God alone can? (belief, scripture, Moses, pray)

[Jerwade]

Originally Posted by justbyfaith

My mother read fables to me as a child; among my favorites, The tortoise and the hare.

You also endorse those from Roman, Greek and Egyptian mythologies that have nothing to do with reality, either.

[justbyfaith]

Originally Posted by Jerwade

You also endorse those from Roman, Greek and Egyptian mythologies that have nothing to do with reality, either.

I endorse nothing but the Bible.

Surely you are not saying that there are fables found written therein?

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by justbyfaith

He said that "the time will come" (2 Timothy 4:3).

Yeah, he did. So why did you jump to the conclusion that he was referring to the latter days, particularly when he spoke on this subject often and said nothing about the latter days? The process was not yet complete in his day, but it definitely had started.

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by justbyfaith

My mother read fables to me as a child; among my favorites, The tortoise and the hare.

I use Aesop's fables all the time as part of the jail ministry I'm part of. They're very useful in getting across very simple truths.

[justbyfaith]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

I use Aesop's fables all the time as part of the jail ministry I'm part of. They're very useful in getting across very simple truths.

I find that the virtue of diligence is exemplified in the fable that I mentioned; which has helped me greatly in my Christian walk.

Nevertheless, it should be clear that those who turn their ears away from the truth will be turned aside unto fables.

Which is not to say that they are not useful in proclaiming scriptural truths.

I think that the people who are turned aside to them, turn to them to the exclusion of the doctrines of holy scripture.

[justbyfaith]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Yeah, he did. So why did you jump to the conclusion that he was referring to the latter days, particularly when he spoke on this subject often and said nothing about the latter days? The process was not yet complete in his day, but it definitely had started.

The only point that I will make is that it was yet in the future when Paul wrote that scripture.

I certainly cannot exclude the idea that it may have been in Timothy's immediate future.

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by justbyfaith

The only point that I will make is that it was yet in the future when Paul wrote that scripture.

I certainly cannot exclude the idea that it may have been in Timothy's immediate future.

Fair enough. But there were 2000 years of "future" he might well have been referring to. If you want to talk about his many warnings, I'd be happy to engage in such a conversation with you.

[justbyfaith]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Fair enough. But there were 2000 years of "future" he might well have been referring to. If you want to talk about his many warnings, I'd be happy to engage in such a conversation with you.

I agree.

And, if you want to discuss the warnings of Paul, I suppose that I am all ears; as long as you stick to the Bible.

[Meerkat2]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Fair enough. But there were 2000 years of "future" he might well have been referring to. If you want to talk about his many warnings, I'd be happy to engage in such a conversation with you.

I would like to see that being tackled, timing is one of the things I am particularly drawn to -

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by justbyfaith

And, if you want to discuss the warnings of Paul, I suppose that I am all ears; as long as you stick to the Bible.

Here you are... straight out of the Bible (KVJ):

Even in Old Testament times, God's prophets warned that the time would come when the word of the Lord would not be found anywhere in the world.

In Amos 8:11-12, we are told, "Behold, the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the Lord; And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the Lord, and shall not find it."

Throughout the New Testament, the Apostles also warned that this was to happen. Paul seemed particularly concerned about the infant Church and frequently voiced his concerns to the early Christians. Among his statements to Christ's followers, are these:

Acts 20:29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition…

Galatians 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel…

2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears…

Paul made it absolutely clear that (1)the flock would not only be attacked, it would not be spared, (2) Christ would not return to the earth until this universal "falling away" or "apostasy" had taken place, (3) these things were already beginning to take place as he spoke, and (4) the doctrines taught by the Savior would, in time, cease to endure.

There is no mention of the "latter days" in any of these warnings. Paul saw it happening himself. And since you are not a Roman Catholic, you obviously must believe on some level that he was right.