Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Florida is every bit as southern as Georgia, just a little sliver of Miami is international.
I disagree, but South Florida is particularly non-Southern. Specifically, Fort Lauderdale and Broward County are culturally Northeastern, while Miami-Dade is culturally Latin American, particularly Cuban. Areas like Orlando, Jacksonville, and the Tampa Bay culturally are more general American than Southern in terms of culture, mindset, pace of life, religion, etc. I'd say that parts of North Florida and the Panhandle are the only parts of Florida that are truly Southern. No, Orlando is NOT as Southern feeling as Savannah or Augusta.
I'm not saying that they do myself, I'm just saying that their presence often causes others to do so. Which I don't blame, because Hispanics are absent within many depictions of the South. Not only that, the Hispanics in Houston and Dallas are Mexicans from NorMex, a trait only found elsewhere in the SW US.
No, it's more that many people think of the South in the stereotypical, "Gone With The Wind" sense. Hispanics are pretty much absent in that depiction, and because of their sheer presence in Dallas and Houston, people often don't view those cities as "traditionally Southern."
Indeed, if I walk around Houston right now, it feels more like a "Gulf Coast version" of Los Angeles, demographics-wise. Apart from climate and scenery, there's none of that old-timey "Southern" charm to be seen.
So, it's sort of an enigma. Many people are arguing against NoVa's southerness on basis of cultural change from NE US transplants. And so, on that note, I don't see how a similar case can't be made for Houston, Dallas, and Miami with their Hispanic populations.
Well in the present day South there are plenty of Hispanics so Gone With the Wind is irrelevant
Is Dalton, Georgia not Southern because of its huge Mexican population?
"International" doesn't dictate Southern culture or not. Most states aren't "international" and have only 1 "international" city at most. Atlanta is "International" yet would you say ATL isn't Southern?
Atlanta has a racially diverse population including many immigrants from various parts of the world, with different degrees of assimilation, including many who are culturally very Americanized and Southern....and most of Atlanta's population is still native born despite immigration. Miami is totally dominated by a foreign culture, specifically the Cuban culture, to the extent that its not even culturally an American city. To me, Miami is the most foreign feeling city in America, even compared to Honolulu, where most people speak English and is more racially mixed than a single completely unassimilated, non English speaking foreign-born group forming the dominant population.
Fort Lauderdale culturally is the same as New Jersey and New York.
Atlanta has a racially diverse population including many immigrants from various parts of the world, with different degrees of assimilation, including many who are culturally very Americanized and Southern....and most of Atlanta's population is still native born despite immigration. Miami is totally dominated by a foreign culture, specifically the Cuban culture, to the extent that its not even culturally an American city. To me, Miami is the most foreign feeling city in America, even compared to Honolulu, where most people speak English and is more racially mixed than a single completely unassimilated, non English speaking foreign-born group forming the dominant population.
Fort Lauderdale culturally is the same as New Jersey and New York.
I have a feeling you're not that familiar with either Miami or Ft Lauderdale
I've been to Ft. Lauderdale 5 times and it felt nothing like New York or New Jersey
Well in the present day South there are plenty of Hispanics so Gone With the Wind is irrelevant
Is Dalton, Georgia not Southern because of its huge Mexican population?
Dalton GA is historically Southern. The mere presents of Hispanics in an area doesn't make a place not Southern. But areas like Miami, and many parts of Texas have always been in dispute because their histories were never inline with Southern culture due to either their irrelevance/distance to the antebellum economy and way of life or due to their non existance during the antebellum period. Dalton GA could be 100% Hispanic and still be Southern, because nowhere in GA was ever in dispute of being anything else. Florida and Texas didn't even achieve statehood until maybe 20yrs before the Civil War, respectively. So there wasn't even a long established Antebellum economy or culture or way of life established in a majority of Texas and Florida during the time of the civil war. It's no coincidence most of the battles occured in North Florida and East Texas while the rest of both states were largely unoccupied by Anglos or were unoccupied at all....
Dalton GA is historically Southern. The mere presents of Hispanics in an area doesn't make a place not Southern. But areas like Miami, and many parts of Texas have always been in dispute because their histories were never inline with Southern culture due to either their irrelevance/distance to the antebellum economy and way of life or due to their non existance during the antebellum period. Dalton GA could be 100% Hispanic and still be Southern, because nowhere in GA was ever in dispute of being anything else. Florida and Texas didn't even achieve statehood until maybe 20yrs before the Civil War, respectively. So there wasn't even a long established Antebellum economy or culture or way of life established in a majority of Texas and Florida during the time of the civil war. It's no coincidence most of the battles occured in North Florida and East Texas while the rest of both states were largely unoccupied by Anglos or were unoccupied at all....
Well Texas and Florida are huge states so it really depends on the area
I wouldn't claim that El Paso is Southern but I sure would with Houston
Atlanta has a racially diverse population including many immigrants from various parts of the world, with different degrees of assimilation, including many who are culturally very Americanized and Southern....and most of Atlanta's population is still native born despite immigration. Miami is totally dominated by a foreign culture, specifically the Cuban culture, to the extent that its not even culturally an American city. To me, Miami is the most foreign feeling city in America, even compared to Honolulu, where most people speak English and is more racially mixed than a single completely unassimilated, non English speaking foreign-born group forming the dominant population.
Fort Lauderdale culturally is the same as New Jersey and New York.
Fort Lauderdale is not in any way shape or form like New Jersey or New York.
Well in the present day South there are plenty of Hispanics so Gone With the Wind is irrelevant
Is Dalton, Georgia not Southern because of its huge Mexican population?
Once again, I'm not making any claims, just explaining why people don't view the big Texas cities as traditionally "Southern." Although Houston and Dallas don't have as much Hispanic foundation as places like El Paso, the demographic in both cities is still quite established in ways not seen with "typical" Southern locations like Georgia. Dalton, in particular, only has a population little over 30,000, so that's not saying much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80s_kid
Folks are too liberal with hyperbole with that comparison. Sure there may be a NY transplants there but they're in a different environment.
Seems that people think of international populations as a key NYC trait.
Last edited by kemahkami; 11-19-2019 at 12:31 PM..
I'm not saying that they do myself, I'm just saying that their presence often causes others to do so. Which I don't blame, because Hispanics are absent within many depictions of the South. Not only that, the Hispanics in Houston and Dallas are Mexicans from NorMex, a trait only found elsewhere in the SW US.
No, it's more that many people think of the South in the stereotypical, "Gone With The Wind" sense. Hispanics are pretty much absent in that depiction, and because of their sheer presence in Dallas and Houston, people often don't view those cities as "traditionally Southern."
I don't think it's so much the Hispanic populations that cause folks to not think of Dallas and Houston as traditionally Southern; it's because they are in Texas and Texas is often seen as a region into itself that serves as the crossroads of other regions (Plains, Gulf Coast, SW). Now of course demographics play a big role in that, but I don't think that's the reason by itself.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
