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I went on the site you added to your post. I wanted to give your view a chance at least. I read the passages outlined in the article; but they had no substance. On there own any passage can be taken out of context. You must read on, and you must read other parts of your bible to get a true understanding. Not to mention you must pray and request true meaning. Jesus will bring each person back from the dead. The bible makes it abundantly clear that all will bow and worship him. In several passages in both the old testament and the new the bible also makes it clear that he will separate the wheat from the chaff. What you do with what you make of the text is entirely your business; but I would stop and ask myself, "if God sacrificed His only son for the people of this world, what could I ever do to repay that debt". What would you allow someone to pay you before you sacrificed your only child? If the answer is nothing, which is my answer, and you can never "buy" this debt, then for any that accept it it is a gift. If God then gave the gift to the world of His only son, and you or anyone doesn't accept the gift of this sacrifice why would He accept them into His Kingdom. Another way I have found to look at is this way. God cannot look at sin. So there was always a sacrifice to cleanse people, through faith, so that God could see them. But these sacrifices were only symbols of the sacrifice to come. No one could live by the laws and the standards God, and He already knew that was going to be the case. So He offered the perfect bridge from this sin filled world to His perfect existence! Amen!
I disagree... I think sin blocks MAN's View of God.. not the other way around. Therefore the sacrifices were not for God but for man's conscience.... Remember in the OT God said he hated sacrifices and wanted them to love each other.
So if sin blocks MAN's view of God then what God sees is the heart of man... and it is the circumcision of man's heart that leads one to belief...
Deut 30:6 The Lord your God will circumcise your hearts and the hearts of your descendants, so that you may love him with all your heart and with all your soul, and live.
And God circumcises the heart so there is nothing man can do to earn salvation.. not even the choice to believe is up to man.
Of course there is a contradiction. How can one say that ALL PEOPLE will go to heaven, and at the same time say they need Christ to go to heaven? It is illogical.
Allow me to use an analogy. How can one say that people live, and at the same time say they need a heart to live? Is that illogical?
In other words, God already gave us a heart, but that doesn't mean we don't need the heart to live. God already gave us Jesus (and life through Him), but that doesn't mean we don't need Him.
Allow me to use an analogy. How can one say that people live, and at the same time say they need a heart to live? Is that illogical?
In other words, God already gave us a heart, but that doesn't mean we don't need the heart to live. God already gave us Jesus (and life through Him), but that doesn't mean we don't need Him.
this is a very apposite anology - I always wonder about these many pseudo-logical arguments against the biblical teaching of the reconciliation of all the universe (Col. 1:20)
Allow me to use an analogy. How can one say that people live, and at the same time say they need a heart to live? Is that illogical?
You don't need to know about the heart in order to live. It pumps in your chest whether you know it or not.
Same goes for Christ in univeralist world. All people are saved whether or not they know about Christ. They don't need to know him, let alone believe in him. But of course the Bible says that one must come to the light and believe in order to be saved.
You don't need to know about the heart in order to live. It pumps in your chest whether you know it or not. Same goes for Christ in univeralist world. All people are saved whether or not they know about Christ.
That's the beauty of God's unconditional love and mercy for the people He created.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
They don't need to know him, let alone believe in him. But of course the Bible says that one must come to the light and believe in order to be saved.
That's a matter of interpretation, as has been shown over and over on this forum.
You mentioned before that UR means no need for Christ, but He is all that is needed according to UR. According to ET/traditions of men, His sacrifice was not enough, and there's something people need to do to help save themselves, and that "something" varies greatly depending on which denomination's doctrine is stated.
That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. John 1:9
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Be brave, finish the passage, don't just pick one convenient verse:
10He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. 11He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. 12Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— 13children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.
Finn Jarber: You don't need to know about the heart in order to live. It pumps in your chest whether you know it or not. Same goes for Christ in univeralist world. All people are saved whether or not they know about Christ.
That's the beauty of God's unconditional love and mercy for the people He created.
No, not according to the Bible. Bible repeats over and over that one must come to the light and believe in Christ to be saved.
Accrding to the universalist belief all people are saved, and that means there is no need to know Christ. It's pretty plain and simple.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Believe, or perish. Now, THAT is plain and simple, and it also happens to be from the most famous Bible verse.
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- I always wonder about these many pseudo-logical arguments against the biblical teaching of the reconciliation of all the universe (Col. 1:20)