Pittsburgh vs. Atlanta (metropolitan, life, Boston, cons)
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1. Atlanta and Pittsburgh both look to be pretty cool cities. Obviously each has different things going for them. I prefer Pittsburgh, but that is based upon what I like.
2. In the interest of fairness, if were adding Midtown on to Atlanta, I think Oakland should also be considered a part of Pittsburgh, as it is actually about a mile closer than Midtown is to DT ATL. The Midtown area is likely my favorite portion of near Atlanta areas, but Oakland might also be Pittsburgh's best asset. The fact that Pittsburgh, at around 2.7 (?) in the metro can go head to head or possibly supercede Atlanta at 6.2 when it comes to higher education is undeniably impressive, since I really do believe that per capita matters, which is why the CBD job numbers that were listed were so impressive. There's also UPMC, many workforces, etc. Quite frankly, though I enjoy Midtown, Oakland is one of the prettier places both for architecture and scenic views in the entire country. Heck, the Great Allegheny Passage starts literally across the bridge from this neighborhood. Another point worth noting in Oakland's favor is that it has a feeling of safety and comfort very, very, rarely felt in American cities. I'm no expert, but I'd imagine the Public Schools in the Oakland neighborhood of Pittsburgh top any in Atlanta proper. It has a "Northern Europe", level of urban safety IMO.
3. Culturally, Pittsburgh does likely win. I mean culture does have a broad scope. But, with the likes of the Cathedral of Learning, Carnegie Museums of Art and Natural History and Library, Fallingwater (I feel like this belongs in the discussion), Cathedral of Learning, Warhol Museum, National Aviary, Phipps Conservatory, Pittsburgh Symphony at the Heinz etc., I'm not sure that Atlanta's quite matches up, though it has more of the touristy type of museums (World of Coca Cola, CNN, COF HOB), and the Fernbank and Carlos museums near Emory's campus appear to be pretty nice.
4. Also, I think that just because a city is bigger, or even "more important" GDP wise, doesn't necessarily make it a better place to live (EG, Would you rather live in Rio de Janiero or Helsinki)? I know that's an extreme example, but still.
The great equalizer here IMO for Atlanta is that while Pittsburgh's immediate topography is prettier, Atlanta has the benefit of being located less than 2 hours away from Brasstown Bald. While all nature is nice, that is one of the more awestriking natural spots on the East Coast. It also has the positive effect for Atlanta residents that they can enjoy a relatively modest winter, and then (particularly if they are in education or another field that has a more relaxed summer schedule), they can easily escape at least for weekends, or even for weeks at a time to a place where temperatures are very mild and comfortable.
Midtown Atlanta abuts Downtown. In that picture Joe posted above, the tallest building in the middle and everything to the right is Midtown. Everything immediately to the left is Downtown. It's not "near Atlanta." Midtown and Downtown (everything in that picture) are the core. If Oakland abuts Downtown Pittsburgh and forms part of its core, include it.
Atlanta doesn't have 6.2 million people yet. The metro is about 5.5. But if you want to include the CSA (I typically don't because I don't like CSAs), then Atlanta can also claim UGA. Add that to Emory, Georgia Tech, Georgia State, Morehouse, and Spelman, and a very strong argument can be made for Atlanta in higher education.
I'll add the National Center for Civil and Human Rights and the Jimmy Carter Presidential Library to your list of Atlanta museums. Not all of them are lightweight.
Pittsburgh seems like a very pretty city and one that I would like to see. But, can anyone explain why, with everything the city seems to have going for it, the population has plummeted and is more or less now stagnant? At its nadir, the city of Atlanta lost about 100,000 residents, but that's nothing compared to Pittsburgh losing over half of its peak population.
Midtown Atlanta abuts Downtown. In that picture Joe posted above, the tallest building in the middle and everything to the right is Midtown. Everything immediately to the left is Downtown. It's not "near Atlanta." Midtown and Downtown (everything in that picture) are the core. If Oakland abuts Downtown Pittsburgh and forms part of its core, include it.
Atlanta doesn't have 6.2 million people yet. The metro is about 5.5. But if you want to include the CSA (I typically don't because I don't like CSAs), then Atlanta can also claim UGA. Add that to Emory, Georgia Tech, Georgia State, Morehouse, and Spelman, and a very strong argument can be made for Atlanta in higher education.
I'll add the National Center for Civil and Human Rights and the Jimmy Carter Presidential Library to your list of Atlanta museums. Not all of them are lightweight.
Pittsburgh seems like a very pretty city and one that I would like to see. But, can anyone explain why, with everything the city seems to have going for it, the population has plummeted and is more or less now stagnant? At its nadir, the city of Atlanta lost about 100,000 residents, but that's nothing compared to Pittsburgh losing over half of its peak population.
The High Museum also wasn't mentioned...Atlanta's premier art museum and the leading museum in the Southeast. Grammy Award-winning Atlanta Symphony should be mentioned as well, along with the Atlanta History Center, the Atlanta Cyclorama, Callanwolde, Millennium Gate, the many historic home museums like the Margaret Mitchell House the Swan House, and Herndon Home, the internationally acclaimed Center for Puppetry Arts, and dozens of other local/regional/national museums. That just touches on culture, leaving out festivals, live theater, the film industry, ethnic and gay culture, architecture, and so on. I think often size does matter when it comes to culture, and of course quality matters too. But the culture discussion is purely subjective and every person has a different idea of which city is best.
Last edited by JoeTarheel; 07-25-2015 at 05:26 PM..
Pemgin: It's hard to say with Pittsburgh since they each kinda have a different grid set up. I can tell you from looking at Google Maps that after the CBD is Duquesne (right across from the Duquesne Incline/Carson Street), the acclaimed UPMC, and a dense looking area called Uptown, followed by the Oakland section. Still less than 2 miles though, so even though I've had little experience with Pittsburgh, I'm guessing the transition is pretty seamless, it seems to be.
