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And punishment by death for apostasy from Islam is firmly rooted in the most holy Muslim texts—both the Koran, and the hadith—as well as the sacred Islamic Law (the Shari’a). Koran 4:89 states*:
They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah's way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.
Quote:
One of the most authoritative Koranic commentators, Baydawi (d. 1315/16) interprets this passage thus: “Whosoever turns back from belief (irtada), openly or secretly, take him and kill him wheresoever ye find him, like any other infidel. Separate yourself from him altogether. Do not accept intercession in his regard" (cited in Zwemer, The Law of Apostasy in Islam, 1924, pp. 33-34).
Is this the mainstream interpretation of those texts? I'm not supporting it one way or the other.. but a person who had never been introduced to Christianity and picked up the bible.. they might think some things too as there is some weird stuff in there. Is it an interpretation issue?
Can I get a muslim in da house?
lol...good luck with that. Islam sanctions lying so you'd never get a truthful answer if it does not foster growth in Islam. Basically, lying is completely condoned if it benefits Islam.
lol...good luck with that. Islam sanctions lying so you'd never get a truthful answer if it does not foster growth in Islam. Basically, lying is completely condoned if it benefits Islam.
Correct . . . makes you wonder why it would be necessary if Allah really was God, eh? Islam plagiarized all the principles of Jesus and then Mohammad corrupted them with their political ambitions and conquests. A shame, really.
Correct . . . makes you wonder why it would be necessary if Allah really was God, eh? Islam plagiarized all the principles of Jesus and then Mohammad corrupted them with their political ambitions and conquests. A shame, really.
Nail on the head right there--Islam is a political ideology--Islamofascism is a very relevant term.
lol...good luck with that. Islam sanctions lying so you'd never get a truthful answer if it does not foster growth in Islam. Basically, lying is completely condoned if it benefits Islam.
you say this based on you deep understanding of Islam no doubt from an accredited University?
Oh.. let me guess.. you went to a crazy website that said crazy things and you believe them all right?
Correct . . . makes you wonder why it would be necessary if Allah really was God, eh? Islam plagiarized all the principles of Jesus and then Mohammad corrupted them with their political ambitions and conquests. A shame, really.
so we are just going to move away from the premise of my position?
why can't we just answer the question.. why is it so hard to admit that saying "a group of people murdering others who convert" is not at its core a reason to discredit anybody's God?
Why is that so hard?
Oh.. yeah.. cause that means Christianity would be wrong.. (See the crusades).
seriously.. its much easier just admit the logic being wrong. believe Allah or any other God is not real for some other reason but your logic fails miserably.. over and over and over and over again.
I say this because in the end.. as a Christian.. you make me look bad because of that statement..
I don't get to choose about the first one . . . we all physically die. I only get to choose about the second and I choose eternal life. Those who would kill to take my physical life seek to deprive me of ANY choice . . . but it would not succeed . . . because I would prefer that they take my physical life early while I retain my eternal life. So, big thirsty . . . you are not right. They are NOT the same thing . . . because I CHOOSE . . . not the killer. You seem to have problem with clarity in distinguishing among comparatives.
Last edited by MysticPhD; 03-17-2009 at 10:07 PM..
so we are just going to move away from the premise of my position?
why can't we just answer the question.. why is it so hard to admit that saying "a group of people murdering others who convert" is not at its core a reason to discredit anybody's God?
Why is that so hard?
Oh.. yeah.. cause that means Christianity would be wrong.. (See the crusades).
seriously.. its much easier just admit the logic being wrong. believe Allah or any other God is not real for some other reason but your logic fails miserably.. over and over and over and over again.
I say this because in the end.. as a Christian.. you make me look bad because of that statement..
You lack any discernment at all about the issue. The RELIGION (supposedly words direct from ALLAH) demands death for apostasy and rejection of ALLAH. I repeat . . . what kind of GOD would require people ( who He gives free will) to be forced into accepting Him or DEMAND that they be killed? The Christian God I believe in DEMANDS nothing . . . doesn't punish, and has provided His children with His presence as a teacher, example, instructions and guidelines that will lead us to a successful spiritual rebirth and eternal life. WE retain our free will to choose up to the end of our physical life. What happens after that is a natural consequence of our success or failure . . . no Godly decision or punishment involved. I am sorry so many of my brothers and sisters in Christ are misguided about God's motives. God only wants to help us succeed . . . not punish . . . it is OUR choice.
you say this based on you deep understanding of Islam no doubt from an accredited University?
Oh.. let me guess.. you went to a crazy website that said crazy things and you believe them all right?
Yep.. $100 says I'm right.
You apparently do not have a mind of discernment (and I don't mean that as an attack, just an observation). I could give you any source and you would choose to discredit it. Did you actually read the articles? There are plenty of Quranic verses and Islamic authorities quoted in them. I would direct you to the Quran to study for yourself, but since you are not grounded in the Word, that could be very dangerous. There are plenty of sources you can study to provide you with the understanding that Islam is a treacherous lie from Satan himself. You just have to remove the scales from your eyes to see for yourself.
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