology is not challenged in the Bible, it is is challenged by evil men or maybe just ignorant men.

Events will occur that appear unfair, leading most of us to question if any sense of cosmic justice and mercy truly exists. Natural disasters will claim thousands of lives,

Natural disasters were caused by Adam's sin, not by God. They are calamities, they are not evil.

[omega2xx]

Originally Posted by Freak80

Debates like this amuse me.

Why didn’t the Christian God write a Holy Book that was less subject to interpretation? There would be a lot less conflict within Christianity if the Christian God were a better communicator.

All knowledge worthwhile requires study and in the case of the Bible, it needs prayer.

How much study have you done to try and find the truth?