Is the SF Bay Area #2 or #3 in the United States? (live, largest)
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Two points, one this was a comparison in what actually lies between with; in terms of CSA there is a very real possibilty they will be connected this Census (widely documented on here)
No, what's more likely to happen is counties in between the two will be aligned with whichever city they are most related to as far as commuting.
It is a far fetched dream, and in my opinion a nightmare(for Philly) to think that a proud and storied city the caliber of Philadelphia, would happily be demoted to the same status as New Haven and Stamford. Outposts of New York.
Really? Is that what you want?
And for what reason? To spite places that have surpassed you? LOL.
To be honest, I dont even want Stockton or the rest of the Central Valley because they bring our income and economic output averages WAY DOWN. Id prefer to keep things as they are out here.
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Two the jobs and influence do overlap; people commute between and interact these census designated places with no regard to OMB designation (these lines dont exist in the real world) with little distance traversed; sometimes like 5 miles and and believe it or not little resistance (well sometimes the EZ Pass lanes malfunction)
Yes but either 15% of all workers from one MSA commute to another MSA or they DONT.
And they dont in this case. At this point we're talking breadcrumbs similar to the commuters we see between Sacramento/ Yolo and Solano Counties.
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And on a regional consensus; nor are SJ and SF perfectly connect; are they intertwined; most definately; remember in the space between these two there exists
But they still more than qualify because of the interchange of workers. SF and SJ meet the guidelines to be combined as a single CSA.
No, what's more likely to happen is counties in between the two will be aligned with whichever city they are most related to as far as commuting.
It is a far fetched dream, and in my opinion a nightmare(for Philly) to think that a proud and storied city the caliber of Philadelphia, would happily be demoted to the same status as New Haven and Stamford. Outposts of New York.
Really? Is that what you want?
And for what reason? To spite places that have surpassed you? LOL.
To be honest, I dont even want Stockton or the rest of the Central Valley because they bring our income and economic output averages WAY DOWN. Id prefer to keep things as they are out here.
Yes but either 15% of all workers from one MSA commute to another MSA or they DONT.
And they dont in this case. At this point we're talking breadcrumbs similar to the commuters we see between Sacramento/ Yolo and Solano Counties.
But they still more than qualify because of the interchange of workers. SF and SJ meet the guidelines to be combined as a single CSA.
Mont Claire it is highly documented that Mercer was a technicality in 2000 so fed employees could get a COL increase; this County was a Philly MSA prior it fell to 24.8% commuter rate in 2000 well above the 15.1% that gave them the ability to move to the NY CSA
Phille and NYC will NEVER be one MSA - they will always retain their own identity. My point here is that these arbitrary diminish the influence and finbancial aopportunity of Philadelphias location; so all these metris diminish the actually location relative to rankings. on being one CSA or UA - i am perfectly as this only demonstrates the feveloped cohesion and interplay that ACTUALLY exists in the real world. Phille and NYC will always be there own place; rightfully so
And on your Breadcrumbs there are 7-800K people that commute one way or another accross the MSA borders; not an insignificant amount of interplay - issue is these are among many different counties and blurr the census number your comparison is a basically bi-modal commuter number on a tight border. i agree the Bay is connected and intertwined but so is this region
You actually do not understand the connectivity of this space. i have lived in both areas (Both NYC and Philly) and no these dynamics extremly well.
But UA and CSAs are two completely different things. NYC and Philadelphia will never be part of the same metropolitan area.
Philadelphia clinging onto New York City's stats may look good on paper (for Philadelphia) but IMO, it would be disastrous for Philly to be demoted to a NYC suburb.
Wouldnt a CSA shared between Philly and NYC cause Philly to be left out of rankings due to being in the same metro as NYC? Philly is to tailed a city to play second
Wouldnt a CSA shared between Philly and NYC cause Philly to be left out of rankings due to being in the same metro as NYC?
They will always retain seperate MSAs but may be one combined CSA
They are continuously developed with two large centers at either end (obviously one much larger) - the part that is odd is the two areas intertwine; especially the space in between but they are truly bi-modal
The CSA would be odd in that they would be technically connected based on cummuter patterns in the areas the lie between.
This would be pretty much a Census anomaly in that they they are two seperate cities who's expanse has blurred as to what it really is
If they Combine at CSA Philly would combined with NYC so yes it would not exist in a CSA list; only as an MSA
But UA and CSAs are two completely different things. NYC and Philadelphia will never be part of the same metropolitan area.
Philadelphia clinging onto New York City's stats may look good on paper (for Philadelphia) but IMO, it would be disastrous for Philly to be demoted to a NYC suburb.
