Is Cincinnati Racist? (Washington, Clinton, Perry: sale, catholic schools, camp)

[bryce05]

Oh no, I commented on racism in a thread about racism. Some of the people in this forum are pathetic, it's hilarious.

I went redneck-hunting with a friend at Trader's World and was not disappointed! HAHA. Overt racism on display right there.

P.S. You wish the sidewalks were my only complaint.

God Bless.

[jlawrence01]

Originally Posted by rodomonte

There was also a race riot in Cincinnati in 1967.

I saw a caddymaster at Cincinnati Country Club run off some black kids who wanted to be caddies there, circa 1958. That golf course was in a very strange neighborhood. Mansions on Grandin road and a ghetto near Grandin and Madison. I am sure those kids could walk there from where they lived. I was a kid myself and that really shocked me.

If you want to see if racism exists in Cincinnati, have some blacks try to buy a house in Mt. Washington. Or call McNicholas High School and ask them how many black students they have. They wouldn't tell me in 1995, but I later found out they had none. Students of Color is presently listed as "N/A."

And in 1958, that would happen in MOST NORTHERN AND SOUTHERN cities. And in WHAT way is what happened 50 years ago relevant except as a red herring?

Obviously, you have not been in Mt. Washington recently.

[jon1987]

Though I really don't think Cincy has any more race issues than other midwestern cities, I do notice a lot of white/black separation on the UC campus. Very little interaction at all.

[t45209]

Originally Posted by jon1987

Though I really don't think Cincy has any more race issues than other midwestern cities, I do notice a lot of white/black separation on the UC campus. Very little interaction at all.

Interesting. And a lot of them are not from Cincinnati, so what does that have to do with Cincinnati? Racism is too often confused with cultural differences. People naturally choose to congregate with people who are similar to them. Whites and blacks can be very different culturally. It's no surprise that you see black comedians making fun of the stiff white guy stereotype. It frequently has nothing to do with anything as shallow as skin color...many blacks just think a dorky, uptight white guy is funny, but it's based on a cultural difference. Likewise, many whites don't like to be around a bunch of raucous, demonstrative people like many blacks are...it's uncomfortable for them because they were raised in a different culture. But the same thing could be said if those raucous and demonstrative people were rednecks. You're not going to get some timid Hyde Park wine and cheese guy to want to live next to them.

So like I said, people tend to separate themselves along these lines.

Now, that said, I went to Princeton High School in the 1980s and I saw first hand how the races separated themselves. There was black side of the cafeteria and a somewhat mixed white/black side of the cafeteria. Many of the white kids were simply afraid to venture into the black zone. And there is the rub...whites are often fundamentally afraid of black people, until that black person can prove to them that they are not a threat, and by implication more culturally aligned. Most whites can say, "I'm not a racist, some of my good friends are black!" because they have bridged that cultural gap. But there are two issues that arise from that...Many blacks who easily integrate with whites are accused by other blacks of being Uncle Toms or "acting white." And then you have some blacks thinking whites are all racists because there's this thing to "prove" that you are not a threat. Unfortunately, though, what they are dealing with are the exceptions that prove the stereotype, and a culture that is often more aggressive and violent than white culture.

And then there are the ignorant whites who somehow believe that all blacks are wired to one another. I remember during the 2001 riots and one of my friends who happens to be black (I love that cliche!) was with me at a bar in Montgomery. My friend, by the way, is an MBA and an attorney, as if that should make any difference, and some idiot comes up to him and says "why are you people doing this???" If my friend should have ever decked anyone it should have been this jerk (who we found out later was from Pittsburgh).

So, no, there is nothing inherently different here than any place else. It's just the way people often are.

Oh, and pardon me for not using the term "African-American" Frankly, I think we could end up driving ourselves crazy if every group demanded to be defined by their origin...German-American, Irish-American, whatever. Why is it only fashionable for blacks to be defined this way?

[jon1987]

^ I'm not saying any of it is exclusive to Cincinnati at all...just an observance

[rodomonte]

Originally Posted by jlawrence01

And in 1958, that would happen in MOST NORTHERN AND SOUTHERN cities. And in WHAT way is what happened 50 years ago relevant except as a red herring?

Obviously, you have not been in Mt. Washington recently.

What happened 50 years ago is relevant because if you claim things are different now please tell me how and when these racist attitudes were changed. The people that belonged to Cincinnati Country Club in 1958 were the monied cream of Cincinnati society. Do they still have the "Society" pages in the Enquirer? These people were in there. Debutantes and Batchelors were their children.

