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Southern New England simply doesn't have the population to carry it. HR has the same black population as the entire state of MA. Milwaukee or Pittsburgh can be candidates, but Pittsburgh is not as black as Milwaukee or HR and it's more in line with Louisville and Indianapolis. Less black, but equally as underrepresented. So it's really Milwaukee and HR in a league of their own. Jacksonville is in the convo, as well.
Virginia Beach is a big city; in fact is larger than Miami, Minneapolis, and New Orleans. That in itself highlights just how far beneath the cusp HR is at. The state's largest city can't even get the recognition of being a large city lol.
I know you may hear of people from there a lot, maybe in your world. Let's be honest here. HR has very little to no black cultural identity to call its own. I lived there for several years. It's a fluid area that has great influence from the Mid-Atlantic cities like DC, Baltimore, Philly, and NYC with a tinge from the south, but none that they can really pass as their own quite yet; and it shows with how little exposure that they get outside of the famed few you mentioned.
I'm not saying it isn't recognized at all. I'm saying it punches far below its weight.
Consider that Southern New England has over 1 million black people. You’re kind of proving my point.
Including mixed race people there are 700k black in MA alone and 500k in CT. And 100k in RI 1.3 M. In a land area smaller than PA.
More black (alone, non Latino)in Greater Boston than all of Wisconsin.. so if size is an argument for you doesn’t that eliminate Milwaukee? And there’s beaucoup black history.
Boston area alone has more black than KCMO are, Bay Area, Milwaukee, Richmond, but all of southern New England can’t register a sound?
HR is well known but not for cultural distinctiveness.
I guess your point about VA beach is legit, albeit no one thinks of VA beach like that white black whatever. It’s though of as a beach and military place. Not a legitimate major city.
Last edited by BostonBornMassMade; 01-29-2022 at 01:30 PM..
I feel like Milwaukee's black population is severely underrepresented considering it's a large urban city at almost 40%. Not many prominent black figures hailing from there, and its black cultural output is vastly overshadowed by Chicago.
Also, this is pretty much a Hampton Roads thread. Hampton and Portsmouth are one of few cities that has a "black alone" population at 50% or more. That's two cities with the highest concentration of black people, belonging to the same area. Then Norfolk, Suffolk, and Newport News all above 40%. Very unique concentration, but definitely lacks the recognition both historically and present.
I feel the same concerning Milwaukee. Some of it might have to do with history, migration patterns. Black transplants were still moving into the city itself in sizable waves decades after the end of the Great Migration. In fact, it peaked in 2010. Black Milwaukeans in the past decade or two have just now gain mobility into the inner suburbs.
Even in hip hop, Milwaukee is almost nonexistent in producing a recognizable rapper(Lakeyah is their biggest artist from what I see and the first)) on a national level. One thing I find interesting from listening to a few Milwaukee black rappers is that they sound like they could be from California or Detroit, even though they are geographically way closer to Chicago.
Last edited by Chicagoland60426; 01-29-2022 at 02:17 PM..
I feel the same concerning Milwaukee. Some of it might have to do with history, migration patterns. Black transplants were still moving into the city itself in sizable waves decades after the end of the Great Migration. In fact, it peaked in 2010. Black Milwaukeans in the past decade or two have just now gain mobility into the inner suburbs.
Even in hip hop, Milwaukee is almost nonexistent in producing a recognizable rapper(Lakeyah is their biggest artist from what I see and the first)) on a national level. One thing I find interesting from listening to a few Milwaukee black rappers is that they sound like they could be from California or Detroit, even though they are geographically way closer to Chicago.
I will say Lakeyah is fire though - got bars for days.
Consider that Southern New England has over 1 million black people. You’re kind of proving my point.
Including mixed race people there are 700k black in MA alone and 500k in CT. And 100k in RI 1.3 M. In a land area smaller than PA.
More black (alone, non Latino)in Greater Boston than all of Wisconsin.. so if size is an argument for you doesn’t that eliminate Milwaukee? And there’s beaucoup black history.
Boston area alone has more black than KCMO are, Bay Area, Milwaukee, Richmond, but all of southern New England can’t register a sound?
HR is well known but not for cultural distinctiveness.