These are purely stats - they will always retain independent identities
Mont Claire it is highly documented that Mercer was a technicality in 2000 so fed employees could get a COL increase; this County was a Philly MSA prior it fell to 24.8% commuter rate in 2000 well above the 15.1% that gave them the ability to move to the NY CSA
Yes, this huge travesty has been recounted to us ad nauseum.
Basically your saying that 2 Top 10 CSAs will be combined because of the commuter exchange in one county? REALLY? Please name one other place in the ENTIRE NATION where that has ever occurred?
In order for Philadelphia to combine with New York, the Philadelphia MSA itself has send 15% of more of its workers to the NY MSA for work.
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And on your Breadcrumbs there are 7-800K people that commute one way or another accross the MSA borders
Not according to the Census Bureau.
The only county I see Philly making a legitimate claim to is Mercer, NJ. County of Residence to County of Employment, 2000
Mercer, NJ to Bucks, PA 20,812
Mercer, NJ to Burlington, NJ 17,158
Mercer, NJ to Camden, NJ 2,472
Mercer, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 1,676
Mercer, NJ to Montgomery, PA 1,298
Mercer, NJ to Delaware, PA 345
Otherwise, no.
Hunterdon, NJ to Bucks, PA 2,107
Hunterdon, NJ to Burlington, NJ 208
Hunterdon, NJ to Montgomery, PA 119
Hunterdon, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 115
Hunterdon, NJ to Camden, NJ 67
Hunterdon, NJ to Delaware, PA 24
Hunterdon, NJ to Chester, PA 23
Monmouth, NJ to Burlington, NJ 1,304
Monmouth, NJ to Bucks, PA 404
Monmouth, NJ to Camden, NJ 350
Monmouth, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 73
Monmouth, NJ to Montgomery, PA 57
Monmouth, NJ to Delaware, PA 29
Ocean, NJ to Burlington, NJ 2,042
Ocean, NJ to Camden, NJ 359
Ocean, NJ to Bucks, NJ 220
Ocean, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 86
Ocean, NJ to Chester, PA 23
Ocean, NJ to Montgomery, PA 13
Ocean, NJ to Delaware, PA 10
Somerset, NJ to Bucks, PA 2,304
Somerset, NJ to Burlington, NJ 704
Somerset, NJ to Camden, NJ 246
Somerset, NJ to Montgomery, PA 236
Somerset, NJ to Philadelphia, NJ 189
Somerset, NJ to Chester, PA 75
Somerset, NJ to Chester, PA 55
That is all very small compared to this:
Alameda, CA to Santa Clara, CA 69,669
San Mateo, CA to Santa Clara, CA 55,473
Santa Cruz, CA to Santa Clara, CA 21,540
San Francisco, CA to Santa Clara, CA 15,868
Contra Costa, CA to Santa Clara, CA 10,145
Furthermore, although both sets of figures are small, SF City gets a bit more commuters from the Sacramento Area than Manhattan does from the Philadelphia Area.
Philadelphia, PA to New York, NY 274
Burlington, NJ to New York, NY 107
Montgomery, PA to New York, NY 77
Bucks, PA to New York, NY 47
Chester, PA to New York, NY 34
Delaware, PA to New York, NY 34
Camden, NJ to New York, NY 28
vs.
Sacramento, CA to San Francisco, CA 1,359
Placer, CA to San Francisco, CA 399
Yolo, CA to San Francisco, CA 319
El Dorado, CA to San Francisco, CA 288
Nevada, CA to San Francisco, CA 136
Yes, this huge travesty has been recounted to us ad nauseum.
Basically your saying that 2 Top 10 CSAs will be combined because of the commuter exchange in one county? REALLY? Please name one other place in the ENTIRE NATION where that has ever occurred?
In order for Philadelphia to combine with New York, the Philadelphia MSA itself has send 15% of more of its workers to the NY MSA for work.
Not according to the Census Bureau.
The only county I see Philly making a legitimate claim to is Mercer, NJ. County of Residence to County of Employment, 2000
Mercer, NJ to Bucks, PA 20,812
Mercer, NJ to Burlington, NJ 17,158
Mercer, NJ to Camden, NJ 2,472
Mercer, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 1,676
Mercer, NJ to Montgomery, PA 1,298
Mercer, NJ to Delaware, PA 345
Otherwise, no.
