Philadelphia surpasses Chicago as the 2nd largest downtown in the US! (living, state)
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Philly doesn't have much of a downtown area right now for tourists since the Mall is still under construction along with other projects going on right now in the center of downtown.
Philly doesn't have much of a downtown area right now for tourists since the Mall is still under construction along with other projects going on right now in the center of downtown.
This statement clearly shows you don't know much about or have never been to downtown Philly.
This statement clearly shows you don't know much about or have never been to downtown Philly.
I live in Philly and market street from 8th to 13th needs a serious makeover. The highlight of center city to me is from 15th and walnut to 20th and walnut.
Tried it centered around the Near North (the highest residential concentration) as in Philly City Hall is roughly the center of residential density.
Here is an example at roughly Chicago/Lasalle: http://mcdc.missouri.edu/cgi-bin/bro...blocks&_debug=
1 sq mile: 40,118 residents, 39383 ppsm
2 sq mile: 67,248 residents, 35891 ppsm
3 sq mile: 87,891 residents, 33,231 ppsm
At 5 sq mi a large segment of your area is in the Lake Michigan, while the entire Philly area is still downtown but even so, you get about 110,000.
I'm not sharing this to cherry pick, just to illustrate the residential core of Chicago is more centered around the Near North Side, and the density and population of that area is much higher than the Loop. And all of these numbers are likely under counting a fair bit given the 45,000 people who have moved to the central core of Chicago since 2010.
It also is completely skipping large swaths of the remainder of the high density urban core extending along the Lake in a 1 mile wide ribbon for another 5+miles north that is contiguous and feels as dense and urban as most "downtowns." There are 160,000 people in Lake View and Lincoln Park, who are living a downtown, fully urban lifestyle. And they are contigous and directly connected to the central core, even if they are not counted as such. And this really effects how Chicago feels in terms of scale. If Center City Philly ever really grows contiguously with vibrant neighborhoods all of the way through the Great Northeast (the way it was when my parents grew up) then it will be similar.
I don't think anyone ever thought differently. Downtown is downtown regardless of where residential population centers exist. This is one of the reasons Philadelphia has had a larger downtown when considering residential population, at least historically. I think just the title of this thread makes people upset because Chicago is the larger city, but people who don't know Philly don't realize just how populated our downtown is.
whatever the definition or name this criteria was really what city has more residents that live within two miles of city hall (a proxy for a center of DT)
is probably accurate as Philly has always had a large DT population relative to many other cities and has always acted like a day and night neighborhood, moreso than most DTs
Chicago has a bigger DT and is a bigger city
Exactly. I could have stopped around downtown borders, but when you look at just how populated Center City is and how that population continues almost uninterrupted into surrounding neighborhoods, it's really a very cohesive centralized city. San Fran is probably the best comparison to Philly's residential and its cohesiveness (exceeding our density in the core), and Boston is probably right behind it. Chicago may become moreso, but the function and build of the Loop will always be different in a lot of ways IMO.
I live in Philly and market street from 8th to 13th needs a serious makeover. The highlight of center city to me is from 15th and walnut to 20th and walnut.
If you live here then you probably already know that that makeover is literally happening right now. The Gallery, 12th and Market, a new proposed building at the empty lot on 13th and market (NW corner). In three years, it will be very different.
The worst portion of Market is at 8th IMO. That is one massive hole that needs to be filled.
I don't think anyone ever thought differently. Downtown is downtown regardless of where residential population centers exist. This is one of the reasons Philadelphia has had a larger downtown when considering residential population, at least historically. I think just the title of this thread makes people upset because Chicago is the larger city, but people who don't know Philly don't realize just how populated our downtown is.
The dispute is that we are not measuring "downtowns" we are measuring a radius from City Hall, which does not equal "downtown" for either city. I'm not from either city, and have no horse in this race, just calling the inaccuracies where I see them.
I live in Philly and market street from 8th to 13th needs a serious makeover. The highlight of center city to me is from 15th and walnut to 20th and walnut.
Hmm... if you did live in Philadelphia, you would know that Market Street between 8th and 13th is currently undergoing a huge transformation. The Gallery on the North side of Market street between 9th and 11th is being completely redeveloped into a luxury retail and entertainment Mall. The East Market development between 11th and 12th on the South side of the street is drastically changing the area with two highrise buildings. There is also a 38 story office tower proposed for the parking lot at the corner of 13th and Market.
When all is said and done, that will literally leave only 3 blocks along the South side of Market between 8th and 11th that need redevelopment.
Hmm... if you did live in Philadelphia, you would know that Market Street between 8th and 13th is currently undergoing a huge transformation. The Gallery on the North side of Market street between 9th and 11th is being completely redeveloped into a luxury retail and entertainment Mall. The East Market development between 11th and 12th on the South side of the street is drastically changing the area with two highrise buildings. There is also a 38 story office tower proposed for the parking lot at the corner of 13th and Market.
When all is said and done, that will literally leave only 3 blocks along the South side of Market between 8th and 11th that need redevelopment.
That's why I said right now downtown Philadelphia can't be compared to downtown Chicago because it's too many projects that are not complete yet. The corner of 12th and market should look nice once the wawa is finished.
The dispute is that we are not measuring "downtowns" we are measuring a radius from City Hall, which does not equal "downtown" for either city. I'm not from either city, and have no horse in this race, just calling the inaccuracies where I see them.
Here are a couple snaps from Center City. City Hall is behind the dark tower to the very right of pic 1.
This is about 1/2 mile of Phillys 4 mile linear skyline but its the central core. 1/2 of these buildings are office 1/2 are residential. And the 4 story townhomes are seamless and go on for miles.
Quiet as kept 50,000 more people (100,000 when colleges are in session) should be added to Phillys downtown population. As University City and Center City are intertwined.
Close to 200,000 people live in UC and Center City from Sep to May. In about 4 -5 sq miles. Not that far off from Manhattan density figures.
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