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YIKES I disagree.. read the whole thing:
Lev. 20 has all sorts of things you must be put to death for.
If you think that God is against homosexuality then you must also believe that God is against eating rabbit, pork, and not only that but if you have sex with a woman on her period then you both are cut off from your people... also adultery should result in death.. I mean these are instructions for a primitive culture.. I don't think we can apply any of these things to modern times and even though I disagree with this lifestyle.. I also disagree with an actor's lifestyle as that is not for me...
So we see that if you notice that sleeping with your sister is lumped together with sleeping with animals...
Oh and BTW AIDS is thought to originate from the eating of monkey brains and is spread by sexual intercourse and BIRTH therefore not ONLY homosexuals are susceptible to getting the virus.
Monkey Brains????...were in the world did you get your information?...that is so ludicrous...Do your research first before making a statement like that...If that were the case then China would be dieing and not be so populated because that is where that delicacey exists...HIV came from the monkeys in africa that carried the disease but did not suffer from it...it was traced back to an african road worker that was bitten by this type of monkey and in the States it was spread due to a Canadian airlines steward...
The Word of God never changes but the way He handles mankind does.
Why does he have to do this? Man is smarter than him? He 'changes' because of man?
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The Dietary aspects were done away with by Christ but the Sexual aspects are still in effect even today.
Can you show me a biblical verse or verses where this distinction and change was made? Show me where god had a problem with foods people ate in, say, 3,000 BCE and then where he decided he had n problem with the same [unclean] foods, say, around 2,000 CE? What was the difference with the unclean foods in Moses' time to Jesus' time? How did Jesus' death make the foods magically 'clean' but kept the sexual sins wrong?
By what authority do you claim that your hermeneutical principles are the right ones?
Pleroo, if you really want to play the infinite regress game, feel free, but this is what you'll basically end up with:
How do you know that X is true?
Because of Y.
How do you know that Y is true?
Because of Z.
And how do you know that Z is true?
Because of A.
And on and on and on.
And I could do the same with you.
Before you expend all that effort, though, you should realize up front that you're not going to prove anything about me that is also not true of everyone else. Everyone--and I mean everyone--has a starting point of some kind. For some, it's empiricism. For others, it's the Bible. For yet others, it might be something else. It's called the starting point for a reason: It is their ultimate authority. If they appeal to some other authority to prove it, then it is no longer their ultimate authority. You yourself have one.
Also, I notice that you persist in not addressing the points I have already brought up twice in spite of the fact that I have answered your points. That tells me that you don't really want to dialogue but just want to prove me wrong. So, alas, I am afraid I must bid you adieu, since you are doing what is so appallingly common on this board: talking past people.
To someone who hasn't spent 5 minutes to look up the information I suppose it does sound ludicrous.
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Originally Posted by Richard1965
Do your research first before making a statement like that....
Do you?
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Originally Posted by Richard1965
If that were the case then China would be dieing and not be so populated because that is where that delicacey exists..
If China were located in Africa then possibly. However, China is located in China.
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Originally Posted by Richard1965
HIV came from the monkeys in africa that carried the disease but did not suffer from it..
Chimpanzees and they didn't carry HIV. They carry SIV.
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Originally Posted by Richard1965
.it was traced back to an african road worker that was bitten by this type of monkey and in the States it was spread due to a Canadian airlines steward...
Why does he have to do this? Man is smarter than him? He 'changes' because of man?
He did not have to He chose to.
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Can you show me a biblical verse or verses where this distinction and change was made? Show me where god had a problem with foods people ate in, say, 3,000 BCE and then where he decided he had n problem with the same [unclean] foods, say, around 2,000 CE? What was the difference with the unclean foods in Moses' time to Jesus' time? How did Jesus' death make the foods magically 'clean' but kept the sexual sins wrong?
The Bible is clear throughout the OT on the foods and Jesus declared them clean in the NT. He was releasing them of legalism but he never released them for sexual sin. His death had nothing to do with it, His proclimation to Peter had everything to do with food as well as Gentiles. He gave Peter a vision of various unclean food and told him to eat, Peter refused three times and Christ said it is not what you eat that make you unclean but what you speak. There was no specifity allowing sexual sin but He did offer forgiveness without death like with the woman caught in adultry.