Hunterdon, NJ to Bucks, PA 2,107
Hunterdon, NJ to Burlington, NJ 208
Hunterdon, NJ to Montgomery, PA 119
Hunterdon, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 115
Hunterdon, NJ to Camden, NJ 67
Hunterdon, NJ to Delaware, PA 24
Hunterdon, NJ to Chester, PA 23
Monmouth, NJ to Burlington, NJ 1,304
Monmouth, NJ to Bucks, PA 404
Monmouth, NJ to Camden, NJ 350
Monmouth, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 73
Monmouth, NJ to Montgomery, PA 57
Monmouth, NJ to Delaware, PA 29
Ocean, NJ to Burlington, NJ 2,042
Ocean, NJ to Camden, NJ 359
Ocean, NJ to Bucks, NJ 220
Ocean, NJ to Philadelphia, PA 86
Ocean, NJ to Chester, PA 23
Ocean, NJ to Montgomery, PA 13
Ocean, NJ to Delaware, PA 10
Somerset, NJ to Bucks, PA 2,304
Somerset, NJ to Burlington, NJ 704
Somerset, NJ to Camden, NJ 246
Somerset, NJ to Montgomery, PA 236
Somerset, NJ to Philadelphia, NJ 189
Somerset, NJ to Chester, PA 75
Somerset, NJ to Chester, PA 55
That is all very small compared to this:
Alameda, CA to Santa Clara, CA 69,669
San Mateo, CA to Santa Clara, CA 55,473
Santa Cruz, CA to Santa Clara, CA 21,540
San Francisco, CA to Santa Clara, CA 15,868
Contra Costa, CA to Santa Clara, CA 10,145
Furthermore, although both sets of figures are small, SF City gets a bit more commuters from the Sacramento Area than Manhattan does from the Philadelphia Area.
Philadelphia, PA to New York, NY 274
Burlington, NJ to New York, NY 107
Montgomery, PA to New York, NY 77
Bucks, PA to New York, NY 47
Chester, PA to New York, NY 34
Delaware, PA to New York, NY 34
Camden, NJ to New York, NY 28
vs.
Sacramento, CA to San Francisco, CA 1,359
Placer, CA to San Francisco, CA 399
Yolo, CA to San Francisco, CA 319
El Dorado, CA to San Francisco, CA 288
Nevada, CA to San Francisco, CA 136
Actually not sure on your reference but Yardley Bourough (tiny borough very close to the Trenton Rail) alone in Bucks (there was almost the number you show from Bucks whom passed away in the WTC on 911) alone has more than 500 that commute to manhattan. There is 911 Memorial in Yardley Bourough for all from the town that passed. I grew up in Bucks County and know personally more than 47 residents that commute to NYC - places like Yardley, Newtown, Upper Makefield, Lower Makefield are loaded with Manhattan commuters at times this is considered a NYC Bedroom community and even marketed as such in NYC. The 47 is a blantant error. Go to the Trenton train Station (it is a 1/2 mile from Bucks County) some morning and see the throngs of Bucks and Burlington County Commuters who pack train after train heading into NYC. Amtrak even augments NJT monthly passes to augment volume on their clocker service into Penn Station. There are over 1,500 PATH daily riders from Bucks County that link in Newark to lower Manhattan.
Look I agree the main draw from both is toward the main city but there is far more interplay that you suggest; and you only counted commuters in one direction. The Link on Mercer actually flows north and not South - there are huge job markets all the way between and they flow both directions interchangeably and have very high interplay
And yes Mercer is the connection and these counties all are much smaller than those you show in CA
You actually are also not looking at the Philly to central jersey commuters which is very large - there is no large job center in Bucks; they are west or in mt Laurel etc or Philly - the area just across the MSA border Princeton/Hightstown etc draw commuters north (yes it is 20-25 miles from Philly proper)
Actually not sure on your reference but Yardley Bourough (tiny borough very close to the Trenton Rail) alone in Bucks (there was almost the number you show from Bucks whom passed away in the WTC on 911) alone has more than 500 that commute to manhattan. There is 911 Memorial in Yardley Bourough for all from the town that passed. I grew up in Bucks County and know personally more than 47 residents that commute to NYC - places like Yardley, Newtown, Upper Makefield, Lower Makefield are loaded with Manhattan commuters at times this is considered a NYC Bedroom community and even marketed as such in NYC. The 47 is a blantant error. Go to the Trenton train Station (it is a 1/2 mile from Bucks County) some morning and see the throngs of Bucks and Burlington County Commuters who pack train after train heading into NYC. Amtrak even augments NJT monthly passes to augment volume on their clocker service into Penn Station. There are over 1,500 PATH daily riders from Bucks County that link in Newark to lower Manhattan.
Look I agree the main draw from both is toward the main city but there is far more interplay that you suggest; and you only counted commuters in one direction. The Link on Mercer actually flows north and not South - there are huge job markets all the way between and they flow both directions interchangeably and have very high interplay
And yes Mercer is the connection and these counties all are much smaller than those you show in CA
You actually are also not looking at the Philly to central jersey commuters which is very large - there is no large job center in Bucks; they are west or in mt Laurel etc or Philly - the area just across the MSA border Princeton/Hightstown etc draw commuters north (yes it is 20-25 miles from Philly proper)
The Census Bureau tracks county-to-county worker flow, you can sort every county in the country by county of residence or county of employment. The last one was released in 2000.
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