I guess your point about VA beach is legit, albeit no one thinks of VA beach like that white black whatever. It’s though of as a beach and military place. Not a legitimate major city.
Then what is HR known for, exactly?
Milwaukee has 230k blacks city proper, Boston has 172k blacks. Boston MSA has 389k blacks to Milwaukee MSA's 252k. So not only is 90% of all the black population in Milwaukee's metro concentrated in Milwaukee - 62% of the black population for the entire state of WI, is concentrated in Milwaukee. That's alarming, I'd say.
33% of the black population in MA, is concentrated in Boston.
The core cities of CT do have significant black populations, Hartford-Bridgeport-New Haven. They hold around the same share of the state's black population as Boston. Those three cities together have a combined black population of 140k, which is about 37% of the black population in CT. I thought it'd be higher, honestly.
=MurphyKing54;62796823]Then what is HR known for, exactly?
Milwaukee has 230k blacks city proper, Boston has 172k blacks. Boston MSA has 389k blacks to Milwaukee MSA's 252k. So not only is 90% of all the black population in Milwaukee's metro concentrated in Milwaukee - 62% of the black population for the entire state of WI, is concentrated in Milwaukee. That's alarming, I'd say.
33% of the black population in MA, is concentrated in Boston.
The core cities of CT do have significant black populations, Hartford-Bridgeport-New Haven. They hold around the same share of the state's black population as Boston. Those three cities together have a combined black population of 140k, which is about 37% of the black population in CT. I thought it'd be higher, honestly.
People know it has a lot of black people- particularly athletes in both basketball and football and Missy Elliot/pharaell Timbaland. It has one of the top 5 most famous HBCUs. It’s on TV, the radio, it’s not like not recognized. Maybe it’s just not a standout as “unique” I think in part because it’s a driver or at least emblematic of of black cultural norms and attitudes nationwide. Most cities aren’t “known” for something within their black populations, only a few.
There is interpretation but I don’t think this is about what certain cities are known for. Its do people know they have black people and history? The assumption is Boston doesn’t and no one knows about Milwaukee. And if we’re taking about significant black populations both Boston and Milwaukee are ‘significant’ populations especially Bostons metro. Let alone Southern NE altogether.
I’d also add the density of black population is way higher in Boston. Is Greater suburbanization is a net negative? That’s the basis of LA ATL DC etc Bay Area- like I said the Boston area has more black people in general and way more black history. A lot more.
CT has cities with large black populations ( so does Brockton MA, in the Boston MSA) and considerable black presence at 10-14% of the state. But I’d err on the side of 14%. It’s certainly has produced a number of athletes entertainer and more (looking at Jahana Hayes and Dr. Steve Perry).
Point is no one would be surprised to learn there are blacks in HR. That’s 100% the expected default. People would not believe if you say CT/MA had substantial black populations and they absolutely wouldn’t believe you if you said it was over 1,00,000 if you adidn’t show them yourself. And even then..
Southern NE has the tobacco fields of Hartford, NYC connections in FFC, Black Panther Party of New Haven, the Black Elite of Martha’s Vineyard, the Underground Railroad/black intellectuals and man y’black “firsts” in Boston, the slave plantation of Rhode Island. But I don’t think 90-95% of the general public is aware.
I feel the same concerning Milwaukee. Some of it might have to do with history, migration patterns. Black transplants were still moving into the city itself in sizable waves decades after the end of the Great Migration. In fact, it peaked in 2010. Black Milwaukeans in the past decade or two have just now gain mobility into the inner suburbs.
Even in hip hop, Milwaukee is almost nonexistent in producing a recognizable rapper(Lakeyah is their biggest artist from what I see and the first)) on a national level. One thing I find interesting from listening to a few Milwaukee black rappers is that they sound like they could be from California or Detroit, even though they are geographically way closer to Chicago.
Damn, I vaguely remember hearing "My Projects", but I must've associated it with a NOLA rapper during the early 2000s.
Well, it look like his buzz was short-lived. Lakeyah, on the other hand, has taken it to the next level. She benefits coming out of a heavy social media age. She already collab with really hit names and her songs are hitting at least 1-2mil per video, compared to Coo Coo Cal's 400k-ish for his one hit single.