I don't need to share my opinion at all unless asked for it and maybe not even then. A simple, "Well, here's the Bible ... what do you think it says?" That allows someone to listen directly to God speaking to them without my voice/opinion muddying the waters. Holy Spirit is perfectly capable of convicting someone without my help. When we try to take on Holy Spirit's job, that's when we do harm, imho.
So god DOES change then? Man forces him to change???
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The Bible is clear throughout the OT on the foods and Jesus declared them clean in the NT.
And this is why I asked you to show me where god changed his mind on these things. Why did he change his mind? Follow the logic through and you might, you just might start to "see the light," Robin.
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He was releasing them of legalism but he never released them for sexual sin.
So why did god set up the legalism in the first place only to have to release them of it later on? Again, follow the line of questioning, Robin. I know it may scare you as to where it can lead.
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His death had nothing to do with it, His proclimation to Peter had everything to do with food as well as Gentiles. He gave Peter a vision of various unclean food and told him to eat, Peter refused three times and Christ said it is not what you eat that make you unclean but what you speak.
God did not know this BEFORE the time of Jesus/Peter? When did this light go off in his head to come up with this revelation?
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There was no specifity allowing sexual sin but He did offer forgiveness without death like with the woman caught in adultry.
While in the Old Testament the punishment was NOT forgiveness, but rather, stoning to death. Seems like god did a lot of changing.
Pleroo, you can play the infinite regress game forever:
It's not a game to me, Jremy. I'm sorry if it is to you.
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Before you expend all that effort, you should realize up front, that you're not going to accomplish anything. Everyone--and I mean everyone--has a starting point of some kind. For some, it's empiricism. For others, it's the Bible. For yet others, it might be something else. It's called the starting point for a reason: It is their ultimate authority. If they appeal to some other authority to prove it, then it is no longer their ultimate authority. You yourself have one.
That's pretty much been my point all along, Jremy. We all have one. And I appeal to the ability of God's Holy Spirit to convict people of their sin. I appeal to the Word to accomplish it's purpose.
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Also, I notice that you persist in not addressing the points I have already brought up twice in spite of the fact that I have answered your points. That tells me that you don't really want to dialogue but just want to prove me wrong.So, alas, I am afraid I must bid you adieu, since you are doing what is so appallingly common on this board: talking past people.
You could be right about me and my intent. Can you be sure that you are? Are you under the impression that language, in particular the written language, is completely unambiguous and therefore it is impossible for anyone to misunderstand the absolute truth, meaning and intent of what they read?
Originally Posted by Eusebius
The Bible was not meant to be scientific.
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So why should I pay attention to it on biological (scientific) matters and take it as an authority? Thanks for making this point for me.
You shouldn't take it on scientific matters because it was meant to be spiritual, not scientific.
It is an authority as to what is wrong with man and what the solution is.
It is an authority as to Who is in control and who is controlled.
Man never changes therefore the truths in the Scriptures are timeless and never go out of date.
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I read Alice in Wonderland and Through the Looking Glass in which the one character defines things they way he likes and not according to reality. That is your reality. I can't help you till you come out of the rabbit hole.
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Likewise, your opinions about this subject is YOUR reality and I too cannot help you with it until you come into the 21st century in relation to your views on this. Sorry.
It is not my reality but reality from God's reality. I am in the 21st Century and using timeless principles as my guide. Just because you think they don't apply to us does not mean they don't. That is just your opinion which proves absolutely nothing except that you are biased against straight people who operate within their God-given nature.
Had your mom and dad been gay you'd never have been born. I'm sure you'd have loved that.
Monkey Brains????...were in the world did you get your information?...that is so ludicrous...Do your research first before making a statement like that...If that were the case then China would be dieing and not be so populated because that is where that delicacey exists...HIV came from the monkeys in africa that carried the disease but did not suffer from it...it was traced back to an african road worker that was bitten by this type of monkey and in the States it was spread due to a Canadian airlines steward...
She is actually not as far off as you think? Your story, on the other hand...
I see Big Thirsty already posted some of the links I was going to post.
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