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Actually, as I categorize cities, only one is large. Hence, the the reason I find it a disservice to SF when people persist in comparing it against Philly and other large cities. If comparing actual cities (not metros), SF should be matched against those more its size (Indy, Austin and such), which I find it fares quite well against. I'm sure most would agree it definitely punches above its weight.
well, if we're talking city limit size, then i think boston,dc are better comparisons
Actually, as I categorize cities, only one is large. Hence, the the reason I find it a disservice to SF when people persist in comparing it against Philly and other large cities. If comparing actual cities (not metros), SF should be matched against those more its size (Indy, Austin and such), which I find it fares quite well against. I'm sure most would agree it definitely punches above its weight.
well, if we're talking city limit size, then i think boston,dc are better comparisons
Population-wise, SF is about 30% larger than each of these. I would say all three are pretty scrappy for their size. They do make an interesting (and IMO, fairer) match-up, however, when one is comparing actual cities.
Actually, as I categorize cities, only one is large. Hence, the the reason I find it a disservice to SF when people persist in comparing it against Philly and other large cities. If comparing actual cities (not metros), SF should be matched against those more its size (Indy, Austin and such), which I find it fares quite well against. I'm sure most would agree it definitely punches above its weight.
Nice try, but yes it does punch WaYYYY above its weight, right past Philly....
Most municipalities in the area were established as towns distinct of each other, not as post-war suburbs. I would assume they would have grown and developed as they did in reality.
And people would lose the illusion of the Bay Area being dramatically different from the SoCal cities.
For reference (using numbers posted on this board), San Francisco's GCSAP (I have no idea what to call that) is $544.969 Billion and Philadelphia is CSA $366.792 Billion. That's a pretty big difference. I know a lot of Philadelphians would want to claim Trenton too, which would put Philadelphia up to 393.472 billion, which is still way behind the San Francisco Bay Area.
Now, if the title of this thread was "Is it fair to compare the Delaware Valley to the San Francisco Bay Area," I'd say no. That would be ridiculous. The Bay Area has 2-3 large cities and the Delaware Valley is primarily Philadelphia. But Philadelphia and San Francisco can be compared if for no other reason than they're both large, important cities.
I would consider Wilmington a major city too even though it is relatively small.
Also the Philly area is really ALL of South Jersey including Atlantic City (Atlantic County and Cape May County) and Mercer County (Trenton)... it's ridiculous that they removed those regions from the Philly CSA in 2000... makes no sense to me. It's also important to note that the only two counties added to the CSA that are not a part of the MSA are Cumberland County in New Jersey and Berks County in PA... Philly gets DICKED on CSA numbers. It's really a lot more than it looks from Census statistics.
For reference (using numbers posted on this board), San Francisco's GCSAP (I have no idea what to call that) is $544.969 Billion and Philadelphia is CSA $366.792 Billion. That's a pretty big difference. I know a lot of Philadelphians would want to claim Trenton too, which would put Philadelphia up to 393.472 billion, which is still way behind the San Francisco Bay Area.
Now, if the title of this thread was "Is it fair to compare the Delaware Valley to the San Francisco Bay Area," I'd say no. That would be ridiculous. The Bay Area has 2-3 large cities and the Delaware Valley is primarily Philadelphia. But Philadelphia and San Francisco can be compared if for no other reason than they're both large, important cities.
You're exactly right.
San Francisco is in what is probably the most unique urban area in the country in terms of the central city being relatively small by population size for "large" cities, yet becomes bolstered dramatically in importance/stature when you consider its MSA and especially CSA (at that level, it pretty clearly surpasses Philadelphia). It really is all entirely dependent on the unit of measurement.
Also the Philly area is really ALL of South Jersey including Atlantic City (Atlantic County and Cape May County) and Mercer County (Trenton)... it's ridiculous that they removed those regions from the Philly CSA in 2000... makes no sense to me. It's also important to note that the only two counties added to the CSA that are not a part of the MSA are Cumberland County in New Jersey and Berks County in PA... Philly gets DICKED on CSA numbers. It's really a lot more than it looks from Census statistics.
I agree that Philadelphia's sphere of influence is institutionally under-counted by the Federal government, but even with the potential incorporation of the areas you've listed, it still would not be nearly competitive with Silicon Valley's addition to San Francisco's CSA.
It would, however, give Philly's urban area a strong edge over cities like Dallas and Houston, but that's a whole other conversation entirely.
I agree that Philadelphia's sphere of influence is institutionally under-counted by the Federal government, but even with the potential incorporation of the areas you've listed, it still would not be nearly competitive with Silicon Valley's addition to San Francisco's CSA.
It would, however, give Philly's urban area a strong edge over cities like Dallas and Houston, but that's a whole other conversation entirely.
I agree with you. I wasn't stating it would beat out The Bay Area if those areas were included... but the 366 mill number would look more like 466 mill... Philly is seriously underrepresented by the Feds.
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