Ah ok... yeah I think 6.2 was the CSA numbers. And I guess I could've phrased that better. I'd say that Atlanta as a whole is probably the leading higher education market in the southeast (including Houston). But, I would say that Pittsburgh's is relatively comparable, which isn't so much a knock on Atlanta, as it is remarkable on Pittsburgh's part. It's a place I've looked, being in higher ed/student affairs, because with so many schools/good schools in that market, someone is likely always hiring, and some jobs may not get as much attention since there is such a wealth of them in a metro area that I think is severely undervalued in it's perception.
Both: I'll add to your addings. I thoroughly enjoyed the MLK Center/Ebenezer Church when I visited it, very moving. While it's cool I suppose that the area is gentrifying, I hope it retains some of it's character. I also want to add that one of the big disappointments of my most recent stop through the city was that I got to Kennesaw Mountain Battlefield Park about ten minutes after it closed, and my family wasn't willing to wait for me to hike to the top for the view... At least we got The Varsity though. Is the NCCHR good? I know it's new. I visited the Carter home, but likewise there? (I'm assuming it's good since presidential libraries normally are).
As to your point about population plummet, it's not a problem that's unique to Pittsburgh. If you look at many cities across that section of the country, they were the absolute center of white flight, and that did a number on many of them, much moreso than in other regions. Actually, I think if you look at those regions metro populations, you would see little change, even during those tough years. These cities so uniquely relied upon a single industry. Pittsburgh was steel, Detroit was auto, and Cleveland was oil/eventually a hodgepodge of everything. When those started to die out and get shipped overseas, of course those cities were hit hardest, since they were the producers of well, everything. Because of that, the cities (well at least Cleveland and Pittsburgh, though Detroit is on it's way) reinvented themselves to focus on transitioning into service sector economies. THAT was when the stream happened. You also now have many many baby boomers reaching retirement age, and because herd mentality/I think older people are more temperature sensitive, streaming into Florida. So basically, you still have a trickle/slight decline in population there, because uneducated people and older people are moving out, which offsets any brain gain. Which there is a lot. I believe Pittsburgh at some points has been number one in brain gain. So, the area still probably has about ten years of losing population, but especially as generations change, those numbers will start to also. I suppose that was a bit long but at least that's my theory lol.
That's interesting JTH, I had actually heard mixed reviews/it was average about the High, and more attention had been given under my impression to the Carlos. If the High is better than what I have heard, then Atlanta is actually looking pretty attractive to me. I had already seen it as competing with NOLA and Tampa to be the South's cultural "Second City" after Houston. I'm sure that Atlanta has a burgeoning TV/Entertainment industry, and also is a center of music as well, though I don't know how much of that is put back in for daily citizens to enjoy. While I have always wanted to move back from Florida to the north, one of my challenges has been that my fiance absolutely cannot tolerate cold weather. Atlanta does seem to provide many northern amenities though. While the whole family thing would be tough... If Emory (one of my dream schools) ever were to give me an opportunity, I would be up there in a flash.
You're right about many cities losing population...the city limits of Atlanta did for a couple of decades but luckily it didn't continue and the population is almost where it was at it's peak in 1970. Pittsburgh has really bounced back from catastrophic losses and is very impressive to be where it is today.
I also agree about being on par with Atlanta in education. Pittsburgh has some amazing universities for a city it's size, lining up well with the top 3: Pitt, Carnegie Mellon and Duquesne vs. Emory, Georgia Tech, and Georgia State...and then the large number of quality regional/liberal arts/community and community colleges. Atlanta having the top ranked women's and men's HBCUs may push it over the edge (Morehouse and Spelman).
If the High is better than what I have heard, then Atlanta is actually looking pretty attractive to me. I had already seen it as competing with NOLA and Tampa to be the South's cultural "Second City" after Houston. I'm sure that Atlanta has a burgeoning TV/Entertainment industry, and also is a center of music as well, though I don't know how much of that is put back in for daily citizens to enjoy.
Very much. Many famous local artists choose Atlanta for impromptu or special occasion performances & events.
I just saw both recently. Pittsburgh is a pretty city, I thoroughly enjoyed the time I spent there but Atlanta goes without saying is a city in a higher tier. It simply offers more, has more late night options, more places to be out at night, has really nice city parks and is no slouch with its own topography. Its weather is better than Pittsburgh's, certainly.
Atlanta for me, just Hartsfield-Jackson International by itself secured that, for me anyways.
As for the OP, since you are thinking about your family and things like schools and neighborhoods are important to you, I'm sure you could find comparable areas near both cities. So literally could decide off preference and/or amenities offered from there.
I think everyone has different preferences. Certainly Atlanta has a bigger city feel, and the airport is a plus if you want to be traveling a lot. I'm guessing Atlanta has more late night options just by basis of it's sheer size. Did you see Schenley Park or Great Allegheny Passage during your time in Pitt? To me that's about as unbelievable as it gets as far as nature that close to the city.
I think everyone has different preferences. Certainly Atlanta has a bigger city feel, and the airport is a plus if you want to be traveling a lot. I'm guessing Atlanta has more late night options just by basis of it's sheer size. Did you see Schenley Park or Great Allegheny Passage during your time in Pitt? To me that's about as unbelievable as it gets as far as nature that close to the city.
I have never seen Schenley Park or Great Allegheny Passage, but I'm betting that Piedmont or Chastain Park and the Silver Comet Trail or the PATH Foundation trails might possibly compete with them.
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Downtown to the right, Midtown to the left...connected by the Atlanta's tallest:
