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Old 04-26-2021, 05:08 AM
 
1,091 posts, read 277,660 times
Reputation: 95

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
You are trying to reason with an unreasoning man. You would have better luck with a brick wall.
To be fair, I know exactly what he's advocating for. That was obvious straightway: Armininism, pure and simple.

Think about what is being put forth in his arguments:
1. The soul can resist God's grace (drawing to Christ) but not God's condemnation.
2. God's grace has no power over man's soul, however His condemnation does.
3. God's will is ineffectual in bringing to Christ, but effectual in sending to hell.
4. God's will has power for hell, but not for Heaven.
5. The Judge has power to incarcerate but not set free.
6. Hell triumphs over heaven.
7. Evil triumphs over goodness, etc.

They're really the doctrines of the Remonstrants in response to Calvin's doctrine on irresistible grace. It hurts my heart to read these things and to even reason over them, and I'm not a Calvinist. So, I'm not going to.

Last edited by jjGuru; 04-26-2021 at 05:34 AM..

 
Old 04-26-2021, 05:35 AM
 
Location: the Kingdom of His dear Son
7,530 posts, read 3,019,505 times
Reputation: 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjGuru View Post
To be fair, I know exactly what he's advocating for. That was obvious straightway: Armininism, pure and simple.

Think about what is being put forth in his arguments:
1. The soul can resist God's grace (drawing to Christ) but not God's condemnation.
2. God's grace has no power over man's soul, however His condemnation does.
3. God's will is ineffectual in bringing to Christ, but effectual in sending to hell.
4. God's will has power for hell, but not for Heaven.
5. The Judge has power to incarcerate but not set free.
6. Hell triumphs over heaven.
7. Evil triumphs over goodness, etc.

They're really the doctrines of the Remonstrants in response to Calvin. It hurts my heart to read these things and to even reason over them, and I'm not a Calvinist. So, I'm not going to.


"How could the Bible possibly speak of the perfect victory of God our Creator who loves righteousness and cannot bear evil, if that victory really means that He cannot bring His own creatures at last to hate evil as He hates it, but must confirm multitudes, indeed the majority of them, in their choice of evil for ever and ever?

What sort of victory is it to be able only to subdue evil and prevent it harming any but those who choose it, and to be unable to bring human souls to abominate it and desire to forsake it, so that the evil itself ceases to exist?" -Hannah Hurnard

polus made sinners>>>>>>>polus made righteous
 
Old 04-26-2021, 11:49 AM
 
Location: the Kingdom of His dear Son
7,530 posts, read 3,019,505 times
Reputation: 275
The Triumph of God's Love, what does all this mean?

If God has determined to stand with us, tell me, who then could ever stand against us? For God has proved his love by giving us his greatest treasure, the gift of his Son. And since God freely offered him up as the sacrifice for us all, he certainly won't withhold from us anything else he has to give.

Who then would dare to accuse those whom God has chosen in love to be his? God himself is the judge who has issued his final verdict over them "Not guilty!"

Who then is left to condemn us?

Certainly not Jesus, the Anointed One! For he gave his life for us, and even more than that, he has conquered death and is now risen, exalted, and enthroned by God at his right hand. So how could he possibly condemn us since he is continually praying for our triumph?

Who could ever divorce us from the endless love of God's Anointed One?

Absolutely no one! For nothing in the universe has the power to diminish his love toward us.

Troubles, pressures, and problems are unable to come between us and heaven's love. So now I live with the confidence that there is nothing in the universe with the power to separate us from God's love. I'm convinced that his love will triumph over death, life's troubles, fallen angels, or dark rulers in the heavens. There is nothing in our present or future circumstances that can weaken his love.

There is no power above us or beneath us, no power that could ever be found in the universe that can distance us from God's passionate love, which is lavished upon us through our Lord Jesus, the Anointed One! (TPT)
 
Old 04-26-2021, 02:10 PM
 
553 posts, read 171,975 times
Reputation: 139
One of the best sixty minutes you'll ever spend regarding this subject:


https://www.davidartman.net/podcast/...on-and-aionios
 
Old 04-26-2021, 02:57 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
11,895 posts, read 3,683,545 times
Reputation: 1130
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjGuru View Post
To be fair, I know exactly what he's advocating for. That was obvious straightway: Armininism, pure and simple.

Think about what is being put forth in his arguments:
1. The soul can resist God's grace (drawing to Christ) but not God's condemnation.
2. God's grace has no power over man's soul, however His condemnation does.
3. God's will is ineffectual in bringing to Christ, but effectual in sending to hell.
4. God's will has power for hell, but not for Heaven.
5. The Judge has power to incarcerate but not set free.
6. Hell triumphs over heaven.
7. Evil triumphs over goodness, etc.

They're really the doctrines of the Remonstrants in response to Calvin's doctrine on irresistible grace. It hurts my heart to read these things and to even reason over them, and I'm not a Calvinist. So, I'm not going to.
Me too,

To me these things relate to just measures and weights mentioned in Scripture

The more out of balance one thing is, there is a equal counterbalance that needs to happen to bring it back into balance, and there is a lot of imbalance in a lot of areas that has happened, and that will need to be addressed
 
Old 04-26-2021, 06:03 PM
 
8,039 posts, read 1,835,979 times
Reputation: 143
Yes, grace can be resisted, as the Holy Ghost can be resisted (Acts 7:51).
 
Old 04-26-2021, 06:51 PM
 
8,039 posts, read 1,835,979 times
Reputation: 143
People are given the opportunity to repent of walking in the direction of sin within their lifetimes; and to avail themselves of what Jesus did for them on the Cross.

Once they reach their judgments, they will have made solid their commitment to walk in whatever direction they are walking in.

I think it is only right that those who are walking in the direction of sin should all go to the same place.

They certainly shouldn't be in the same place with those who are walking in the direction of righteousness...heaven. Because if they were allowed there, heaven really wouldn't be heavenly. Sin would be there...and so would death, crying, sorrow, and pain (see Revelation 21:4).

So, God will relegate all the sinners to be together in eternity.

Even without the fire, that is a pretty bad punishment.

I think God puts the fire there as a deterrent. Being in eternity with other sinners doesn't seem like a bad thing to some. But you have to consider that among those sinners are murderers and thieves.

I believe that all of creation cries out for the punishment of such atrocities as were committed by Hitler.

The thing is, most unbelievers are little Hitlers without the opportunities.

The Bible says, "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperatelt wicked; who can know it?" (Jeremiah 17:9).

All creation also cries out for the separation of that which is good from that which is evil.

God gives men ample opportunity to repent of sin so that they can be included in that which is good.

However, His Spirit will not strive with man for ever (Genesis 6:3).
 
Old 04-26-2021, 06:56 PM
 
4,483 posts, read 1,317,873 times
Reputation: 126
Quote:
Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
People are given the opportunity to repent of walking in the direction of sin within their lifetimes; and to avail themselves of what Jesus did for them on the Cross.

Once they reach their judgments, they will have made solid their commitment to walk in whatever direction they are walking in.

I think it is only right that those who are walking in the direction of sin should all go to the same place.

They certainly shouldn't be in the same place with those who are walking in the direction of righteousness...heaven. Because if they were allowed there, heaven really wouldn't be heavenly. Sin would be there...and so would death, crying, sorrow, and pain (see Revelation 21:4).

So, God will relegate all the sinners to be together in eternity.

Even without the fire, that is a pretty bad punishment.

I think God puts the fire there as a deterrent. Being in eternity with other sinners doesn't seem like a bad thing to some. But you have to consider that among those sinners are murderers and thieves.

I believe that all of creation cries out for the punishment of such atrocities as were committed by Hitler.

The thing is, most unbelievers are little Hitlers without the opportunities.

The Bible says, "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperatelt wicked; who can know it?" (Jeremiah 17:9).

All creation also cries out for the separation of that which is good from that which is evil.

God gives men ample opportunity to repent of sin so that they can be included in that which is good.

However, His Spirit will not strive with man for ever (Genesis 6:3).
Amen Brother! Well said!
 
Old 04-26-2021, 06:57 PM
 
Location: Arizona
28,956 posts, read 16,344,506 times
Reputation: 2296
Quote:
Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
Yes, grace can be resisted, as the Holy Ghost can be resisted (Acts 7:51).
Then, you have successfully resisted both with your damnation theologies of eternal punishment.
 
Old 04-26-2021, 07:53 PM
 
Location: the Kingdom of His dear Son
7,530 posts, read 3,019,505 times
Reputation: 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjGuru View Post
To be fair, I know exactly what he's advocating for. That was obvious straightway: Armininism, pure and simple.

Think about what is being put forth in his arguments:
1. The soul can resist God's grace (drawing to Christ) but not God's condemnation.
2. God's grace has no power over man's soul, however His condemnation does.
3. God's will is ineffectual in bringing to Christ, but effectual in sending to hell.
4. God's will has power for hell, but not for Heaven.
5. The Judge has power to incarcerate but not set free.
6. Hell triumphs over heaven.
7. Evil triumphs over goodness, etc.

They're really the doctrines of the Remonstrants in response to Calvin's doctrine on irresistible grace. It hurts my heart to read these things and to even reason over them, and I'm not a Calvinist. So, I'm not going to.
The Lord Jesus Christ is Not potential Saviour!

https://forum.evangelicaluniversalis...17dce2ae5.jpeg

He will save you!

Are our broadest hopes broad enough? Shall there be a nook or abyss, in all the universe of God, finally unlightened by the Cross? Shall there be a sin, or sorrow, or pain unhealed? Is the very universe, is creation in all its extent, a field wide enough for the Son of God?
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