According to the 2000 Census the black population of Mt. Washington was 2%. This is in a suburb only 8 miles from downtown Cincinnati, a city which is 40% black now. The results for the 2010 Census are not out yet, but they will show what percentage of houses in Mt. Washington are owned by blacks. I believe that most blacks in Mt. Washinton are renters. Many are Section 8, which is by law not allowed to discriminate.

For many decades the realtors and banks did a great job of claiming houses were "no longer available" and "redlining." Others could not get mortgage insurance, hence coudn't get a mortgage. There are many tricks to keeping someone undesirable from buying a house.

[Wilson513]

The only place to find overt racism in Cincinnati in 2011 is among black persons. 15 minutes of listening to 1230 WBZ at noon when Lincoln Ware hosts a symposium on racial hatred will expose one to more racial hate speech than 10 years in a bowling alley or a hillwilliam bar.

Many say that persons of color are entitled to their hate filled invective. I disagree, but am not offended by it because I do not harbor the first scintilla of "white guilt." It is misguided and I pray for those who harbor grudges because of what happened to their great grandparents. Almost all persons have grievances in their ancestors' past and we would be in quite a fix if every Irishman harbored hatred for the Scots or the English.

The remnants of racial segregation referred to here, if true (which I doubt), wouldn't make a good bar fight they were between a Pole and a Czech or a Greek and a Turk. Move on, this grievance mentality is not a good thing.

[jlawrence01]

Originally Posted by rodomonte

What happened 50 years ago is relevant because if you claim things are different now please tell me how and when these racist attitudes were changed. The people that belonged to Cincinnati Country Club in 1958 were the monied cream of Cincinnati society. Do they still have the "Society" pages in the Enquirer? These people were in there. Debutantes and Batchelors were their children.

According to the 2000 Census the black population of Mt. Washington was 2%. This is in a suburb only 8 miles from downtown Cincinnati, a city which is 40% black now. The results for the 2010 Census are not out yet, but they will show what percentage of houses in Mt. Washington are owned by blacks. I believe that most blacks in Mt. Washinton are renters. Many are Section 8, which is by law not allowed to discriminate.

For many decades the realtors and banks did a great job of claiming houses were "no longer available" and "redlining." Others could not get mortgage insurance, hence coudn't get a mortgage. There are many tricks to keeping someone undesirable from buying a house.

As I stated in my prior post, it is very obvious that you have not been in Mt. Washington recently.

[Wilson513]

Originally Posted by jlawrence01

As I stated in my prior post, it is very obvious that you have not been in Mt. Washington recently.

I should have commented on this. Both of my sons bought little Obamamoney houses in Mt. Washington in 2010. Mt. Washington is a well integrated community. In fact, as I drove through yesterday I was thinking about this post and noticed that all three persons on the street at Beechmont and Sutton were AA. I'd say a third of the Krogers customers at any point in time are AA and every street in the city limits up there is well integrated. Whether they rent or buy is a matter of economics and preferences, not racism.

As for McNick, number two son graduated there in 2000 and the closest thing there was to a minority was son's friend who's father is a Peruvian transplant surgeon. But guaranteed racism has nothing to do with that. They would love to have as many minorities as they can get. They were a little self conscious about it. I think most AA families who could send their children to McNick prefer Walnut Hills.

[The Don]

I have a theory about human behavior - that due to our early development in tribal communities, we are by nature hostile to others not in our group. Be they of different races, religions, regions or what have you.

In trying to answer the orignal question about Cincinnati and racisim, the various posters have served to validate this theory.
Thus we have bryce05 sterotyping red-necks:

Originally Posted by bryce05

I went redneck-hunting with a friend at Trader's World and was not disappointed! HAHA. Overt racism on display right there.

I.E., well you all know those red-necks - they are racists.

I wonder how many soldiers fighting on Union side to free the slaves would today be classified as red-necks?

Or Sarah Perry:

Originally Posted by Sarah Perry

... of white Cincinnati's historic prevailing German Catholic ethnicity and its emphasis on a rather highly structured, "follow the rules" mindset.

Well you know, those white Germans, they are by nature close minded.

My point is not to be critical of the posters here; Lord no, I am just as guilty as anyone but I quote them to illustrate my hypothesis that human beings are racist/religist/etc. by nature.

So ease up a bit.