People know it has a lot of black people- particularly athletes in both basketball and football and Missy Elliot/pharaell Timbaland. It has one of the top 5 most famous HBCUs. It’s on TV, the radio, it’s not like not recognized. Maybe it’s just not a standout as “unique” I think in part because it’s a driver or at least emblematic of of black cultural norms and attitudes nationwide. Most cities aren’t “known” for something within their black populations, only a few.
Of course people know there's black people there, unless they're completely clueless. The post is about which cities have larger or equal proportions of black people to more famed cities with black identities, without the representation to match it; not if people know if there's black people there or not.
But your paragraph here illustrated exactly why I mentioned HR. It doesn't stand out, but it's quintessential Black America. It has the black presence (metro 30% black), history, and the leadership (Portsmouth, NN, Hampton, and Norfolk all have black mayors), without the recognition as being a "black center of gravity". You have to list legends who began their careers 30 years ago. What about recent? Areas with actual black cultural output have a new star every other year. HR has been in a creative slump for over 15 years.
Yet, 5 of its cities are all within top 35 blackest cities in the country. In one metro area of 1.7 million.
The only area to list 5 within the top 35 is Georgia. For the entire state.
I know you won't understand what I'm saying, but the key point here is that HR is 100% an anomaly in this regard, and one you'd think would have a much higher stake in the black image and culture of the country based on how dominant it is numbers wise compared to most places. The metro is literally in a league with Atlanta and New Orleans (the famed cities) by black percentage, yet the country is overlooking it largely in favor of NC and DMV, even Richmond; especially black people themselves. A couple cities are losing black population.
Your thing is that people wouldn't know there's that many black people in New England. Cool. I'm not arguing that. My thing is, people know there's a very large black community in HR, but they're not interested nor care to know more than that. That's truly what "lack of representation" means. Knowing you exist, but that's it.
Of course people know there's black people there, unless they're completely clueless. The post is about which cities have larger or equal proportions of black people to more famed cities with black identities, without the representation to match it; not if people know if there's black people there or not.
But your paragraph here illustrated exactly why I mentioned HR. It doesn't stand out, but it's quintessential Black America. It has the black presence (metro 30% black), history, and the leadership (Portsmouth, NN, Hampton, and Norfolk all have black mayors), without the recognition as being a "black center of gravity". You have to list legends who began their careers 30 years ago. What about recent? Areas with actual black cultural output have a new star every other year. HR has been in a creative slump for over 15 years.
Yet, 5 of its cities are all within top 35 blackest cities in the country. In one metro area of 1.7 million.
The only area to list 5 within the top 35 is Georgia. For the entire state.
I know you won't understand what I'm saying, but the key point here is that HR is 100% an anomaly in this regard, and one you'd think would have a much higher stake in the black image and culture of the country based on how dominant it is numbers wise compared to most places. The metro is literally in a league with Atlanta and New Orleans (the famed cities) by black percentage, yet the country is overlooking it largely in favor of NC and DMV, even Richmond; especially black people themselves. A couple cities are losing black population.
Your thing is that people wouldn't know there's that many black people in New England. Cool. I'm not arguing that. My thing is, people know there's a very large black community in HR, but they're not interested nor care to know more than that. That's truly what "lack of representation" means. Knowing you exist, but that's it.
Okay to be fair the title and the OP post are slightly different.
I think I’m arguing more in the title and your talking more about the post. Which is probably a better way to go about it.
And the term “similar proportions” could be used to refer to percentage rather than raw number which make sense given most of the cities we’ve discussed here and that raw number varies a lot even in the group listed. If it’s similar proportions then Boston certainly counts as do other cities in southern New England. Raw number definition is very different.
Either way I would agree Milwaukee HR and Boston are all underrepresented. difference is MKE and Boston are more unknown especially give MKEs black % in the city, and Boston given the # and history, but yes Hampton Roads, for its size, is indeed a bit quiet in pop culture. Honestly the area is more notable for athletics.
I still think when it comes to things and people that get to “represent” Boston it’s far more white than it is in reality. Media in general is more than a little hesitant to use anything or anyone black from Boston to represent Boston.
Being recognized by the national cognizant and having a distinguishable black identity are different in my book. The latter being a bit deeper and extending beyond acknowledgement.
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